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Topic: Misfits Thread

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bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6678 on: August 25, 2020, 11:41:03 AM »
Perhaps they can visit a neighborhood near you then you can so elquently deal with them with your wise counsel

Who is them? Protesters near me? Poor folks who are all thugs in some folks eyes? The neighborhood comprised entirely of violent folks? A neighborhood full of violent protesters and Antifa folks?

Anyway, if one thinks it would be fun to mow down folks with a firearm, I'll point out it's pretty gross and childish. 

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6679 on: August 25, 2020, 11:47:08 AM »
Many of them do get paid a nominal fee. Last night, carloads were coming from Milwaukee and Chicago, on I-94. License plates covered and all that. State police had most of the exits blocked, but still, many found their way in.


Of this I am skeptical. 

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6680 on: August 25, 2020, 11:55:40 AM »
Who is them? Protesters near me? Poor folks who are all thugs in some folks eyes? The neighborhood comprised entirely of violent folks? A neighborhood full of violent protesters and Antifa folks?

Anyway, if one thinks it would be fun to mow down folks with a firearm, I'll point out it's pretty gross and childish.


Of course I was suggesting a completely different course of action; getting the hell out of dodge before it comes down to that. aka, the "non-violent" approach. 


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MrNubbz

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6681 on: August 25, 2020, 12:06:53 PM »
Who is them? Protesters near me? Poor folks who are all thugs in some folks eyes? The neighborhood comprised entirely of violent folks? A neighborhood full of violent protesters and Antifa folks?

Anyway, if one thinks it would be fun to mow down folks with a firearm, I'll point out it's pretty gross and childish.
Nice spin,those that are burning down buildings,car lots and smashing businesses.When did I say poor folks?That I have more in common with than the 1%ers.Try reading before belching preconcieved notions.It is a fervant wish that IF this behavior continues that they pay you a visit ASAP and you can share with the congregation how righteous and warrented their destruction of your home/hearth is/was.Hopefully you won't be trapped anywhere inside when these luminaries decide to put the torch to it.

I have friends in Cleveland with shops - you know the people that contribute to society and provide a service and pay taxes that you show no concern for.There was a slow climb out of the financial abyss from COVID,only to be tossed back into ruin when your snowflakes wrecked the furniture shop and beverage business.The mechanics shop was left standing his friends were not so fortunate
« Last Edit: August 25, 2020, 12:12:55 PM by MrNubbz »
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6682 on: August 25, 2020, 12:11:29 PM »
He said the cameras are helpful but have not turned out to be the game-changing reform that many had hoped. One reason: Some officers fail to activate their cameras during life-and-death encounters, he said.

An increasing number of studies also suggest the cameras do not change how often officers use force.

In Milwaukee, officers used slightly less force after starting to wear cameras at first but then returned quickly to normal levels, said Daniel Lawrence, a researcher at the Urban Institute in Washington, D.C., who studied their adoption.
It's not a game-changing reform in that it will cause cops to say "pretty please with sugar on top, sir, would you please enter this squad car?" That's not the point. 

The point is having a visual record in the case of a dispute over the facts, after the fact, so that it's not merely "virtuous and trustworthy policeman said X vs accused criminal with no credibility said Y". Because we know how that usually ends. Regardless of the facts, the police's statements are believed and the "perp's" aren't. But what we've seen is that when external video is available, often you realize that the police's version of the facts don't match reality. 

As an example, have you followed the Masai Ujiri incident? This came up on ESPN the other day. He's the President of the Toronto Raptors. He's black. After the Raptors clinched the NBA finals last year, he was approaching the court (in a more impeccable suit than I'll ever own) to celebrate with his team, pulling out his credential, and the sheriff's deputy who was working courtside just absolutely SHOVED him out of nowhere, twice. 

That's not the issue. The sheriff's deputy then spent a year trying to sue Ujiri for initiating the altercation, and claimed he'd suffered a concussion during the incident. It's only with Ujiri filing a countersuit that anyone got access to the body cam footage, showing that the deputy not only initiated the action, but that Ujiri did not retaliate, did not escalate, and never in any way struck the deputy. 

There are probably some people who believe that the cops should never use force. I'm not one of those people. The advantage of body cam footage (and other surveillance) is that sometimes cops use force that isn't justified, and prior to having video, they were never held accountable. With body cam footage we can review the incident and try to at least have a good basis for the justification. If the body cam footage shows the cops are justified, then that protects the cops. Why would they not want that protection when someone has spurious claims of police brutality and they can go to the footage and show that they were 100% justified in what they did (or that they didn't do anything--which might also sometimes be the case). 

847badgerfan

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6683 on: August 25, 2020, 12:19:48 PM »
Of this I am skeptical.
One example, after a quick search for "paid protester".


Former NYPD Lt. Darrin Porcher warned about paid demonstrators infiltrating ongoing protests and riots and emphasized the importance of communities working with law enforcement.

"As a former NYPD lieutenant, I refer back to me being a practitioner in New York City and the many instances we had -- what we referred to as paid agitators," he told Fox News' Arthel Neville on Saturday.

"These were people who were paid by specific groups to come in and quote, unquote, raise a level of anarchy -- throwing things, just creating somewhat of a miscreant society ... We knew who a lot these people were. because you would see them at one demonstration. Then a week later you would see the same demonstrator or agitator protesting all over again. They knew nothing nor cared anything about what the actual event was involved around."

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FearlessF

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6684 on: August 25, 2020, 12:53:20 PM »
There are probably some people who believe that the cops should never use force. I'm not one of those people. The advantage of body cam footage (and other surveillance) is that sometimes cops use force that isn't justified, and prior to having video, they were never held accountable. With body cam footage we can review the incident and try to at least have a good basis for the justification. If the body cam footage shows the cops are justified, then that protects the cops. Why would they not want that protection when someone has spurious claims of police brutality and they can go to the footage and show that they were 100% justified in what they did (or that they didn't do anything--which might also sometimes be the case).
I believe the cops should have used force last night in Kenosha and there are obviously many times when they need to and should.

I'm only guessing, but logically it would seem the cops don't want the "protection" because most times it's not needed and also most times the cops are afraid the footage will protect the citizen and show they are guilty of using excessive force.

in other words, the cops don't want to be held accountable because they're asshats
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bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6685 on: August 25, 2020, 01:00:54 PM »
Nice spin,those that are burning down buildings,car lots and smashing businesses.When did I say poor folks?That I have more in common with than the 1%ers.Try reading before belching preconcieved notions.It is a fervant wish that IF this behavior continues that they pay you a visit ASAP and you can share with the congregation how righteous and warrented their destruction of your home/hearth is/was.Hopefully you won't be trapped anywhere inside when these luminaries decide to put the torch to it.

I have friends in Cleveland with shops - you know the people that contribute to society and provide a service and pay taxes that you show no concern for.There was a slow climb out of the financial abyss from COVID,only to be tossed back into ruin when your snowflakes wrecked the furniture shop and beverage business.The mechanics shop was left standing his friends were not so fortunate
Not spin, misread the structure of the first sentence. That's my bad. Ignore the first graph. 

I'm not talking about the protesters at all in this case. I'm talking about the idea that taking lives would be fun. I'm not even arguing it wouldn't be necessary, but it ain't fun. And if it is fun, that would show they're not much of a gap between those destroying property and those decrying it. 

To be clear, I think the property damage is terrible. I also think the government taking lives is terrible, though a necessity at points. 

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6686 on: August 25, 2020, 01:04:58 PM »
One example, after a quick search for "paid protester".


Former NYPD Lt. Darrin Porcher warned about paid demonstrators infiltrating ongoing protests and riots and emphasized the importance of communities working with law enforcement.

"As a former NYPD lieutenant, I refer back to me being a practitioner in New York City and the many instances we had -- what we referred to as paid agitators," he told Fox News' Arthel Neville on Saturday.

"These were people who were paid by specific groups to come in and quote, unquote, raise a level of anarchy -- throwing things, just creating somewhat of a miscreant society ... We knew who a lot these people were. because you would see them at one demonstration. Then a week later you would see the same demonstrator or agitator protesting all over again. They knew nothing nor cared anything about what the actual event was involved around."


This doesn't really show me someone was paid. It shows me a former cop thinks people were paid, which is nice, but doesn't overcome my skepticism. 

(To be fair, I'm also somewhat skeptical of the police in general, in part because they tend to be allowed a great bit of leeway and deference and often use all of it)

847badgerfan

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6687 on: August 25, 2020, 01:09:57 PM »
Here is a different video, showing him resisting, getting up and running away, leaning into his car.


https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1297866797060771842


It's a little shaky, but there is a better version of it down the thread a bit.

The moral here should be that when a cop asks to you put your hands up... put your damn hands up.
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Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6688 on: August 25, 2020, 01:11:09 PM »
It probably wouldn't take many "paid agitators" to heat up an already unstable situation.  It might be say two guys who rather covertly break windows of businesses to enable looting or start fires, etc.

Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6689 on: August 25, 2020, 01:17:25 PM »
I think in every case some crime has received public notice usually because of video, the final story had included a LOT of salient details not evident in the first analysis.

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6690 on: August 25, 2020, 01:18:56 PM »
Here is a different video, showing him resisting, getting up and running away, leaning into his car.


https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1297866797060771842


It's a little shaky, but there is a better version of it down the thread a bit.

The moral here should be that when a cop asks to you put your hands up... put your damn hands up.
That video doesn't really show much. I think its a cop that's on him when he's on the ground, but I can't really tell. 

The fallout of that moral is kinda fascinating. The phrasing is a little weird, because asking isn't really the right verb. But still, interesting fallout. 

847badgerfan

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #6691 on: August 25, 2020, 01:21:57 PM »
Lots of people don't respect police anymore. We may not need to worry about that because not a lot of people want to be police right now. Of course, we need to worry about that.
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