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Topic: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness

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bayareabadger

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1120 on: June 03, 2019, 02:58:07 PM »
For sure.  But you're the one that stated that kids wanting big money straight outta school, should consider engineering. ;)

And agree with Cincy's statement that while we're producing a good number of engineers, there's still a gap.  We're filling it with various immigrants and non-Americans.  I guess, much like house-cleaning and kitchen-work and ditch-digging, home-grown Americans just view engineering as being beneath them.:)
I think engineering has to a degree a slight ivory tower problem.

Granted Badge is trying to fix that. 

ELA

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1121 on: June 03, 2019, 07:39:14 PM »
Big Ten announcing Delanys successor tomorrow.


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MichiFan87

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1122 on: June 04, 2019, 12:11:55 AM »
I actually don't think there's a shortage of engineering jobs overall. Maybe my perspective is skewed on this, but a substantial number of people I've met who have engineering degrees either went directly into a different field, be it finance, healthcare, technology & software development, or some other lucrative career, but part of that is that it was apparently easier to get a job in those fields.

This exacerbates the fact that, unlike most careers, you basically have to get an engineering degree in college to even consider pursuing it as a career. I have a MS in Engineering Management but that's basically similar to an MBA with a more technical focus (courses like Project Management and Lean Six Sigma) so it doesn't qualify me for any kind of engineering role.

Conversely, in my world of clean energy, there are substantially more people with even less of a technical background than I have than there are engineers, even for analytical roles like I've had (though a decent number of jobs in this space are not technical, to be sure).
“When your team is winning, be ready to be tough, because winning can make you soft. On the other hand, when your team is losing, stick by them. Keep believing”
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Hawkinole

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1123 on: June 04, 2019, 01:05:05 AM »
Big Ten will have a new commissioner in 2020. No real policy statement put out here. Kevin Warren, attorney, but not a practicing attorney. Seems like an accomplished guy. Minnesota Vikings chief operating officer Kevin Warren is expected to be introduced Tuesday as the next commissioner of the Big Ten Conference

Cincydawg

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1124 on: June 04, 2019, 05:53:37 AM »
We hired a lot of engineers where I worked and indeed many/most of them quickly went into management, especially the females.  It was a faster path to "success".

This ironically led to an imbalance with far more men on the technical side of the ladder, one the company had no way to remedy.


847badgerfan

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1125 on: June 04, 2019, 06:52:58 AM »
There is no shortage of engineering jobs.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Cincydawg

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1126 on: June 04, 2019, 06:54:21 AM »
I imagine there is no shortage of jobs for expert Diesel mechanics either.

I wonder how much big crane operators make these days.  There are a lot of them around me.

847badgerfan

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1127 on: June 04, 2019, 07:04:58 AM »
Heavy equipment operators make a good amount of coin. If they are in a year-round, right-to-work area, even better.

There are a lot of jobs out there right now, period. Need people to fill them all. I'm mostly interested in engineers though, selfishly, and I'm not at all interested $15/hour for HS kid jobs.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Cincydawg

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1128 on: June 04, 2019, 07:45:21 AM »
One work site near me has 3 semi-permanent tall cranes working on what will be a 40 story block consuming complex.  They are still doing site prep but it's fun to stroll by and watch.  I think they just started for real on a 54 story condo project where the penthouse is a cool $12 Million.  The cheapest is $0.6 million.

Further south near that Cypress Bar place is an area referred to as Tech Square, as GT has moved across the freeway, and a huge amount of development is happening in the area.  Norfolk Southern moved its HQ here and is building a new place down there, they have a large building up near me now.

A 29 story apt building was just completed almost across the street from us, it was fun watching that one too.  They should put up some bleachers around these job sites where you can sit and watch and order beer.  The site prep part is quite interesting, they probably want folks to check out the soil and all that.  I bet soil engineers or whatever they are called make tens of millions a year.

Of course around here if you scratch the dirt much you run into granite for some reason.

HailHailMSP

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1129 on: June 04, 2019, 08:07:36 AM »
Big Ten will have a new commissioner in 2020. No real policy statement put out here. Kevin Warren, attorney, but not a practicing attorney. Seems like an accomplished guy. Minnesota Vikings chief operating officer Kevin Warren is expected to be introduced Tuesday as the next commissioner of the Big Ten Conference
A GREAT hire! I feel fortunate to have gotten to know Kevin pretty well over the last couple years, working on a couple of regional business relationships with him and the Vikings. He is a very cerebral workhorse who has nearly universal respect from all those that cross paths with him.

His journey to this point has been pretty amazing. His son is currently playing for an evil SEC school. 

Cincydawg

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1130 on: June 04, 2019, 08:27:51 AM »
The bar right next to us hangs a Michigan State flag fairly often, the Green S on white background, FYI.


utee94

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1131 on: June 04, 2019, 08:47:38 AM »
I actually don't think there's a shortage of engineering jobs overall. Maybe my perspective is skewed on this, but a substantial number of people I've met who have engineering degrees either went directly into a different field, be it finance, healthcare, technology & software development, or some other lucrative career, but part of that is that it was apparently easier to get a job in those fields.

This exacerbates the fact that, unlike most careers, you basically have to get an engineering degree in college to even consider pursuing it as a career. I have a MS in Engineering Management but that's basically similar to an MBA with a more technical focus (courses like Project Management and Lean Six Sigma) so it doesn't qualify me for any kind of engineering role.

Conversely, in my world of clean energy, there are substantially more people with even less of a technical background than I have than there are engineers, even for analytical roles like I've had (though a decent number of jobs in this space are not technical, to be sure).
badge and I are stating that there's actually a surplus of engineering jobs, at least domestically.  That's why so many companies are having to fill those gaps with foreign labor.  And because it's more difficult and more costly for companies to do that, with the additional political red tape, they'd much rather hire American citizens where possible.  But the labor simply isn't there.  This gap seems to be especially large in my electrical engineering world, in semiconductors, computer hardware, and other hard high tech industries.

I totally agree with you that lots of folks with engineering degrees move on to other things. I worked as an actual electrical engineer in the semiconductor industry for just under a decade, before going back for an MBA.  Now my recent jobs have all been in Operations, Marketing, and management.  So I'm one of those people.

Engineering in high tech can be a bit of a meat grinder.  Relatively long hours, often poor chances for advancement for individual contributors, so the only path for advancement (and consequently salary increase and prestige increase) becomes moving into management or tangentially related fields like product marketing.  Engineers with good interpersonal skills are somewhat rare and so excel in those roles, but that leaves holes in the labor force that aren't being filled with American citizens.

I was joking about engineering being undesirable, but honestly it seems like for more and more people that COULD do it, they'd really rather not to.  

Cincydawg

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1132 on: June 04, 2019, 08:54:53 AM »
Yeah, my experience was that management was "the way to go" for advancement and career "success".  It was much much tougher to climb the ladder on the technical side.

The majority of my bosses were "engineers", but they were really just managers, they could as well have had degrees in art history, seriously.  They just didn't care about anything remotely technical. 

I had one boss briefly who claimed to be a chemical engineer so he could understand my work, but he asked me the exact same question every time I met with him, "What is this DVB?  You keep saying DVB but what is it?"  He was Indian.  You need the accent.  He was a nice enough fellow, but he had no clue what DVB was.

I'd preferred the ones who didn't pretend to ask.

DVB, incidentally, id "divinyl benzene", a pretty common crosslinker in the polymer world.  My great innovation in my career was to figure out a substitute that worked and had useful other attributes.

utee94

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Re: 2019 Offseason Stream of Unconsciousness
« Reply #1133 on: June 04, 2019, 11:39:39 AM »
I've found that my technical background as a practicing engineer has helped me quite a bit when moving over to the product and marketing sides.

In new product development, for example, when I set up some new feature requirements based on my expectations for the market or actual customer requests, and the engineering team pushes back (which they ALWAYS do), I'm able to challenge them in an informed way.  Sometimes they have good reasons, other times they're simply being lazy.  I've done their job and I know the differences, because sometimes I was just lazy too.

Not really lazy, to be fair.  It tends to be a result of an engineering mindset that you know better than the customer, and so taking on new work is pointless.  When in reality, the customer wants what the customer wants.  It may or may not be deliverable in a timely or profitable manner for my own company, but pushing back simply for the sake of pushing back occurs pretty regularly.   And it's MY job to determine the profitability, not the engineers', because honestly they have no idea.

My technical background has given me the skills to understand when that's happening, and it's also given me the credibility with the engineering teams that they know I'm not just busting their balls for no reason.  Then we can work collaboratively to find a solution.  Works out pretty well, ultimately.

 

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