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Topic: Paul Chryst

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ELA

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #28 on: November 20, 2017, 03:33:16 PM »
Give it to Chryst.  People expected Wisconsin to win the west, but NOBODY expected them to go undefeated in the process.
Really?  Nobody?
https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?topic=238.0

847badgerfan

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #29 on: November 20, 2017, 03:54:16 PM »
when he beats the boat rower for an undefeated reg season, and wins the Big Ten Champ game to get to the playoff, and wins at least the semi in the playoff to get the the BIG GAME
that's when
If he wins the grand prize in a few weeks, of course he'll be seen as one of the elite coaches, perhaps even better than Harbaugh
OK, so when Harbaugh accomplishes all this, will Harbaugh be seen as being better than Harbaugh too?

:67:
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grillrat

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #30 on: November 20, 2017, 04:10:28 PM »
Really?  Nobody?
https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?topic=238.0
Sure, but let's throw in your Purdue predictions at the same time and see how it averages out.   :96:

TresselownsUM

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #31 on: November 20, 2017, 04:22:03 PM »
Give it to Chryst.  People expected Wisconsin to win the west, but NOBODY expected them to go undefeated in the process.

agree, I heard a number of people think it was definitely obtainable before the season.

preseason the toughest road game was probably Nebraska, toughest home game UM.

looking at where we are now, wiscy has/had 5 road games against teams with a combined 19-38 record. toughest road game was probably IU and toughest home game northwestern.

I would guess even the most modest Wisconsin fan would be upset with a loss this year to anyone on that schedule.


medinabuckeye1

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #32 on: November 20, 2017, 04:51:49 PM »
I guess OSU coaches are ineligible due to undefeated expectations every year?
This has been covered but yes. 
As for this year, I think Ash should get serious consideration.  The award is basically "Coach whose team most exceeded expectations" I think that is Ash.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #33 on: November 20, 2017, 05:02:14 PM »
He's 11-0 with the weakest schedule of any major P5 team in the nation.

According to Sagarin, UW's schedule ranks 55. Michigan's is 45 due a boost from yesterday.

Bama's is 63. Washington is 58. LSU is 57. Colley ranks are similar. AH are similar. And on and on.

A pattern is developing?? Quit while you're behind, perhaps?
I'm not buying what you are selling.  
I've been saying for weeks now that if I were grading B1G teams my grade for Wisconsin would be "Incomplete".  
Per our current rankings, Wisconsin's most difficult road game was against #9 Nebraska.  
Number of tougher road games than that  and record in those games for top-7 B1G teams:
  • UW:  0
  • tOSU:  2, 0-1 (@Michigan to be played)
  • PSU:  4, 2-2
  • MSU:  3, 1-2
  • NU:  1, 0-1
  • M:  3, 1-2
  • Iowa:  3, 0-3

Note that the other six have all played at least one tougher road game than Wisconsin's toughest and none of them have a winning record in such games with only PSU  even managing .500.  

It isn't Wisconsin's fault that three of four best teams in the league are in the B1G-E and that they miss all three or that they happen to get every decent conference opponent at home this year.  It also isn't their fault that BYU completely tanked this year but these are still facts.  Wisconsin has a shockingly easy schedule this year and that makes it very difficult to assess the quality of this Badger squad.  

grillrat

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #34 on: November 20, 2017, 05:06:34 PM »
Are we reaaaalllllllly sure that three of the four best teams are in the east?  I mean, according to the transitive property, Purdue is like 50 points better than OSU when comparing their Iowa scores.

(...and before you go there, No, the Rutgers and Nebraska transitive properties are invalid.....because I said so.)

:)

847badgerfan

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #35 on: November 20, 2017, 05:11:21 PM »
All road games are tough. I don't care who the other team is.

Also, I didn't make up the SOS rankings by the computer geeks I referenced.

So, I am not trying to sell anything. I made the post to refute the claim that UW's SOS was the worst of all the P5 schools. It isn't.
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medinabuckeye1

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #36 on: November 20, 2017, 05:15:19 PM »
Are we reaaaalllllllly sure that three of the four best teams are in the east?  I mean, according to the transitive property, Purdue is like 50 points better than OSU when comparing their Iowa scores.

(...and before you go there, No, the Rutgers and Nebraska transitive properties are invalid.....because I said so.)

:)
Well, no.  It is entirely possible that the three best teams are in the B1G-E ;)
I'm using Power Rankings votes and I agree with it.  
FWIW:  I've said it before but IMHO the problem with the transitive property isn't that the concept is bad, the problem is lack of data.  Example:
According to scores against Ohio State, Iowa is 76 points better than Michigan State.  But Michigan State beat Iowa H2H by a TD.  The problem here is that Iowa was Ohio State's worst and Michigan State was Ohio State's best game.  If you look at all of Iowa/MSU's common opponents you get a better picture:
  • Ohio State:  Iowa is lots better
  • Penn State:  MSU is slightly better
  • Northwestern:  Equal
  • Minnesota:  Iowa is slightly better
Three results suggest that the two teams are about equal and the other is clearly an outlier.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #37 on: November 20, 2017, 05:29:06 PM »
All road games are tough. I don't care who the other team is.

Also, I didn't make up the SOS rankings by the computer geeks I referenced.

So, I am not trying to sell anything. I made the post to refute the claim that UW's SOS was the worst of all the P5 schools. It isn't.
My objection to the SoS rankings is the same as my objection to your comment that "all road games are tough".  No, they aren't.  Some teams are not good enough to beat Wisconsin no matter where the game is played.  

Similarly, SoS rankings usually evaluate every game so that you get a bonus if you play (for example) team #75 instead of team #125.  
I disagree with this simply because if you are a P5 Divisional Champion and an 11-0 CFP contender there really isn't any appreciable difference between playing #125 at home and playing #75 on the road.  Either of those should be an EASY win.  

What Wisconsin lacks is tests against high-end opponents (their best is either Northwestern or Michigan) and particularly road tests against quality opponents (their best is either Nebraska or Indiana).  
« Last Edit: November 20, 2017, 05:38:50 PM by medinabuckeye1 »

CatsbyAZ

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #38 on: November 20, 2017, 05:36:11 PM »
When does PC start to get recognition as being among the best coaches in NCAA football? I noticed during the game yesterday the announcers fawning over Harbaugh and the TV showing his mug over and over and over again.

PC is a better coach, to anyone paying attention. He built a fantastic staff and that group has built a winner, top to bottom. They graduate their kids. They are humble to a fault. They love where they are.
Chryst is underpraised. His hiring felt underwhelming in a par-for-the-course kind of way; amongst Badger fans I remember hesitation about his 19-19 Pitt record and whether King Barry had taken the easy way out to avoid pursuing higher profile targets.


But name anybody whose done well at Pitt the last 20 years? Walt Harris was fired in the on a BCS Season, Dave W recruited lights out and put together a decent W/L record when his guys were in place and was still shown the door, Graham bolted for ASU after one year, and a sound hire in Narduzzi starts next season at the top of the hot seat rankings.

Chryst's knowledge of the program pre-hire has turned out invaluable. He knows how to recruit over the unpredictable admissions department hurdles and develops talent across the board rather than relying on boom-or-bust recruiting (Sumlin, Sarkisian, etc). And his unassuming beta personality puts him under the shadow of the type-As, which leads me to...

...as far as being the better coach than Harbaugh, Chryst is doing a better job at Wisconsin than Harbaugh is a Michigan, which is slightly more focused than flatly saying either the better coach. Harbaugh's elite knack was proven in 8 years in the Bay Area and it hasn't carried through for him in Ann Arbor. To liberally use a baseball analogy, comparing Chryst and Harbaugh is like comparing two different styles of hitting. Harbaugh is a homerun hitter who's been striking out lately against the power pitchers whereas Chryst is a dependable base hitter with the higher BA. A slugger as opposed to a hard out.

TresselownsUM

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #39 on: November 20, 2017, 05:50:37 PM »
Chryst's knowledge of the program pre-hire has turned out invaluable. He knows how to recruit over the unpredictable admissions department hurdles 

What are these hurdles you speak of?

847badgerfan

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #40 on: November 20, 2017, 06:21:00 PM »
Chryst's knowledge of the program pre-hire has turned out invaluable. He knows how to recruit over the unpredictable admissions department hurdles

What are these hurdles you speak of?
Wisconsin has extremely high admission standards, which includes test scores, core courses taken and GPA. They are generally looking for a B GPA minimum with the 18 required core courses (the latter being the biggest killer for kids they can't get admitted) combined with the test scores. They are much more selective then the minimum NCAA requirements.

It is next to impossible to get a kid from the JuCo ranks who would not have qualified out of HS. The ones they do get are the exception and in those cases (Van Ginkle on this team) only went to JuCo after playing a year at a 4 year school. A late-bloomer, so to speak.

BB understood it too.

The last coach did not get it and, of course, he didn't last. Not being able to get Chris Evans (lost to MSU) and Jordan Stevenson (lost to UNL) admitted were the last straws for him.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Paul Chryst
« Reply #41 on: November 20, 2017, 06:32:17 PM »
I agree with the proposition that Chryst has had a better run at Wisconsin than Harbaugh has had at Ttun. Two B1G West Titles vs three straight finishes of at least third place in the B1G East.

That said, Harbaugh clearly has the more impressive overall resume. Hands down.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2017, 06:34:50 PM by Brutus Buckeye »
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

 

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