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Topic: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

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847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10766 on: September 22, 2024, 10:14:10 AM »
Well, how about the next few centuries?
Nukes will ensure there won't be any more of those.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

MaximumSam

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10767 on: September 22, 2024, 10:18:35 AM »

Fairly scary to see decades of change in a graph of 485 million years

MarqHusker

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10768 on: September 22, 2024, 10:25:17 AM »
I heard a bedwetting story on the radio this past week over Microsoft's plan to use nuclear energy to support its AI energy needs.  The source of the nuclear energy?   Three Mile Island, which was the site of 'the worst nuclear disaster in US history' in 1979 I was reminded about three times during the six minute story and interview with a prominent business journalist 

Unsaid in that presentation of this news was the fact that zero people died and that despite the damage to the reactor, there were no noticeable effects to humans or the surrounding environment. 

Very interesting development in this space given the media's uncomfortable role of reporting on AI given it is such a consumer of energy. 

DunkingDan

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10769 on: September 22, 2024, 10:35:03 AM »
I heard a bedwetting story on the radio this past week over Microsoft's plan to use nuclear energy to support its AI energy needs.  The source of the nuclear energy?  Three Mile Island, which was the site of 'the worst nuclear disaster in US history' in 1979 I was reminded about three times during the six minute story and interview with a prominent business journalist

Unsaid in that presentation of this news was the fact that zero people died and that despite the damage to the reactor, there were no noticeable effects to humans or the surrounding environment.

Very interesting development in this space given the media's uncomfortable role of reporting on AI given it is such a consumer of energy.
Wonder what would have happened if operations had just let the plant operate (shut down) as it would have without interfering.

Not jumping on you, just the fear mongers and pointing towards the stupidity of their management.

I am glad they are restarting it, as I am glad to see TVA and the Govt. is finally doing something with the Oak Ridge site. 8 years to late, meaning they should of started at least that long ago. I keep hearing Belafonte (sp) in Alabama may be competed as well.


President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.

DunkingDan

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10770 on: September 22, 2024, 10:39:59 AM »
Fairly scary to see decades of change in a graph of 485 million years
Its called by some 'Mother Nature". It's always changed and it always will, until the end of the age.




President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.

Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10771 on: September 22, 2024, 10:42:58 AM »
Well, how about the next few centuries?
We might have fusion ca. 2070, maybe.  Too late if the models are right.  

DunkingDan

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10772 on: September 22, 2024, 10:53:54 AM »
Fairly scary to see decades of change in a graph of 485 million years

Strictly speaking, ‘global temperature’ is not a physically meaningful quantity; there are only local temperatures, ranging at any given time from about -80°C to +40°C, which are then averaged to produce a ‘global’ figure. This average is then regarded as a temperature itself, ‘as if the out-of-equilibrium climate system has only one temperature’. But ‘The temperature field of the Earth as a whole is not thermodynamically representable by a single temperature’, and tiny trends in average temperature provide ‘no basis for concluding that the atmosphere as a whole is either warming or cooling’ (Essex et al., 2007). Roger Pielke & Thomas Chase
Roger Pielke & Thomas Chase
Roger Pielke & Thomas Chase
Roger Pielke & Thomas Chase argue that ‘Changes in global heat storage provide a more appropriate metric to monitor global warming than temperature alone’.
Note that even local average temperatures are generally unknown. At most weather stations there is only one temperature measurement a day. Some stations use a maximum and minimum thermometer, and the mean of the daily maximum and daily minimum temperature is then considered to be an average. Modern statistics, however, does not recognize such an ‘average’, which can depart significantly from a genuine average, derived from, say, hourly readings. William Gray (2008b, pp. 5-6) reports:
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if you compare this [max/min] average with the average of the 24 hourly readings from one midnight to another, you get a large bias, which for the average of 24 New Zealand weather stations was +0.5ºC for a typical summer day with a range of +2.6ºC to -0.4ºC and an average of +0.9ºC with a range of +1.9ºC to -0.9ºC for a typical winter day. The positive bias of the max/min average over the mean hourly value can thus be larger than the claimed effects of greenhouse warming.


Other potential sources of error in ground-based measurements include contamination by urban heating effects (due to the replacement of vegetation with heat-absorbing asphalt and concrete), disproportionate concentration of thermometers in urban areas, changes in instrumentation, changes in station and instrument locations, loss of stations, missing monthly data, and changes in the time of day when thermometers are read.
The number of weather stations worldwide has fallen sharply in the past two decades. When the Soviet Union collapsed in the early 1990s, more than half the world’s weather stations were closed in just four years, which means that today’s average can’t really be compared with that from the 1980s. Commenting on the decline in the number of ground stations since the 1970s, especially in Siberia, Fred Singer (2008, p. 8) writes:
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Ideally, the models require at least one measuring point for each 5 degrees of latitude and longitude – 2,592 grid boxes in all. With the decline in stations, the number of grid boxes covered also declined – from 1,200 to 600, a decline in coverage from 46 percent to 23 percent. Further, the covered grid boxes tend to be in the more populated areas.











President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.

FearlessF

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10773 on: September 22, 2024, 10:54:47 AM »
Fairly scary to see decades of change in a graph of 485 million years
so, did they actually capture the earth's climate?

or simply the global mean surface temp?
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10774 on: September 22, 2024, 11:05:44 AM »
so, did they actually capture the earth's climate?

or simply the global mean surface temp?
Probably neither, but certainly not the former.  One could in theory approximate global mean T.  You'd need reliable sensors every 100 miles or so in a grid I'd guess.

The term climate is not really something one can measure in any absolute sense.  It could be rainier, or drier, or windier, or less humid, etc., all factors related to climate.

About a third, or more, in the US think the whole thing is poppycock, made up to make money for some folks.

Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10775 on: September 22, 2024, 11:11:23 AM »

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10776 on: September 22, 2024, 01:40:06 PM »

Quick question...

At which points during these 485M years did the earth support a technologically advanced society of 8M human beings who all needed to be fed?

DunkingDan

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10777 on: September 22, 2024, 02:58:18 PM »
Fairly scary to see decades of change in a graph of 485 million years
Here is something else for you to think about concerning temperatures since we already see that there is problem with the data


 An example of a well-sited and well-maintained station.

 The graph shows temperatures from 1880 to the present.





This site in Marysville, California, has been around for about
the same amount of time, but has been encroached upon by growth,
producing a warming bias so large that the site is useless.


This not even considering to get a true idea as to an areas temperature you need temps from various heights. Nor is it considering that the data is now including more and more measurements from the 2nd  example and less from stations like the 1st example









President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.

847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10778 on: September 24, 2024, 10:02:07 AM »
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
« Reply #10779 on: September 24, 2024, 10:08:21 AM »
With this kind of storm surge combined with the very high tides we're seeing, there is going to be a whole lot of flooding around here.



U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

 

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