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Topic: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas

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847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4970 on: June 08, 2020, 09:15:02 AM »
When this was going into effect it was my job to analyze the potential impact to my employer at the time, so I am very familiar with it.


I used to provide healthcare to all of my employees and their families, 100 percent paid by my company.

Now that the premiums have quadrupled (they tripled at first), I only provide for the employee, and they also have to contribute.

They didn't like it, and I didn't either. I just told them that the changes were the result of a terrible new law.
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847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4971 on: June 08, 2020, 09:15:53 AM »
You would know more than me by far. But being in banking this is what I can tell you about Obama care:  It was unanimously hated by all the business owners, especially the small ones, because it prevented them from hiring people and in many cases made them reduce their staff. Also on a personal note my costs went up substantially and my coverage went down substantially, not that my own experience is necessarily how I would judge something like that.
But, you get to keep your doctor!!
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4972 on: June 08, 2020, 09:17:14 AM »
But, you get to keep your doctor!!
Um... lol, that turned out to be not true for me. 
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Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4973 on: June 08, 2020, 09:23:23 AM »
It's a bit ironic that both political parties want to replace Obamacare, with something.  I think Biden only wants to change it.

Stock market futures are mostly higher again today.

The next week might tell us a lot about where we're at on the virus front.

847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4974 on: June 08, 2020, 09:25:15 AM »
Um... lol, that turned out to be not true for me.
Just another of many lies.

But, when he said it, he was so eloquent and emphatic!
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Cincydawg

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CWSooner

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4976 on: June 08, 2020, 10:37:21 AM »
I absolutely believe Reagan would have been pro Obamacare.  Here's why: 

Reagan opposed Medicare for two principal reasons: participation was mandatory, and because Medicare spent scarce taxpayer funds to subsidize coverage for wealthy people who didn’t need the help.

So we can gather from this quote that Reagan probably would have been against the individual mandate, which no longer exists anyway.  However, I think he would have approved of most of it.  Reagan explicitly supported the role of government in subsidizing care for every American who could not otherwise afford it.


Quote from "A Time for Choosing"
“No one in this country should be denied medical care for lack of funds.”

In a speech to the Phoenix chamber of commerce:
“Any person in the United States who requires medical attention and cannot provide for himself should have it provided for him.”

He championed the Kerr-Mills Act of 1960, a law introduced by two Democrats that gave federal money to states with which to provide medical care for the elderly in need. Reagan said that he was “in favor of this bill — and if the money isn’t enough, I think we should put up more.”


In fact, CW, I bet you would also be in favor of 90% of Obamacare provisions.  When this was going into effect it was my job to analyze the potential impact to my employer at the time, so I am very familiar with it.
Hmmm.  I will have to think about your points.
ObamaCare did not help me any.  My costs went up.  I realize that that doesn't necessarily make it bad policy.
The individual mandate was the worst thing about it.  Suddenly, the federal government was making its citizens purchase a product that they didn't necessarily want or need as the cost of being an American citizen.  IMO, that was wrong on principle.
And, IMO, it was wrong when SCOTUS decided that it was not a mandate but merely a tax.  I think that John Roberts caved on that for political reasons.  A different Justice Roberts, first name Owen, in the 1937 case of West Coast Hotel v. Parrish, reversed his own previous vote in a similar case.  It was perceived to have been an attempt to defuse the appeal of FDR's "court-packing plan."  A humorist called it "the switch in time that saved nine."
Another reason that I opposed it was that it was quite obvious that it was intended as a step toward total government control of health-care insurance.  A step toward "single-payer," as Obama and others admitted at times when they didn't think they were on camera.
So, as I saw it then, and still do, it was a bad policy and a dishonest policy in that it was not intended to fix problems but rather to pave the way for even more government involvement.
Now, without the individual mandate, it is just yet another federal program that we can't pay for and is digging us deeper and deeper into national debt.
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CWSooner

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CWSooner

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4978 on: June 08, 2020, 10:39:56 AM »
The people who think it's man-made want it to be man-made.  The time to believe something is when the evidence exists to believe it.  This is so obvious.
We all do that often, on many different issues.
Perhaps you only notice it when the "other" side does it.
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CWSooner

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4979 on: June 08, 2020, 10:44:16 AM »
You would know more than me by far. But being in banking this is what I can tell you about Obama care:  It was unanimously hated by all the business owners, especially the small ones, because it prevented them from hiring people and in many cases made them reduce their staff. Also on a personal note my costs went up substantially and my coverage went down substantially, not that my own experience is necessarily how I would judge something like that.
I had forgotten that aspect of it.  Wasn't there a bright line at some point for employers?  More than 50 full-time employees and the employer had to provide medical insurance?  And the response of many was to cut back on the number of full-time employees, or to not go over 50 of them.
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4980 on: June 08, 2020, 10:47:16 AM »
I had forgotten that aspect of it.  Wasn't there a bright line at some point for employers?  More than 50 full-time employees and the employer had to provide medical insurance?  And the response of many was to cut back on the number of full-time employees, or to not go over 50 of them.
Yes. It was 50. I personally knew of dozens of businesses that either cut people or cancelled hiring growth.  And that was just my bank clients in my little corner of the world (SE Michigan at that time)
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Mdot21

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4981 on: June 08, 2020, 11:17:00 AM »
China is behaving exactly how our leadership would if the roles were reversed.
While I’m not a big fan of the US govt, to say this is a big stretch. China is one of the most authoritarian states in the world. They’ve had 1 million of their own citizens in internment camps- without trial- all in order to brainwash them and get them to denounce their religion- all and just because of the religion they practice. 

China disappeared whistleblowers and doctors who were trying to sound the alarm for the coronavirus. They destroyed lab materials and hard drives, and they lied to the WHO and the entire world about the number of its citizens infected and killed by the disease and the mode of transmission of the disease. 

The US has its problems for sure. But what China does and gets away with to its own citizens is just on a completely other level.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4982 on: June 08, 2020, 11:41:33 AM »
While I’m not a big fan of the US govt, to say this is a big stretch. China is one of the most authoritarian states in the world. They’ve had 1 million of their own citizens in internment camps- without trial- all in order to brainwash them and get them to denounce their religion- all and just because of the religion they practice.

China disappeared whistleblowers and doctors who were trying to sound the alarm for the coronavirus. They destroyed lab materials and hard drives, and they lied to the WHO and the entire world about the number of its citizens infected and killed by the disease and the mode of transmission of the disease.

The US has its problems for sure. But what China does and gets away with to its own citizens is just on a completely other level.
Right, and imagine Trump continuing down this path, untethered.  I believe the only thing stopping him from being Emperor Trump is the media - of whom he is trying to discredit continually, every day.  He fires anyone who disagrees with him in hired positions.  He incites violence against groups he disagrees with.  

I think he's envious of China's power structure.
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #4983 on: June 08, 2020, 11:44:06 AM »
Right, and imagine Trump continuing down this path, untethered.  I believe the only thing stopping him from being Emperor Trump is the media - of whom he is trying to discredit continually, every day.  He fires anyone who disagrees with him in hired positions.  He incites violence against groups he disagrees with. 

I think he's envious of China's power structure.
It is increasingly difficult to take you seriously. 
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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