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Topic: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

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Gigem

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11186 on: October 28, 2024, 11:25:08 AM »
Quote from: utee94 on October 28, 2024, 11:20:30 AM
Yes, and if you remove fossil fuel generation during the daytime, the wind and solar we have aren't anywhere near enough to cover the difference.  And the demand will only increase over the next several decades.

And Texas is among the best with respect to renewables, in other regions it's far far worse.
No doubt that FF still far outpace solar/wind, and we will definitely need those sources for the foreseeable future.  But if we're talking about reducing CO2 and GHG, we're (Texas) is moving in the right direction.  
Check out today's mix:

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Gigem

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11187 on: October 28, 2024, 11:26:26 AM »
BTW, STP is 16 square miles (the nuke plant near me).  Still a healthy size, but not as big as I thought.  
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utee94

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11188 on: October 28, 2024, 11:29:18 AM »
Quote from: Gigem on October 28, 2024, 11:26:26 AM
BTW, STP is 16 square miles (the nuke plant near me).  Still a healthy size, but not as big as I thought. 
Yeah we go camping at Matagorda quite a bit, and one of my routes tracks right by the plant.  It's a pretty impressive sight, you definitely have to drive AROUND it.
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Gigem

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11189 on: October 28, 2024, 11:32:57 AM »
Quote from: utee94 on October 28, 2024, 11:29:18 AM
Yeah we go camping at Matagorda quite a bit, and one of my routes tracks right by the plant.  It's a pretty impressive sight, you definitely have to drive AROUND it.
Yeah, the size of it feels a lot bigger.  
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11190 on: October 28, 2024, 11:33:00 AM »
The Diablo nuke plant in California is not only pretty near a lot of stuff, you can see it from I-5, it's apparently on a fault line, and next to the ocean.

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Gigem

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11191 on: October 28, 2024, 11:43:27 AM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on October 28, 2024, 11:33:00 AM
The Diablo nuke plant in California is not only pretty near a lot of stuff, you can see it from I-5, it's apparently on a fault line, and next to the ocean.
Well, I'm pretty sure that after 3 mile island, they started putting them out in BFE.  But I do know that STP was the last nuke plant built for over 30 years.  I think they finally put one in around Georgia or somewhere in the SE (maybe South Carolina), and it was a total boondoogle.  Way, way overbudget, talks of converting it to NG, way over schedule.  It was quite the fuckery from what I remember.  Heck, they may still be building the damn thing.  

I wonder if it's in the middle of nowhere as well?  
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11192 on: October 28, 2024, 11:43:46 AM »
Quote from: Gigem on October 28, 2024, 11:18:17 AM
Yes it does, but I think that we have plenty of capacity at night, and not enough during the day.  If you look at the ERCOT site, you can track the power consumption, it almost always peaks during the day, and drops significantly at night. 

This is true, but that's not always a great thing for the power grid. It's actually becoming an issue here in CA where the net load on the grid drops during those hours but then conventional energy production has to quickly ramp up in the afternoons as solar generation wanes. 

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=56880

As @utee94 says, for solar or wind to really make the splash that we need, energy storage is key. 
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Gigem

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11193 on: October 28, 2024, 11:44:57 AM »
I had to look it up.  $30 billion dollars....at that rate we'll never achieve net zero.  

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Gigem

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11194 on: October 28, 2024, 11:47:30 AM »
Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on October 28, 2024, 11:43:46 AM
This is true, but that's not always a great thing for the power grid. It's actually becoming an issue here in CA where the net load on the grid drops during those hours but then conventional energy production has to quickly ramp up in the afternoons as solar generation wanes.

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=56880

As @utee94 says, for solar or wind to really make the splash that we need, energy storage is key.
There are quite a few energy storage projects going on around us as well, including one right by my house.  Telsa has a big one near Angleton.  

One of the reasons why NG is so much better is because they can ramp them up and down much quicker than other plants such as coal.  You have to have those baseline plants because wind and solar are variable.  
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11195 on: October 28, 2024, 11:47:57 AM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on October 28, 2024, 11:33:00 AM
The Diablo nuke plant in California is not only pretty near a lot of stuff, you can see it from I-5, it's apparently on a fault line, and next to the ocean.
Yeah, and the San Onofre now-retired nuke plant is right between Camp Pendleton and I-5 and the ocean, just on the south end of Orange County. 

It's known to evoke memories...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTxFFWajIII
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Gigem

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11196 on: October 28, 2024, 11:50:44 AM »
Yep, I just checked.  Vogtle is in the middle of nowhere as well.  
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11197 on: October 28, 2024, 11:53:24 AM »
Quote from: Gigem on October 28, 2024, 11:47:30 AM
There are quite a few energy storage projects going on around us as well, including one right by my house.  Telsa has a big one near Angleton.
 
Going the right direction, for sure. But per the post above where you highlighted the current fuel mix, it looks like storage capacity is currently only about 5.5% of the total energy capacity.

Quote
One of the reasons why NG is so much better is because they can ramp them up and down much quicker than other plants such as coal.  You have to have those baseline plants because wind and solar are variable. 

That's definitely true. The problem however is that you have to have the energy capacity to almost completely replace what you get from solar/wind if you're not getting reliable sun and/or wind. That's where storage can really help, because you can balance out that load. 
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11198 on: October 28, 2024, 11:53:36 AM »
Vogtle is in the country where land is cheap, but it's fairly close to Augusta, a decent sized city.  It's not as if the land around Vogtle is completely desolate and unused and unpopulated.  It makes sense to site such a plant near a water source and where land is cheap.

I'm in favor of wind and solar where it makes sense, but I don't think a grid can be just wind and solar obviously.  

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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #11199 on: October 28, 2024, 11:54:56 AM »
NG "peaker plants" are expensive because they don't operate very often, by design.  So when they do, they charge a lot for power.

They are basically jet engines on the ground.
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