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Didn't know that - you get a Yuengling.I knew the camp was there from the War between the States but not the structure

They need to give marketing a big raise.

marketing and promotional deals is how Ford/GM/Chrysler sell most of their cars. People don't really want them. Most of the times it's all they can afford or they just get a great deal. If you ask someone to name a car they REALLY want, they'd LOVE to buy if money wasn't an issue- no one is buying any of their cars.
You see that especially in Michigan, where just about everyone has a hook up for some crazy employee pricing lease deal. That's why you only see GM/Ford/Chrysler cars in Michigan mostly. Go to another state in another region of the country where they can't get those kind of crazy deals and you see more foreign cars than domestic.

GM sold 8.4 million vehicles worldwide in 2018.  That's doing remarkably well if they sell shitty products.


They are hanging in there on profit as well.  

GM sold 8.4 million vehicles worldwide in 2018.  That's doing remarkably well if they sell shitty products.


They are hanging in there on profit as well.  

They aren't doing remarkably well, their sales were down across the board around the world in 2018 and it's trending that way again in 2019. And those numbers are currently good for 4th place Worldwide and they are on pace for 5th place worldwide. Hyundai is in 5th place right on their heels, Hyundai's sales were up 2% in 2018 while GM's were down 4%. In a year or two Hyundai will lap them for 4th place and GM will be 5th place world wide. Whoopdie fricken doo. Let's give them a real pat on the back for being the 4th place auto company on their way to 5th place in the world. They were the largest company in the entire world. Not auto company. Company. Period. For decades. And for decades more than 50% of all car sales in the US were GM. Now they are barely hanging onto 16 ish % US marketshare and Toyota is right on their ass with 15%. They had every advantage and opportunity in the world to change and adapt and be cutting edge and create new and innovative products that people loved. And they shit the bed at every single turn and they continue to shit the bed.

Btw a lot of GM world wide sales is bolstered by China- where they actually sell more cars there than they do in the states. And they have to share half that profit with Chinese state owned entities. And their car business is cratering in China right now. Most of their brands are down 30% in sales there. And the morons already shared all their tech with the Chinese, and in 10 1/2 years when all new auto in China will have to be EVs they are going to be left holding the bag with nothing to show. Wholly owned Chinese companies and Tesla and the Japanese and Europeans will dominate that market and GM will be left holding their pricks.

The are doing "remarkably well if they sell shitty products".

Context is important.

They are doing "OK" in absolute terms.  They intend to sell fewer vehicles at higher profit margins.

Anyway, I don't see anything unique or world beating about the Tesla battery.  Looks to me like a lot of competition is about to hit.

If you don't see anything unique or world beating about Tesla, than man, I don't know what to tell you. You really need to go drive one with the Ludicrous mode or drive the Model X with the falcon wing doors. They aren't just the best EVs you can buy, they are flat out some of the coolest, best peforming cars you can buy period.

Tesla has a huge advantage with their batteries and the cost they pay for them. How about it's currently $3,500 cheaper with better performance than the Porsche/Audi PPE platform that is still at least 2 years out- probably longer. That cost advantage for Tesla is only going to get bigger over time. Not smaller. They only have the gigafactory battery plant up and running in Nevada and they are building another battery factory/car factory in China right now.

Looks to me like they are way ahead of the competition. By a lot. And oh yeah, did I mention Tesla's customer retention rate is out of this world. By far the best in the industry. More than 80% of the time a Tesla owner goes to replace his car or buy a 2nd new car he buys a Tesla. That kind of customer loyalty in the car business is unheard of.

Porsche Taycan Pre-orders about 20,000. Same for Audi e-tron. Tesla Model 3 pre-orders? 500,000. The new $200,000 Roadster pre-order? 100,000 people tried pre-ordering one and they were only letting the first 1,000 pre-order it- and it crashed their website. They have a fan base and a following that other car companies can only dream of having. 100,000 people tried pre-ordering a $200,000 car. Porsche barely took 20,000 pre-orders for their Taycan. They don't have competition.

At one point--oh, 6-8 years ago, I think--GM was selling one car model at a profit: the Corvette.  Everything else was losing money or being kept afloat by government subsidies.

You could take that as good news or bad news.  The bad news is how incompetent GM had to be at that time.  The good news is that it is at least somewhat better now.

Tesla will be forgotten soon enough.

Lmao. Great observation. You sound like that moron Bob Lutz.
You do realize that the Model 3 was the best selling car in the US in 2018 in terms of revenue and the #3 best selling car overall period, right?
You do realize that the Tesla Model S has been by far the best selling full size luxury sedan in the US in 2016, 2017, and 2018. 3 years straight, it has crushed the MB S Class, BMW 7 Series, Audi A8, Lexus LS, and Porsche Panamera. The Model S just absolutely crushes those cars in sales. And it is not even remotely close. They outsell most of those cars...COMBINED. And the Model S isn't a new model like the 3, it's been around since 2011. So whoops- there goes that theory that they'll be forgotten soon.
Don't take my word on Tesla's superiority over it's "competitors" though. Take renowned auto engineer Sandy Munro....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVnRQRdePp4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DucRxWz_58

Oh yeah, forgot to mention- Tesla has a HUGE advantage over all of it's competitors in autonomous driving. 1.1 BILLION real world miles of driving data for it's AI to learn from. Not bullshit simulation miles like Google's operation Waymo. Waymo doesn't even have 13 million real world miles driven. Tesla has 100x the data of REAL WORLD miles.

Oh yeah, also forgot to mention. The Model S gross margins were 20% when the car based at $100,000. The car now bases at $85,000 and their gross margins are up to 31%. Prices dropped and their margins went up. They'll be able to do the same thing with the Model 3 over time and sell a shit ton of them.