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Topic: OT: Obituaries Thread

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ELA

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1218 on: May 21, 2025, 11:45:44 AM »
Multiple Chicago Bears references on the same page of the Obituaries thread seems accurate.  

Gigem

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1219 on: May 21, 2025, 02:22:56 PM »
RIP Norm has dominated my internet space since yesterday.  Kinda strange, considering that Cheers went off the air in '93 and I don't think it was very highly syndicated compared to other shows from that era (Seinfeld, Friends, etc).  I mean it was a great show, and there was a lot of love for it when it went off the air, but it just didn't seem to have much longevity compared to other TV shows.  And Wendt wasn't really in a ton of other movies, just a few cameos and such here and there.  

FearlessF

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1220 on: May 22, 2025, 09:27:15 AM »
Cheers was WAY better than other shows from that era (Seinfeld, Friends, etc)
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

ELA

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1221 on: May 22, 2025, 09:28:44 AM »
Cheers was WAY better than other shows from that era (Seinfeld, Friends, etc)
I think of Cheers as more of an 80s show and Seinfeld/Friends as more 90s.

FearlessF

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1222 on: May 22, 2025, 09:33:19 AM »
absolutely, I watched Cheers a lot, was done watching TV by the 90s.
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1223 on: May 22, 2025, 09:48:31 AM »
I think of Cheers as more of an 80s show and Seinfeld/Friends as more 90s.
Agree, Cheers is absolutely an 80s show.  

Although it didn't start until 89, I think Seinfeld kind of straddled the decades.

Friends is all 90s all day.

MrNubbz

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1224 on: May 22, 2025, 10:08:12 AM »
Cheers was WAY better than other shows from that era (Seinfeld, Friends, etc)
Great minds and all that, IMHO Seinfeld was Meh.Friends was contrived horseshit. Ya all these up upwardly mobile Yuppies spinning zingers & hanging out at a coffee shop,nah,hard pass. 🤮
“There’s nothing like working with people you love—and beer. Mostly beer.” - Norm Peterson

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1225 on: May 22, 2025, 10:50:53 AM »
Agree, Cheers is absolutely an 80s show. 

Although it didn't start until 89, I think Seinfeld kind of straddled the decades.

Friends is all 90s all day.
I was curious so I looked it up:
Cheers:
Aired 9/30/82 - 5/20/93.  Ratings were soft the first three seasons (82/3-84/5) but then spiked and peeked from 85-91.  It was the #1 show in 90/91 and drifted down the last two years.  

Seinfeld:
Aired 7/5/89 - 5/14/98.  Ratings were soft the first four seasons but then spiked in the fifth (93/4) and peeked from 94/5-97/8.  It was the #1 show in 94/5 and again in 97/8.  

Friends:
Aired 9/22/94 - 5/6/04.  Ratings were a little soft the first year but mostly stable throughout the show's run.  It was the #1 show in 01/2.  

I definitely agree on Cheers being an 80's show.  It was #1 at the VERY beginning of the 90's but most of the show's run was in the 80's as were most of it's highly rated seasons.  

The three shows were never on simultaneously as Cheers ended a year and a half before Friends began.  Seinfeld straddles the gap but notably Seinfeld didn't really take off until after Cheers went off the air so, of the three, the only two to be really big at the same time were Seinfeld and Friends in the later 90's.  

I really hadn't thought of Seinfeld as an 80's show but I guess I should because, thinking back, I can't think of any internet references even in the later seasons when the internet was definitely "a thing".  I'm defining "a thing" here is widely available and utilized by the general public rather than narrowly available and mostly only utilized by "computer nerds".  (Aside on that later).  Netscape Navigator was initially released in December, 1994 and I view that as really the beginning of the internet for normal people so:
  • Cheers was off-air before that.  
  • That was fairly late during Seinfeld's run.  
  • Friends started right about the same time as the internet became widely used.  

Aside on Netscape/the internet:
I graduated from HS in 1993 and I've made the observation before that I think my HS experience was more similar to people who graduated 20-30 years before me than it was to people who graduated 5-10 years after me.  

In terms of cultural change for HS students I think the big items would be:
  • Widespread availability of the pill in the mid-60's.  Prior to that sex among unmarried HS students was MUCH less prevalent and MANY people got married very soon after HS.  
  • End of the draft in 1973.  Prior to that guys in HS were, for the most part, planning on their post-HS military service. 
  • Widespread adoption of the internet in the mid-90's.  
  • Widespread adoption of mobile phones in the late 90's / early 00's (am I right on dates here, I mean for normalish HS students not just high paid executives).  

The end of the Draft was announced in early 1973 so HS graduates from the class of 1973 (now 70ish) were the first class to graduate without a draft hanging over their heads in about 30 years.  Maybe I'm missing something, but I really don't see any dramatic cultural differences between them and HS graduates from my class, 20 years later.  

People who graduated five years after me in 1998, however, had a very different experience.  For them the internet was widely available and a substantial portion of HS students had mobile phones.  

Little anecdotal example:
I graduated in the spring on 1993 and started at Ohio State that fall.  On my dorm floor there were probably 50+ guys and, in total, there were two PC's and two Word Processors on our entire floor.  Remember Word Processors?  My brother graduated from HS six years later in the spring of 1999 and started at Ohio State that fall.  There were four guys in his dorm and between them they had SIX computers:  Each one had a PC and two of them ALSO had laptops. That is purely anecdotal and probably doesn't scale well but the difference between 1 pc for every 25 guys (0.04 Computers per guy) and 1.5 computers per guy in six years is staggering.  

Also, when I started in 1993 NONE (IIRC) of the guys on my floor had a mobile phone.  I moved out to a house shared with four other guys the next year and one of the things I handled was splitting up the long distance charges on the landline phone bill because we were each calling home on the house landline.  By the time my brother started at Ohio State I think that most students had their own mobile phones.  

MrNubbz

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1226 on: May 22, 2025, 11:00:00 AM »
absolutely, I watched Cheers a lot, was done watching TV by the 90s.
So you missed "Frasier", "3rd Rock from the Sun", "Becker", "COACH", "Herman's Head", "That '70s Show","Everybody Loves Raymond" - your loss
“There’s nothing like working with people you love—and beer. Mostly beer.” - Norm Peterson

FearlessF

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1227 on: May 22, 2025, 11:03:29 AM »
Aside on Netscape/the internet:
I graduated from HS in 1993 and I've made the observation before that I think my HS experience was more similar to people who graduated 20-30 years before me than it was to people who graduated 5-10 years after me. 

In terms of cultural change for HS students I think the big items would be:
  • Widespread availability of the pill in the mid-60's.  Prior to that sex among unmarried HS students was MUCH less prevalent and MANY people got married very soon after HS. 
  • End of the draft in 1973.  Prior to that guys in HS were, for the most part, planning on their post-HS military service.
  • Widespread adoption of the internet in the mid-90's. 
  • Widespread adoption of mobile phones in the late 90's / early 00's (am I right on dates here, I mean for normalish HS students not just high paid executives). 
I'm say, out here in farm country the internet and cell phones happened later. Especially for HS kids.
I got my first cell phone (bag phone) in Dec 97 and also started using the internet in Dec 97.  I was married with Children and only started those things because of my job with a phone company..the 56K modem came out about then.
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1228 on: May 22, 2025, 11:04:03 AM »
Agree with mb's long post above.  At least until recently, what we think of as "decades" actually tend to run 2-5 years behind.

The pictures we have of the "50s" with the poodle skirts and the teenagers dancing to Elvis or Carl Perkins rock and roll music at the sock hop, really didn't start until 54/55.  The early 50s were more like the 40s.  And our idea of the "50s" really ran into the mid 60s.

And what we think of as the "groovy 60s" was really more like mid 60s into the early 70s.  And so on.  So what we think of as the 80s persisted in large part into the early 90s.

Beyond that, those trends are really defined more by the "kid cultures" of the era.  Adults tend to hit their 20s and then sort of... stay the same.  They tend to stick with certain music and are less open to newer music, they tend to not follow new fashion trends as closely, and when they do adopt new cultural themes, they adopt much slower.  On the other hand, kids tend to be the vanguard of the ever-changing culture.

With that as a basis, Seinfeld was a thoroughly adult show.  It really never had any kids nor any kid-related themes.  Its characters were all adults into their 30s, mostly in professional(ish) careers, doing adult-y things in adult-y ways.  So as an adult show, grounded culturally in the 80s, it never really picked up the culture of the 90s.  It was conceived in the 80s and started as an 80s show, and remained that way throughout its run.

That's just my hypothesis and my opinion of course.

FearlessF

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1229 on: May 22, 2025, 11:04:24 AM »
So you missed "Frasier", "3rd Rock from the Sun", "Becker", "COACH", "Herman's Head", "That '70s Show","Everybody Loves Raymond" - your loss
yawn :34:

I watched MASH
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

ELA

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1230 on: May 22, 2025, 11:09:38 AM »
Beyond that, those trends are really defined more by the "kid cultures" of the era.  Adults tend to hit their 20s and then sort of... stay the same.  They tend to stick with certain music and are less open to newer music, they tend to not follow new fashion trends as closely, and when they do adopt new cultural themes, they adopt much slower.  On the other hand, kids tend to be the vanguard of the ever-changing culture.

With that as a basis, Seinfeld was a thoroughly adult show.  It really never had any kids nor any kid-related themes.  Its characters were all adults into their 30s, mostly in professional(ish) careers, doing adult-y things in adult-y ways.  So as an adult show, grounded culturally in the 80s, it never really picked up the culture of the 90s.  It was conceived in the 80s and started as an 80s show, and remained that way throughout its run.

That's just my hypothesis and my opinion of course.
Excellent point, never thought about it that way.

CatsbyAZ

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Re: OT: Obituaries Thread
« Reply #1231 on: May 22, 2025, 11:20:08 AM »
Comparing other sitcoms to Seinfeld or Friends is a losing bet because both those shows were uniquely transcendent sitcoms. They are like the Petronas Towers dwarfing the rest of the Kuala Lumpur skyline.

Friends for example set the tone for women's fashion and hairstyles going into the 2000s. And as Friends became (and still is) popular in syndication across the world, viewers from all over took Friends, for better or worse, as a form of distinct American cultural immersion. My cousins in Poland specifically watched Friends to learn American English and do their hair like Jennifer Aniston. I never liked Friends, primarily because I took the three male characters as insufferable dopes, but it became so much more than just another Thursday night show.

When assessing Cheers, take the Friends and Seinfeld measuring sticks away and the playing field becomes much more realistic. The Cheers legacy is better compared to other successes like King of Queens, Everybody Loves Raymond, and of course Frasier.


 

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