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Topic: In other news ...

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MrNubbz

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21084 on: January 29, 2023, 07:31:18 PM »
Stop It! Boilers take the hardware
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utee94

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21085 on: January 29, 2023, 07:45:33 PM »
What worries me about China/Taiwan is TSMC. I know @utee94 knows what I'm talking about here.

Right now the West (led by the US) is in a technology embargo war with China. We're restricting exports of the tools they need to build advanced semiconductors.

TSMC is a HUGE linchpin in the global semiconductor market, and based (of course) in Taiwan. Their value can't be overstated to people outside the industry. And semiconductors are, to a large extent, the lifeblood of the modern economy. Essentially every electronic device you own has some semi content in it. Not just your phone, or your PC. I'm talking about your smoke detector. I'm talking about your coffeemaker. Your stove. Your car is full of them. Basically any device that uses electricity is using a modern semiconductor.

If China is being blocked (by the US) from the tech necessary to create advanced semis, do they roll the dice and say "well we're going to simply take it from TSMC"? If they try to do so, does TSMC get sabotaged internally or bombed externally to take it away from China?

W/O TSMC, the global economy will be decimated. At that point it doesn't matter if we or China win; everyone is royally screwed. TSMC is in Taiwan. China thinks they own Taiwan. We're poking China. What will they do?

The rational answer is nothing. Because the demise of TSMC will hurt China terribly. But as Cincy says, we thought Putin would act rationally. And look at how that turned out.

This (among other things) is what keeps me up at night.

As you know, agree entirely with the basis of your statements.

BUT

There's a big difference between the leadership in China, and the crazy dictator in Russia.

The Chinese think, plan, and act, generationally.  Even the current authoritarian government won't act irrationally for short term gains.

Dickface putin, on the other hand, is completely off the reservation.



Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21086 on: January 30, 2023, 06:39:08 AM »
We are relying on Chinese leadership to be rational, which isn't really a great bet.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21087 on: January 30, 2023, 07:09:21 AM »
Ukraine is relying on Soviet-era tanks to hold the line until Western reinforcements arrive | CNN

They don't seem to be using tanks in this area against enemy tanks.

Western tanks can fire different kinds of rounds depending on nature of the target, most are anti-tank rounds like Sabot, which isn't at all good against infantry, or HEAT, which is the same.  They need HE rounds to attack lightly armored targets.

Temp430

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21088 on: January 30, 2023, 07:23:22 AM »
For the M1A2 Abrams the US has the M1026 anti-infantry cannister shot round and the M908 HE round.
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21089 on: January 30, 2023, 07:28:21 AM »
Yup, the Abrams uses the same 120 mm smoothbore as the Leopard and Challenger.

I thought it interesting how smoothbores came back into vogue.


Temp430

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21090 on: January 30, 2023, 07:40:11 AM »
The 120mm "smooth bore" is actually lightly rifled at a much slower spin rate to help shells separate from their sabot.  Fin or air drag stabilization works better for the longer armor penetrator and HEAT rounds. 
A decade of Victory over Penn State.

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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21091 on: January 30, 2023, 07:43:32 AM »
I did not know that. Thanks.  I knew some rounds have "fins" that project after they leave the barrel.

FearlessF

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21092 on: January 30, 2023, 08:44:14 AM »
many chemists probably know this...........

In case of an emergency, crushed animal bones can be used to clean water that has been contimaniated with uranium and arsenic
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utee94

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21093 on: January 30, 2023, 03:06:36 PM »
We are relying on Chinese leadership to be rational, which isn't really a great bet.

It's been an excellent bet for centuries, if you understand that to them, staying in power and subjugating the masses, is the definition of "rational action."

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21094 on: January 30, 2023, 05:07:12 PM »
It's been an excellent bet for centuries, if you understand that to them, staying in power and subjugating the masses, is the definition of "rational action."

I'd argue that the technological changes of last couple of decades have dramatically changed their ability to have a hold on the population (and the population's access to uncensored information). It's not the same situation as it was for many of those centuries. 

They're riding an edge in that they have to keep showing economic progress to those masses. They have to make the populace trust that while they might not have social freedoms, the government is actually making things better. 

Zero-COVID put a huge dent in that trust. They're reeling. If our semiconductor export restrictions crater their economic growth, then they lose that trust even further. 

So they're backed into a corner. At that point, what do they do? Modernize? Liberalize? Admit they've been wrong? Nah...

They turn around and blame an external actor (America, for our export restrictions) and convince your populace that bringing Taiwan, which you consider your rightful property anyway, back into the fold is a good idea to restore China's greatness and access to critical technology. And you make yourself believe that America or Taiwan will NEVER sabotage TSMC because all we care about is money and we won't shoot ourselves in the foot either. 

The biggest question, IMHO, is whether they think they're powerful enough to pull it off. 

utee94

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21095 on: January 30, 2023, 05:28:47 PM »
I'd argue that the technological changes of last couple of decades have dramatically changed their ability to have a hold on the population (and the population's access to uncensored information). It's not the same situation as it was for many of those centuries.

They're riding an edge in that they have to keep showing economic progress to those masses. They have to make the populace trust that while they might not have social freedoms, the government is actually making things better.

Zero-COVID put a huge dent in that trust. They're reeling. If our semiconductor export restrictions crater their economic growth, then they lose that trust even further.

So they're backed into a corner. At that point, what do they do? Modernize? Liberalize? Admit they've been wrong? Nah...

They turn around and blame an external actor (America, for our export restrictions) and convince your populace that bringing Taiwan, which you consider your rightful property anyway, back into the fold is a good idea to restore China's greatness and access to critical technology. And you make yourself believe that America or Taiwan will NEVER sabotage TSMC because all we care about is money and we won't shoot ourselves in the foot either.

The biggest question, IMHO, is whether they think they're powerful enough to pull it off.

Yes, I agree it's different for them now, and more difficult.  But their aims are exactly the same.  What you've stated completely aligns to my point, other than your suggestion that they might jeopardize their economic well-being by attacking Taiwan, which is by necessity equivalent to attacking the US and the West.

They're not going to do it.


betarhoalphadelta

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21096 on: January 30, 2023, 07:40:47 PM »
Yes, I agree it's different for them now, and more difficult.  But their aims are exactly the same.  What you've stated completely aligns to my point, other than your suggestion that they might jeopardize their economic well-being by attacking Taiwan, which is by necessity equivalent to attacking the US and the West.

They're not going to do it.
I hope you're right.

I also think they're not going to do it, to be honest.

But it's one of those "back of the mind" worries that gets to me. I'd like to assume they're going to be rational. But you know what happens when you ass-u-me, right? 

utee94

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #21097 on: January 30, 2023, 08:04:20 PM »
I hope you're right.

I also think they're not going to do it, to be honest.

But it's one of those "back of the mind" worries that gets to me. I'd like to assume they're going to be rational. But you know what happens when you ass-u-me, right?

Oh yeah it's definitely one of those back of mind things. 

I hope I'm right, too.

 

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