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Topic: Maryland regents recommend reinstating Durkin, Loh fires him next day.

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bayareabadger

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #56 on: August 14, 2018, 02:17:46 PM »
Quote from: bwarbiany on August 14, 2018, 01:46:22 PM
Perhaps, but perhaps not. What if it actually WASN'T the fault of the program that the kid died? What if they did all the correct things, and it was just a tragedy?
These things do happen. Football is a strenuous and dangerous game. Whenever something like this happens, some people are out for blood, to find someone to blame. Sometimes it's just crap luck. We as people don't want to admit that because then it forces us to realize that such things could happen to us, or to our kids, just as easily as it happened to this player. But that still doesn't mean that the coaches were at fault.
I wasn't there, and so I'm just looking at this from the outside. So I'm not going to form an opinion on it either way. I don't have enough data to do so.
But I do want to highlight that you're begging the question. In your question, you're assuming that something should change as a result of this death. And that if nothing changes, then outrage is warranted.
In real life, I often tend to go that way actually. Like was what he was doing THAT above and beyond? Was he not built well enough? Are any of us?
But here’s the thing, if that’s the case and you don’t think something should change, you gotta shout why from the dang rooftops. And you explain why and make it clear, to cut off outrage. 
(It also speaks to the fact dynamics in sports are both strange and apart from normal society. And when those standards of interaction are held up, there often will be some friction)
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Entropy

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #57 on: August 14, 2018, 02:24:10 PM »
Quote from: JerseyTerrapin on August 14, 2018, 01:59:54 PM
No ironclad proof, I can't know what they were thinking.  But it's awfully strange that while they claim to have "sat in the student union looking for players to interview..." they only encountered ones with caustic opinions that fit the tone of the story.  Yet almost immediately, current players came out of the woodwork to contest  the story.
But what's done is done.  The important thing is that there is accountability for what happened to Jordan if mistakes were made and protocol not followed.  99.9% (not 100, sadly) of Maryland fans that I'm in contact with feel the same way.  
the speed suggests either they have overwhelming ammo or they are making an emotional reaction.   Based upon the Maryland fans comments on this thread, it seems like an emotional one.  That said, it has to be tough.  A kid died and it doesn't appear to have happened on accident.  
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SFBadger96

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #58 on: August 14, 2018, 02:26:12 PM »
An article in the Washington Post made it sound as though there are very real questions about why it took so long to start the body-temperature cooling protocols.

As for "toxicity," there are disgruntled people everywhere, and happy people (for whom the system is working) everywhere. The existence of either doesn't prove or disprove whether the culture is toxic.
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bayareabadger

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #59 on: August 14, 2018, 02:33:23 PM »
Quote from: Entropy on August 14, 2018, 02:13:27 PM
rolltide.. it always amazes me how many people don't believe it.    ESPNU is basically the SECNetwork's second channel.   Internet is full of examples of ESPN article titles, turning top 5's into top 6 lists, memo's for SEC teams or divisions when you don't memo others.....

again, I'd do the same.  It's their #1 investment in College sports.  Promote it.   Push it.   Again,... It's your #1 investment in College sports.  It would be stupid not to promote it.   But don't pretend it is not happening.

And they would want to promote by devaluing down other investments? It’s almost as if we want to find things that make us feel put upon. 
By my math, the Big Ten gets the third-most money from ESPN, mostly becuase ESPN has all rights from the SEC and ACC. It would make more sense to target the Big 12 and PAC-12, unless this is someone playing out an imaginary war between two conferences. 
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Entropy

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #60 on: August 14, 2018, 02:38:12 PM »
I never said they shouldn't cover news.  I never stated that.  I did say it is doesn't feel equal... and even explained my agreement on perceptions and how we are wired.,.. and I could be wrong.   I guess I need to restate that...

I do firmly stand on the concept that they promote their largest investment more than others.    In any business, not all investments are equal.   If they don't, they're flat out dumb.  I did make that statement (maybe off topic) and I'm not moving from it...

:)
« Last Edit: August 14, 2018, 03:02:34 PM by Entropy »
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Anonymous Coward

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #61 on: August 14, 2018, 03:16:30 PM »
It was nice to see how heartfelt the administrators were about their interactions with this Jordan McNair's parents. Still, I'm surprised they called a press conference and didn't declare Durkin was fired. Not that I wanted that (I have no idea what justice is here), but the heuristics seemed to line up to predict it strongly.
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ELA

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #62 on: August 14, 2018, 03:48:46 PM »
Quote from: Anonymous Coward on August 14, 2018, 03:16:30 PM
It was nice to see how heartfelt the administrators were about their interactions with this Jordan McNair's parents. Still, I'm surprised they called a press conference and didn't declare Durkin was fired. Not that I wanted that (I have no idea what justice is here), but the heuristics seemed to line up to predict it strongly.
I also thought that was odd.  Doesn't make it the wrong call, just weird.  I am envious that Maryland, unlike MSU, appears to have competent leadership for this.
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JerseyTerrapin

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #63 on: August 14, 2018, 03:57:36 PM »
Quote from: ELA on August 14, 2018, 03:48:46 PM
I also thought that was odd.  Doesn't make it the wrong call, just weird.  I am envious that Maryland, unlike MSU, appears to have competent leadership for this.
I don't really feel that way, ELA.  Remember, this happened way back at Memorial Day.  It was tricky because the McNairs hired an antagonistic attorney, but even so,  I think they could have handled it much better.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2018, 04:21:24 PM by JerseyTerrapin »
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mcwterps1

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #64 on: August 14, 2018, 04:17:22 PM »
Yeah, I still think this is a botched issue.

You announce that Rick Court is no longer with the program, but he was the main guy behind the "toxic culture" accusations. He honestly had nothing to do with Jordan McNair.

Now the three trainers who have been with the program since Ralph was in place, are on leave, but they deserve the full brunt of this, because they didn't follow protocols.

I'm still of the belief that DJ Durkin needs to get back on the field as soon as possible.

However, with the release of Rick Court, it would appear that DJ's on The Chopping Block.

Just sickening.
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FearlessF

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #65 on: August 14, 2018, 06:00:42 PM »
so, there are two issues here that are related

the death of a player issue and the toxic culture issue
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"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

HailHailMSP

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #66 on: August 14, 2018, 06:22:47 PM »
Many Univeristy Presidents and Administrators will be measured to this one in the future. Honest, candid, and sincere. Met with the family and quickly closed the loop with the public and media.

Well managed, for today at least. 
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HailHailMSP

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #67 on: August 14, 2018, 06:30:51 PM »
Quote from: FearlessF on August 14, 2018, 06:00:42 PM
so, there are two issues here that are related

the death of a player issue and the toxic culture issue
And oddly, as I noted in a previous post when death or significant health issues have come up, rarely does anyone get fired. The Iowa strength & conditioning coach, who sent 12 players into full rhabdo, some with kidney failure, is one of Fwrentz’s most valued staffers, making over $500k for the Hawkeyes. Brian Kelly put a kid up on a scissor lift to film in 30-40mph winds and the kid died. As far as I know, no one lost a job at Notre Dame.
Meanwhile, when the far more ambiguous “culture” issues arise you end up on the street like Leach or Kevin Wilson.
I’m oversimplifying, but Durkin’s job is on the line for the culture issues now.
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ELA

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #68 on: August 14, 2018, 06:32:03 PM »
Quote from: JerseyTerrapin on August 14, 2018, 03:57:36 PM
I don't really feel that way, ELA.  Remember, this happened way back at Memorial Day.  It was tricky because the McNairs hired an antagonistic attorney, but even so,  I think they could have handled it much better.
Perhaps, but today's PC was better than anything I've seen MSU do
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Hawkinole

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Re: Maryland said to have toxic football culture - ESPN
« Reply #69 on: August 15, 2018, 01:12:04 AM »
Quote from: Anonymous Coward on August 14, 2018, 03:16:30 PM
It was nice to see how heartfelt the administrators were about their interactions with this Jordan McNair's parents. Still, I'm surprised they called a press conference and didn't declare Durkin was fired. Not that I wanted that (I have no idea what justice is here), but the heuristics seemed to line up to predict it strongly.
Quote
Perhaps, but today's PC was better than anything I've seen MSU do
We should all endeavor to handle difficult situations as was done here. It is hard to do.
University of Maryland president Dr. Loh is a worldly guy, with a heady Wikipedia biography worth reading. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallace_Loh
He has connections to Iowa having graduated from one of the top undergraduate colleges in the country, Grinnell College. He also graduated from Michigan, Cornell, and Yale, too. He is a past University of Iowa provost.
He obviously has high academic achievement, and after viewing the University of Maryland press conference:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7q5wEOaI3w on display is a man of high integrity, accepting legal and moral responsibility by the University for its training staff. Dr. Loh is a man of high social intelligence. He is speaking with no notes, in a structured manner, on very serious topics.
Dr. Loh is the one who took a leadership role bringing Maryland into the Big Ten; based on his experiences in Iowa and Michigan, I am sure he was convinced this was best for his University.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2018, 02:09:10 AM by Hawkinole »
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