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Topic: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #742 on: March 17, 2019, 08:10:30 PM »
Why are their projections any more questionable than anyone else's projections?

Whose projections are better, and what do they project?

Hawaii should be ideal for wind and solar, high cost as it is from burning oil and a lot of wind and sun.

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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #743 on: March 17, 2019, 08:11:47 PM »
We spent two weeks on Bonaire a few years back (one week too long IMHO).  We were warned that we'd have brownouts in the afternoon and evening because they don't have adequate baseline power capacity and depend pretty heavily on wind.  It was annoying.  We're spoiled.

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MrNubbz

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #744 on: March 17, 2019, 08:24:31 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on March 17, 2019, 10:37:05 AM
I doubt anyone's NG prices have tripled over the past few years.
Contraire Pierre,My prices with the added charges on NG that the PUCO allowed have implemented almost doubled.As a matter of fact the 1st year of deregulation in Ohio I believe it was 1999,Dominion East Ohio Gas assured its customers this was a good thing.So many of us stuck with the gas company.Up until 1999 my highest heating bill for a winter month was in the brutal 1994 winter it was 96.00 for a month.The winter of 1999 - 2000.I had two bills of 300.00 and one at 280.00.That winter was average temps.Cincy - if I could have gotten my hands on their CEO or the hacks at the regulatory commission I'd be typing this from the Big House - that was Government sanctioned robbery.There was a royal uproar.It gets too involved to keep typing.Just so happens before that winter I had all new windows and insulation blew in.Government can't keep letting Robber Barons literally fleece the proletariat
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Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

MichiFan87

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #745 on: March 17, 2019, 10:24:37 PM »
EIA projections are off because they're very conservative. There have been many articles written about it, but they have consistently underestimated the deployment of wind and solar along with the retirement rate of coal plants. Their methodology is rather flawed because it doesn't account for cost reductions for wind & solar or policy, they overestimate electricity demand (presumably because they don't account for energy efficiency improvements, though it will increase once EV sales take off).... To be fair, there isn't a concensus on what the most reputable forecast is.

Hawaii is ideal for solar and offshore wind, which is why they were the first state to have a 100% RPS.
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“When your team is winning, be ready to be tough, because winning can make you soft. On the other hand, when your team is losing, stick by them. Keep believing”
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CWSooner

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #746 on: March 18, 2019, 12:28:28 AM »
Anybody been to a wind farm?  They have some negative environmental impacts.  There's significant ecosystem degradation to the surface of the land on which they are built, and they kill a percentage of birds that migrate through their areas.
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Anonymous Coward

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #747 on: March 18, 2019, 02:00:53 AM »
I haven't walked around a wind farm but they're becoming so common that I've driven through countless. I've read of both problems. Those are obviously cons that have to be plugged into the cost-benefit analysis. The key step is to then compare them to the pros / cons for incinerating hydrocarbons.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2019, 02:06:10 AM by Anonymous Coward »
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847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #748 on: March 18, 2019, 07:50:25 AM »
Quote from: CWSooner on March 18, 2019, 12:28:28 AM
Anybody been to a wind farm?  They have some negative environmental impacts.  There's significant ecosystem degradation to the surface of the land on which they are built, and they kill a percentage of birds that migrate through their areas.
I've worked on several. They are pretty ugly. And then there's that flicker thing. NIMBY.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #749 on: March 18, 2019, 09:18:41 AM »
I was at a wind farm near Palm Springs, CA.  I noticed quite a high percentage of units (probably 10-15%) not functioning, and some (5% or so) obviously derelict, rusted with pieces lying around on the ground.  I was told it's cheaper to build a new one than fix an old one.  Our guide told us the main thing to fail is the transmission, which is a large part of the cost.  When it goes, they just leave the turbine out there doing nothing and build a new one for the tax credits.

He said GE was very bad about this.  I think part of the cost should be for clean up, if it breaks, you need to take it out.
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847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #750 on: March 18, 2019, 09:34:14 AM »
Yep, that stuff happens everywhere. With the lease rights as they are, the companies are free to do as they please on the leased properties. The farmers just have to deal with it.
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MrNubbz

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #751 on: March 18, 2019, 09:35:11 AM »
32 and snowing on the North Coast.Tribe Opens up 2 weeks from today.
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Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #752 on: March 18, 2019, 09:38:36 AM »
We are finally in a string of "normal" days here. It feels a whole lot better than 2 weeks ago. Damn.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #753 on: March 18, 2019, 10:47:47 AM »
Quote from: 847badgerfan on March 18, 2019, 09:34:14 AM
Yep, that stuff happens everywhere. With the lease rights as they are, the companies are free to do as they please on the leased properties. The farmers just have to deal with it.
It seems simple enough to me to require that money be set aside for eventual dismantling, and possibly for maintenance and repairs as needed.  We could end up with thousands of derelict and ugly wind turbines in short order.
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847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #754 on: March 18, 2019, 11:28:33 AM »
I did note while doing work on the recent application process for Illinois solar, it included a cost analysis. Demolition/decommissioning was a line item. So that's good, at least.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #755 on: March 18, 2019, 12:26:20 PM »
https://hardware.slashdot.org/story/18/07/13/2349236/retiring-worn-out-wind-turbines-could-cost-billions-that-nobody-has

I'd insist on having a trust fund funded up front with new turbine builders.  
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