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Topic: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes

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Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33236 on: June 18, 2024, 01:01:32 PM »
I'm not a biologist.

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33237 on: June 18, 2024, 01:04:12 PM »
I'm not a biologist.
That made me chuckle.

Are you a Supreme Court Justice or something?
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33238 on: June 18, 2024, 01:05:55 PM »
Abortion has been a political issue since the flawed* Roe decision was made. It comes up every 2 years and will continue to come up.

It's a weapon, and yes, it affected the House and Senate in 2022.

Congress could codify it and has refused.
It's been a political issue, but as medina points out it was an issue that single-issue abortion voters might decide their vote on, but literally everyone else largely voted based more on their other political beliefs because as long as Roe was in force, your vote didn't really affect the availability of abortion. And while the right was thumping their chests about how they'd get Roe overturned, I think a lot of the electorate didn't buy it--which is why it was such a huge shocking case to so many when it actually happened. 

However, I still don't understand how the left weaponized it. Even if you consider every political issue a weapon, it seems to be bipartisan. Republican state-level lawmakers are pushing for heavy abortion restrictions in their legislatures, and then Democrats get it put on ballots for the voters to decide. Both sides are battling it out hard. I don't see how either side can be singled out for "weaponizing" the issue? 

Abortion has been a rock around Republican electoral necks ever since Dobbs.  I'll take a crack at it:

The other side of this coin is that so long as Roe existed, Republicans didn't lose too many votes for their Pro-Life position because so long as Roe was in place, people could reason that it didn't matter.  Once that went away it hurt Republicans three ways:
I've actually made the argument [elsewhere] that abortion was a virtue signaling issue for a lot of Republican women. They could be the most vociferous pro-life advocates publicly, but with the knowledge that if they [or their daughters] ever needed an abortion, it was available, due to Roe. 

Once Roe was overturned, they realized that availability of abortion was actually in jeopardy. And what we see at the ballot box is that even in Republican states like Kansas, keeping availability legal won resoundingly (60/40) at the ballot box. It did this DESPITE polling to lose 43/47, in a state which Trump carried 56/42. How to explain that??

My guess is that there were a bunch of Republican women arguing publicly that they were going to vote pro-life, that were telling their husbands and fathers and everyone else that they were going to vote pro-life, and then in the secrecy of the ballot box said "nope". Because they realized that when it REALLY came down to it, if they [or their daughters/granddaughters] needed an abortion, they wanted it to remain available. 

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33239 on: June 18, 2024, 01:17:46 PM »
We don't hear many conservatives talk about abortion very often.

The left never stops. It's a weapon.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

bayareabadger

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33240 on: June 18, 2024, 01:20:32 PM »
Abortion can be codified. But they won't do it because it will leave one less issue out of election season.

The left has weaponized abortion. It is what it is.
I mean, does government usually move to codify things under Supreme Court ruling? It also seems like it’s a little backwards.

They didn’t push it not because it’s less of an issue to run on but because it might have galvanized the other side.

I don’t totally know what it means to be “weaponized.” Does that mean used to get people elected? If so, that’s been helping republicans build coalitions for decades.

bayareabadger

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33241 on: June 18, 2024, 01:23:28 PM »

We don't hear many conservatives talk about abortion very often.

The left never stops. It's a weapon.
Interesting. This hasn’t been my experience, but I suppose I lived in the south for a long while. 

Mdot21

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33242 on: June 18, 2024, 01:24:20 PM »
Wherever you're getting your talking points from (RT, InfoWars, the Epoch Times, or the RNC day sheet), you need to stop listening to them.
what are you blathering on about? RNC day sheet? What the? first of all I've never heard of Epoch Times, the only thing I know about InfoWars is the hilarious memes I see of Alex Jones on the internet- and they are truly hilarious- the gay frog song meme- holy shit is that funny- and the only thing I really know about RT is that some of our supposedly "open, free, and democratic" allies in the EU have banned it. Nothing screams democracy like state imposed censorship of media. YAY Freedom! 

I actually laid out you know, things that happened in the real world. facts as the kids would say. the only one sticking to stupid ass talking points is you. why? probably because you clearly have nothing to say and you don't know what in the actual f*ck you are talking about. 

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33243 on: June 18, 2024, 01:31:43 PM »
We don't hear many conservatives talk about abortion very often.

The left never stops. It's a weapon.
Huh? You live in Florida. I'm pretty sure it's not the left that was not only talking about the issue, but actually codified a ban at 6 weeks in your state.

Pretty sure it's not the left in Alabama that's not only talking about the issue, but banning it AND saying they'll prosecute women who leave the state to travel to another state where it's legal.

I'm pretty sure it's not the left in Texas who are not only talking about the issue, but instituted a ban on it AND gave people the right to file civil lawsuits against women who have one or doctors who perform one. 

Since Roe was overturned, I've heard conservatives talk about abortion even more than they did before Dobbs, because now they can actually do [legislatively] what they've been trying to get the ability to do for decades. 

Of course the left is talking about it too, because, well, they want to stop the conservatives from doing that, drive turnout, AND they want to use it as a wedge issue to drive Republican women who don't want the availability taken away to defect from their party [at least in some votes/ways/turnout/etc].

Don't think I'm saying the left ISN'T talking about it. I'm just saying neither side has a monopoly on using this issue as a weapon. 

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33244 on: June 18, 2024, 01:31:53 PM »
Mdot gets his "facts" from SPECIAL SOURCES not available to regular commoners.

The rest of us just slavishly feed on whatever CNN tells us, I reckon.

CNN is still alive, right?  I think they are hosting a "debate" of sorts down the street from me.

Mdot21

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33245 on: June 18, 2024, 01:38:49 PM »
Trump’s Nord Stream 2 disaster (thehill.com)

Kind of entertaining.  And probably mostly true.
this article just patently and demonstrably mostly false. 

Google is your friend.

The Germans wanted the pipeline. Which means it was always going to happen. German chancellor Gerhard Schroeder became chairman of the Russian state-backed company that controlled the Nord Stream pipeline directly after leaving office for christ sake. Trump was talking shit the pipeline and about a former chancellor working for the pipeline right to their faces and calling them out on this and the European/American politicians/media laughed in his face about it. You can google the videos of his speeches and meetings at summits/conferences in Europe on this topic if you aren't lazy. Trump put sanctions on any company helping on the pipeline in 2019. Germany, the EU, and Russia immediately condemned those sanctions. The Germans told the US mind your business and finished the pipeline themselves disregarding those sanctions. Biden removed the sanctions almost as soon as he got in office because at the end of the day wasn't much he could do to stop it from being built considering THE GERMANS DESPERATELY WANTED THE GOD DAMN PIPELINE since day one.

This is nothing but pure bullshit to shift the blame away from the Germans who are solely responsible for that pipelines former existence.

End the end, it's all A-OK though, because we said ah f*ck it let's just commit the biggest act of eco-terrorism in history and had our CIA blow it up. We win. 

Mdot21

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33246 on: June 18, 2024, 01:44:14 PM »
Mdot gets his "facts" from SPECIAL SOURCES not available to regular commoners.

The rest of us just slavishly feed on whatever CNN tells us, I reckon.

CNN is still alive, right?  I think they are hosting a "debate" of sorts down the street from me.
yeah, no. it's called the public record, genius. 

that gopher buddy was claiming a bunch of wild sh*t about Trump in regards to Russia that is just demonstrably false.

Trump expelled more Russian nationals from US soil than Obama. Fact. Trump imposed many more and much tougher sanctions on Russian nationals and Russian corporations than Obama. Fact. Trump shipped lethal arms to Ukraine, something Obama openly refused to do because he did not want to escalate the situation. Fact. 

These and many other similar facts kind of, you know, blow up his ridiculous nonsensical talking points that Trump was some kind of Manchurian candidate. 

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33247 on: June 18, 2024, 01:44:30 PM »
The "article" is an opinion piece.  


utee94

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33248 on: June 18, 2024, 01:49:34 PM »
I think the last time I watched CNN was probably 1991.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #33249 on: June 18, 2024, 01:51:21 PM »
I click on their web site most days.  I click on a lot of different news sites daily.  The stories being told about what's happening vary considerably between them which I find rather fascinating.  One site will have a story as a main headline and another will ignore it completely.


 

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