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Topic: OT - Weird History

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longhorn320

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #784 on: June 26, 2022, 09:17:45 AM »
Today in Aviation History: The first Production F4U-1 Corsair Made Its First Flight (warbirdsnews.com)


My dad served in the Pacific during WW2 and used to say there is nothing that even comes close to the sound of a Corsair starting up its engine 

Im sure he heard it many times
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #785 on: June 26, 2022, 09:19:33 AM »

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #786 on: June 26, 2022, 11:36:11 AM »
Unintended Consequences - Part 1: Treason By Other Means.
The Great World War often was a bitter tug of war match between officers with the vision to see the future and their superiors still mired in the past. One example of the former was British officer John Frederick Charles Fuller (photo, left).
In short, Fuller was brilliant, but he rubbed people the wrong way. Still, his keen grasp of tactics was recognized, and during the First World War he became heavily involved in planning tactics for one of the newest British weapons, the tank.
When the tank first appeared on European battlefields it terrified the Germans, but the few successes gained by using tanks generally were not followed up on, and the war ended before visionaries like Fuller truly could demonstrate the full capabilities of the weapon. Had the war gone into 1919, this might have changed.
Fuller was one of a few British officers who saw that the future of warfare was mechanization, but following the war the British Army was downsizing, scrounging for funding, and not particularly interested in the ideas of men such as Fuller and B. H. Liddell Hart regarding the future of tank warfare in Europe.
But while the British were not especially interested in what Fuller had to say, there was someone else who was absorbing everything he could on emerging tank doctrine.....
In Germany, a veteran officer named Heinz Guderian (photo, bottom-right) was devouring every book on mechanized warfare he could find, and a great many of them were coming out of England.
Guderian used what he learned to help shape Germany's tactical theories on tank warfare, and he was able to because, through the books he read, he could have Fuller's theories without having Fuller's problems with superior officers.
Having to start over from scratch following the Versailles treaty, the leadership of the German Army did not feel the need to be as rigid in their doctrine as did the British Army, and so embraced the fast-strike ideas about which Fuller wrote, working them into their own new doctrine of lightning mechanized warfare.
And the rise of fascism on the continent appealed to Fuller, who himself became an avowed fascist, and when Germany began rearming and mechanizing its military in the 1930s, Fuller was there cheering them on, even gaining favor with Hitler himself.
When the Second World War started, the German Army used the ideas they learned from men such as Fuller to great success in the early campaigns. Britain and France, having not been as flexible in the interwar years, were stunned.
Fuller remained a committed fascist, even after the end of the Second World War, even writing toward the end of his life that he believed Germany should have won the war.
While Fuller's delivery of his tactical theories to the enemy originally had been inadvertent, things may have gone very differently had the Great World War not ended in armistice in November of 1918, and his theories on tank warfare instead had been demonstrated clearly to his own side in the proposed campaigns of 1919.


medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #787 on: June 26, 2022, 03:42:45 PM »
When the tank first appeared on European battlefields it terrified the Germans, but the few successes gained by using tanks generally were not followed up on, and the war ended before visionaries like Fuller truly could demonstrate the full capabilities of the weapon. Had the war gone into 1919, this might have changed.
It is interesting, two of the biggest innovations of WWI were poison gas first used by the Germans and the Tank, first used by the English.  Ultimately neither had the immediate impact that they could have because both were first employed in limited quantities.  

Poison Gas:
The Germans actually first used Gas warfare on the Eastern Front against the Russians and only later used it on the Western Front against the English and French.  As amazing as this will seem, apparently the Russians failed to notify their Western allies of the German use of poison gas so even though it had been used first in the East it was still "new" when used in the West.  Nonetheless, the Germans started out only using small quantities, not enough to lead to a the major breakthrough that both sides were seeking.  By the time mass gas attacks were tried, both sides were prepared with the appropriate protective gear.  Furthermore, on the Western Front the Germans were confronted with a problem in that the prevailing wind was toward them so the gas that they used tended to drift back onto their own lines.  

The Tank:
As referenced in the article you quoted, the tank absolutely terrified defenders as local infantry at the time didn't have anything that could take it out.  Worse, tanks were generally too fast (even then) and too small to call in artillery strikes against.  However, the early tanks were terribly unreliable so it didn't take all that long before enough of them were broken down that the rest could be dealt with.  

A mass gas or tank attack before the other side was prepared for it might well have seriously changed the course of the war.  

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #788 on: June 26, 2022, 03:46:51 PM »
The thing that sort of almost altered the outcome were the tactics used by the Germans in 1918.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #789 on: June 26, 2022, 03:56:59 PM »
Marco Polo may be a household name, but few know that his famous literary masterpiece, The Travels of Marco Polo , was not only written while he was in prison, but was penned by somebody else. Marco Polo’s tale of adventure in the Far East became a bestseller when it was published around 1300, inspiring generations of explorers, including Christopher Columbus 
Christopher Columbus who kept an annotated copy amongst his personal belongings.

The bestselling biography / autobiography / travelogue recounted the experiences of Marco Polo 
Marco Polo during a 24-year voyage alongside his father and uncle, Niccolò and Maffeo Polo. Originally from a family of well-travelled merchants, Marco Polo 
Marco Polo left Venice at just 17 years old and returned at 41, passing through countries including Turkey, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Kashmir and China between 1271 and 1295. Marco Polo was even employed at the court of Mongolian emperor Kublai Khan 
Kublai Khan for 17 years.
The story of Marco Polo’s travels included a plethora of useful information for merchants at a time when few Christians had ever travelled into the Far East 
Far East , let alone to China. In fact, “the unprecedented in its time,” explained National Geographic 
National Geographic .

Nevertheless, the book was actually written by Rustichello of Pisa 
Rustichello of Pisa , Polo’s cellmate when he was captured and imprisoned as a prisoner of war during a battle between Venice and Genoa in 1298. Some historians have claimed that the entire book is a fabrication, made up of secondhand accounts heard from others. Others believe that Marco Polo 
Marco Polo never existed at all and was a figment of Rustichello’s active imagination.


Nonetheless, the majority believe that the book is mostly true, with a few embellishments thrown in to improve sales, such as accounts of unicorns (possibly rhinos), pasta growing on trees and even dog-headed humans. This was before the invention of the printing press, and so the book was copied by hand, which didn’t help much in avoiding mistakes, well-meaning alteration and stark differences between copies and translations.

The Travels of Marco Polo 
The Travels of Marco Polo , also known as Il milione (in allusion to Polo’s nickname Il milione suggesting a man who invented a million tall tales), is not the only literary masterpiece to have been written in jail. Sir Thomas Malory wrote Le Morte d’Arthur , a retelling of the story of King Arthur, while imprisoned at London’s Newgate Prison. Miguel de Cervantes claimed that the prologue to Don Quixote was “begotten in prison.” Whether or not this is true is another matter.



Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #790 on: June 27, 2022, 03:31:42 PM »
“Woods now U.S. Marine Corps entirely.” Major M. Shearer’s report to HQ, June 26, 1918, Belleau Wood, France. 
Today, June 26th, marks the 104th anniversary of the end of the Battle of Belleau Wood, one of the most ferocious battles in U.S. Marine Corps history.
The battle lasted from June 1st to June 26th, 1918, near the Marne River in France. It was part of the German Spring Offensive of 1918, which hoped to defeat the Allied forces on the Western Front before the full strength of the U.S. military reached France. In late May 1918, the third German offensive of the year penetrated the Western Front to within 60 miles of Paris.
On June 1, German troops attacked French forces and reached their objectives, moving into the area and occupying Belleau Wood. U.S. 2nd Division, which included 5th and 6th Marine Regiments, set up defensive positions south of the woods, ordering the Marines to “hold where they stand.” On June 2nd, Germans troops moved through the woods and attacked the Marines, who mowed down a wave after wave of Germans with deadly accurate rifle fire, halting their line. Other elements of Allied forces were not as successful, and many French commanders urged the Marines to retreat before the Germans re-organize. This led to one of the most famous Marine retorts, uttered by Captain Lloyd Williams of 2nd Battalion 5th Marines; “Retreat? Hell, we just got here.”
Over the next two days, Marines repelled continuous German attacks, which allowed the allied forces to prepare and launch a counterattack on June 6th. Marines from 1st Battalion 5th Marines were ordered to take the Hill 142, west of the woods. As they crossed the now-famous wheat fields with their bayonets fixed, they were met by German troops who set well-defended positions supported by deadly machine gun and artillery fire. On that morning, many Marines were cut down in those wheat fields; however, 1/5 was able to overcome the odds and capture Hill 142, uprooting the entrenched Germans.
With the left flank secured, 3rd Battalion 5th Marines and 3rd Battalion 6th Marines were ordered to advance into Belleau Woods from the west and clear it out. These Marines, again, had to push across the open wheat field, facing a well-entrenched enemy. During this attack, winner of 2 Medals of Honor, Gunnery Sergeant Dan Daly, motivated his men with the now most iconic Marine Battle quote, “Come on, you sons of bitches, do you want to live forever?”
Soon enough, Marines of 3/6 and 3/5 were engaged in some of the heaviest fighting in Marine Corps history. The German infantry had well-established trench lines that were covered by interlocking machine gun fields of fire, barbed wire, and individual fighting positions. As the Marines pushed through these defenses, the battle turned into the most brutal hand-to-hand fight for life and death. When the dust settled, the Marines gained a stronghold in the woods.
Over the next three weeks, Marines attacked the woods six times before they were able to expel the Germans fully. On June 26, 1918, 3rd Battalion 5th Marines, under the command of Major M. Shearer, made the final attack on Belleau Wood, clearing it of any remaining German forces. Major Shearer sent a report to HQ stating, “Woods now U.S. Marine Corps entirely.” One of the most ferocious battles in U.S. Marine Corps history was over.
U.S. forces suffered 1811 Killed-In-Action and 7966 wounded in the Battle of Belleau Wood. After the battle, the French renamed the wood "Bois de la Brigade de Marine" ("Wood of the Marine Brigade") in honor of the Marines' tenacity. The French government awarded the Marines with the “Croix de Guerre” and Marines of 5th and 6th Marine Regiments are still allowed to wear the “French Fourragere” on their uniforms as a symbol of their regiments’ valor during the battle.
This battle also cemented the U.S. Marine Corps’ place in modern warfare as a highly effective fighting force. Official German reports classified the Marines as “vigorous, self-confident, and remarkable marksman…” They compelled General Pershing, commander of the American Expeditionary Force, to proclaim that “the deadliest weapon in the world is a United States Marine and his rifle.” The legend has it that after the battle, the Germans began to call the Marines “Teufelshunde” or “Devil Dogs.” Over the past 100 years, the Marines have lived up to the high standard set by the Belleau Woods Marines on the battlefields all over the world, and they keep proving that U.S. Marine Corps is the deadliest fighting force in modern history.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #791 on: June 29, 2022, 03:25:23 PM »


Ute Pass, CO, circa 1860 gold rush era.


Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #792 on: June 29, 2022, 07:23:19 PM »


P-47D being restored.  The engine is the R2800 Double Wasp with 2800 cid.


[th]Major applications[/th]
Convair CV-240 family
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Grumman F6F Hellcat
Martin B-26 Marauder
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Vought F4U Corsair
[th]Produced[/th]
1939-1960


OrangeAfroMan

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #793 on: June 29, 2022, 09:18:34 PM »


Ute Pass, CO, circa 1860 gold rush era.


The more I've explored out west here, my opinion of those early pioneers has progressed from impressed to thinking they were nucking futs.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #794 on: June 30, 2022, 08:30:02 AM »
I think the motivations of early explorers in the West has to be judged relative to where they started and conditions extant there.  Life back then was hard for most.

I've seen the path up the mountain to the Yukon gold fields, it's nuts too.


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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #795 on: June 30, 2022, 08:45:41 AM »

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FearlessF

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #797 on: July 01, 2022, 08:08:27 AM »
The man who stole the Mona Lisa from the Louvre in 1911 had helped build the glass case that held the painting. He hid in the broom closet overnight and then walked out in the morning. He was Italian and believed the painting belonged to Italy.
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

 

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