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Topic: In other news ...

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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34104 on: July 10, 2024, 08:55:38 AM »
perhaps not even the number of mass shootings, but the number of people killed in mass shootings
This is a common feeling promoted by how he media report on "mass shootings", but it really is over stated, by a lot.  Indeed, in a few cases, a so called "assault weapon" is used in mass shootings, and the media gleefully point to that.  But in the vast majority of them, it's a 9 mm handgun, or similar, and the media don't say anything about it.

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S. | Pew Research Center

N
ow, couple this with the hard fact that there is nothing uniquely deadly about an AR-15 that cannot be mimicked with another less dangerous LOOKING rifle like the one below that fires the same round, just as quickly, same muzzle velocity, same deadly final result.



And of course the proposed "bans" are broadly only on the sale of new "assault weapons", leaving millions of them out there.  The most deadly firearm in common use is the 9 mm handgun, and that is used in most mass shootings (or maybe they use a 10 mm at times, but the 9 is most popular/frequently held.).

We had according to the above 61 mass shootings, using the most common definition, in 2021.  I don't recall any involving an AR-15 type weapon, there could have been one.




Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34105 on: July 10, 2024, 08:57:41 AM »
As for our colleges, I often point out that nearly 2/3rds of our HS grads go to college, more than half.  In Europe, the figure is under 40%.

If you make college more selective, and less common, you'll have better students, and better output.  Duh.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34106 on: July 10, 2024, 09:40:07 AM »
2023 Lewiston shootings - Wikipedia

Worst mass shooting in 2023.  Perp did not use an "assault rifle".  I looked for cases where one was used and drew a blank.  I could have missed one.

So, let's say magically they all disappeared somehow in the US.  We'd still have "mass shootings", and they'd be just as deadly, and folks would be crying for more "common sense gun control", but what then?

utee94

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34107 on: July 10, 2024, 10:07:44 AM »
As for our colleges, I often point out that nearly 2/3rds of our HS grads go to college, more than half.  In Europe, the figure is under 40%.

If you make college more selective, and less common, you'll have better students, and better output.  Duh.

In the US we use college as a de facto vocational program for a massive array of jobs, none of which college educations are targeted for.  Aside from some specific disciplines like engineering, college was never supposed to be a vocational program to qualify graduates for jobs, and college works very poorly in that capacity.

It's so crazy and backward. 

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34108 on: July 10, 2024, 10:31:13 AM »
"We" created an aura that a college degree is the requirement for success, and any kid who doesn't go to college must be dumb.

And it's of course a business now here.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34109 on: July 10, 2024, 10:47:20 AM »
In the US we use college as a de facto vocational program for a massive array of jobs, none of which college educations are targeted for.  Aside from some specific disciplines like engineering, college was never supposed to be a vocational program to qualify graduates for jobs, and college works very poorly in that capacity.

It's so crazy and backward.
This has been an issue of interest to me for years.  

As I see it:
  • The focus on "graduation rates" as the end-all, be-all in assessing Local Schools creates humongous pressure on education administrators to just graduate everyone regardless of qualifications.  
  • Because of #1, a HS diploma is no longer a guarantee of ANYTHING so employers more-or-less ignore it.  
  • As a work-around for issue #2, some employers tried using aptitude tests.  Unfortunately, SCOTUS effectively outlawed this practice in Griggs vs Duke Power so employers began using college degrees as a weed-out.  
  • Colleges face the same pressure for "graduation rates" that HS's face.  See, for example, the NCAA's APR which simply rewards schools for graduating athletes.  So colleges find a way to graduate as high a percentage as possible of their admits.  
  • Relevant to #4 is @Cincydawg 's point from above that around 2/3 of HS grads go to college.  This is ridiculously too high so colleges are admitting a substantial number of "students" who are simply incapable of legitimate college academics.  
  • To solve the riddle created by #5, colleges have resorted to the widespread practice of grade inflation so now college degrees are no longer worth what they used to be.  
  • Employers obviously noticed that #6 had created a slew of "College graduates" who were not up to the prior standard.  Professional associations noticed too so:
  • Employers and professional associations frequently now require graduate degrees for things that used to only require an undergraduate degree.  
This whole stupid and convoluted system wastes an absolutely ENORMOUS quantity of time and resources.  Further, our citizens are entering the workforce, on average, probably 2-3 years later than they should be.  This has a catastrophic impact on programs like SS and Medicare because we are losing 2-3 productive years to wasted time getting unnecessary education.  

My solutions:
  • End the focus on graduation rates at both the HS and the College level.  
  • Ensure that a HS diploma MEANS something to employers.  No more diplomas for illiterate kids, etc.  
  • Shrink college access to closer to the ~40% of the workforce that actually needs a degree.  
  • End grade inflation at the college level so that a degree re-attains the meaning that it once had.  No more College diplomas for kids who probably shouldn't have a HS diploma let alone college.  
  • For the kids who don't achieve college acceptance or who don't want to go, massively increase resource allocation to Vocational Education at both the HS level (11th and 12th and maybe some 10th grade) but also at the post-HS level.  The infamous "Yale or Jail" dichotomy needs to die.  You don't have to get a degree to have a successful, productive, and happy life but having some training in SOMETHING is better than none.  Also, training in an employable skill is vastly better than getting a worthless degree then finding that you are only qualified for jobs that you could have done as a HS dropout six years earlier.   


medinabuckeye1

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34110 on: July 10, 2024, 10:48:02 AM »
"We" created an aura that a college degree is the requirement for success, and any kid who doesn't go to college must be dumb.

And it's of course a business now here.
In the post that I was typing when you posted this I referred to the "Yale or Jail" dichotomy and it needs to die.  

bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34111 on: July 10, 2024, 11:18:55 AM »
"We" created an aura that a college degree is the requirement for success, and any kid who doesn't go to college must be dumb.

And it's of course a business now here.
Didn’t most of this happen because the end of World War II and the G.I. bill basically flooded the market with college grads? And as a society, we never really figured out how to back out of that situation.

847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34112 on: July 10, 2024, 11:21:41 AM »
Companies are shifting. I saw it when I was an active board member at the community college.

2-year (AS) degrees and internships are the way of the future as I see it.

BS degrees for engineering, sciences, healthcare (BSN) etc.

I'm not sure what a BA gets anyone, anymore.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

NorthernOhioBuckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34113 on: July 10, 2024, 11:24:40 AM »
https://apple.news/ADy_6HoE9S6S7eDCNDWn_xQ


Feeling bad now, aren’t you Nubbz.  😂😂
I've been saying that I should invest into Tattoo Removal technology as I believe it will be huge in a few years. ;)

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34114 on: July 10, 2024, 11:33:19 AM »
Didn’t most of this happen because the end of World War II and the G.I. bill basically flooded the market with college grads? And as a society, we never really figured out how to back out of that situation.

That was a big factor.  I know when I was in HS,  the HS counselor basically told nearly everyone to go to college, and I think 85% did enroll.  That was 1972.

I dated a gal for a while who told me she wasn't interested in college.  She was smart enough but had a job as a telephone operator, at 18, and made good money.  I think she figured on getting married, but not to me.

She was really pretty, but quiet, and not one of the "in gals", not a cheerleader etc.  I liked the quiet party, and not being an in gal, but she turned out also to  be a bit flighty.

MrNubbz

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34115 on: July 10, 2024, 11:48:09 AM »
https://apple.news/ADy_6HoE9S6S7eDCNDWn_xQ


Feeling bad now, aren’t you Nubbz.  😂😂
 :017: Ya lost me I don't have clue to what you are referring to or any tatoos 
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medinabuckeye1

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34116 on: July 10, 2024, 11:54:45 AM »
Didn’t most of this happen because the end of World War II and the G.I. bill basically flooded the market with college grads? And as a society, we never really figured out how to back out of that situation.
The GI Bill certainly introduced college as a realistic possibility for a lot of people but I don't think it overly flooded the market, see:
https://www.russellsage.org/research/chartbook/percentage-u-s-population-age-25-to-64-high-school-diploma-and-bachelors-degree-b

Most WWII Veterans were born in the 1920's and none were born later than that. Eyeballing the attached chart, the percentage of men with a degree doesn't appear to get over 20% until we get into birth years in the 1930's. 

For men it peaks for birth years in the late 1940's. Since those guys were college aged (18-22) at the height of the Vietnam War it stands to reason that the peak is due to Baby Boomers staying in school "buying time till things were not so bad" as Jimmy Buffet sang.

After that it drops off. This makes sense because major US involvement in Vietnam ended in 1972 (an election year, surprise) and the draft ended in 1973 so those who turned 18 after that (born in 1955 and later) never had to deal with that. Additionally, guys born in the earlier 1950's may have spent a few years in college prior to 1973 then no longer needed the deferment.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2024, 12:10:38 PM by medinabuckeye1 »

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #34117 on: July 10, 2024, 12:00:37 PM »
I think the GI Bill changed the perception of college.  Many of us had a father who attended college under it, and figured it was a good thing, so they passed it down (like me).

Before that, you really had to be fairly well off, usually, to consider college, and most jobs were "laymen" jobs.  You graduated HS and went to work, everyone did, now everyone didn't.  And the  job market progressed along side this.

It started the trend, it didn't create it.

 

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