Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

Eh, the "they did it first" finger-pointing can go back decades and probably generations.  It doesn't change the facts now.

I get it and I actually agree that this is a problem but I don't know what the solution could possibly be.  

From Trump's personal perspective, can you really expect him to respect "the process" after what they did to him (34 felonies for a non-crime) using "the process"?  

For any Trump supporter, can you really expect us to then look at what Trump did vis-a-vis paramount/CBS and say "Oh that is awful, he should be ashamed of himself".  

I'll acknowledge that, in a vacuum, I'd wholeheartedly agree with @bayareabadger 's point.  I'm uncomfortable with any politician being able to successfully sue a news outlet even if they did "do him wrong" simply because of what the courts call the chilling effect on free speech.  The Newsome lawsuit immediately raises this issue.  Conservatives can celebrate Paramount/CBS' loss and liberals can celebrate if Newsome is successful against FOX but from a legal perspective they are two sides of the same coin.  

That is how I would feel, as I said, "in a vacuum".  Here in reality where I have lived decades of the non-FOX media distorting, and outright lying to the detriment of the side that I generally support you aren't going to convince me to feel bad for Paramount/CBS*.  Similarly, after seeing the absolute farce of prosecution in NYC you aren't going to be able to convince me of the sanctity of "the process".  

*My history with CBS:
Back in 1982 there was a Proposition on the ballot in California to register handguns.  Dan Rather (CBS anchor at the time) reported nightly on this issue and played up what a big deal it was going to be if it passed.  Rather/CBS also breathlessly reported the amount of money spent by the NRA opposing the issue.  The problem I have with this reporting of the money is that the NRA money was presented as evil while the money spent supporting the issue was either not reported or shown in a good light.  Anyway, the issue got crushed at the polls 3:2 and Rather/CBS . . . they didn't mention it at all.  The reason I remember all of this even though I was only 7 at the time is that my family was the first on our block to have a VCR.  Dad bought a Beta (still better than VHS) so that he could record and see what they said nightly.  

That was more than 40 years ago and it has gotten worse rather than better in the interim so if you want to know why I don't trust the media AT ALL, that is it.  

 the only people who still pay attention to mainstream media are the boomers and well, they are almost dead- so as soon as they all die off- which will be very soon- 

As a baby boomer, I have no intention of dying off any time soon. 

I understand the intentions of such an exercise, but I think it's pretty much futile and it's impossible to be honest with yourself, as long as you're still existing in the world where you think in terms of "their party" and "my party" which, from your wording, it would appear you do.  I just don't believe there exists the capacity to be unbiased in such a mindspace.

I'm with @bayareabadger on this generally.  I think it is important to honestly try.  

That said, in our current national political situation it has simply moved beyond that for me.  

NYC settled a frivolous lawsuit with five rapists just to make Trump look bad then the National Democratic Party had one of those rapists as a featured speaker at their Convention.  I have literally zero respect for these people.  

Representative Al Green filed an impeachment proceeding over Trump's bombing of Iran.  I am wholeheartedly opposed to the bombing of Iran (or any other form of fighting Israel's wars for them) but I can't take this seriously when the "Honorable" Representative from Texas didn't bother to file impeachment proceedings against Biden or Obama for their bombings of Syria, Qatar, etc.  If the war powers act is constitutional (it probably isn't) then it is the law ALL the time not just when the current occupant of the WH happens to be a Republican.  

The Prosecution of Trump for a non-crime.  

The non-Fox media went after Republicans after Giffords was shot based on having her race as a "target" but Fox showed repeated instances of Democrats similarly calling races "targets".  That is the lingo of the business, a vulnerable R/D is naturally going to be targeted by the other party.  Trying to make it a call to assassinate but ONLY when Republicans do it is nonsense.  

So you are right in this case, I can't look at it that way and I don't pretend to.  

I don’t know that I agree. I think it takes discipline and reflection, and obviously won’t be 100 percent.

Like, you seem to be on the conservative side of things. Do you feel you can’t rightly judge if a liberal is caught in some BS or if a conservative is behaving badly?

I'm pretty much a midline libertarian and I have views that would be considered both conservative and liberal.  That's not really the same thing at all, as party identity.

I find many "real issues" to be rather complicated lacking some ideological solution by either side.  I've mentioned how some things could be readily solved with some compromise, or if not solved, at least addressed.  It leaves both 'sides' unhappy of course.

The minimum wage is something that seems very easy to solve as an issue, to me.

why try? both parties are horrible.  I'll do nothing.
very few political discussions with folks are productive in the least bit
and I have extremely little influence on almost any issue

frees my mind up to think about sporty cars, CFB, golf, and hotties - you know,...... inportant stuff

Fair enough!

What makes a midline libertarian?

I also don’t think having some liberal and conservative ideas fully splits a person from party identity, exactly. Am I free of party affiliation if I think a lot of stuff Democrats do is garbled nonsense that shouldn’t be done? I don’t think many folks would say that.

I suppose it could be a visceral rejection of everyone’s BS. But most people don’t exactly fit with that either.

I'm midline.  No other way to explain it.

Yes I viscerally reject everyone's BS.  I can't speak for anyone else, I can only speak for myself.  But anyone who's voting Democrat every time, or Republican every time, is almost certainly a participant of bullshit identity politics.  I once was, too.  But I haven't voted Democrat or Republican in a presidential election since 2004.