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Topic: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes

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FearlessF

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40866 on: December 19, 2024, 10:34:44 AM »
kick the can down the road into the future

stopping the current war is a good thing
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40867 on: December 19, 2024, 10:57:17 AM »
kick the can down the road into the future

stopping the current war is a good thing
Not for Ukraine it isn't.  It's only good for Russia.

Luckily y'all don't get to decide for them. 

FearlessF

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40868 on: December 19, 2024, 11:02:49 AM »
They can and will decide whatever they want

I'd just like to end a current war.

If they think it's a better idear to keep fighting, great

as long as they're not spending my money
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40869 on: December 19, 2024, 11:06:31 AM »
They can and will decide whatever they want

I'd just like to end a current war.

If they think it's a better idear to keep fighting, great

as long as they're not spending my money

That part is completely fair.  

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40870 on: December 19, 2024, 11:13:04 AM »
Not your decision.

There is no negotiating with dickface putin.  There are no concessions that can be made that would in any way prevent future wars of aggression. 
Completely understood, but I will say with confidence that if this can end now, we'll see 4 years of peace in the region. 
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40871 on: December 19, 2024, 11:14:20 AM »
That part is completely fair. 

Yes, it is. We are bleeding money for a proxy war and people are dying as a result.

Full stop.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

utee94

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40872 on: December 19, 2024, 11:19:21 AM »
Completely understood, but I will say with confidence that if this can end now, we'll see 4 years of peace in the region.
Your definition of "peace" obviously doesn't include the ongoing rape and torture of Ukrainian civilians in the regions that have been illegally and brutally seized by Russia.  There is no such thing as "peace" in Russian occupied territories and there never will be. 

But even so, it's fine for American citizens to object to American dollars being spent there.  

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40873 on: December 19, 2024, 11:40:16 AM »
Your definition of "peace" obviously doesn't include the ongoing rape and torture of Ukrainian civilians in the regions that have been illegally and brutally seized by Russia.  There is no such thing as "peace" in Russian occupied territories and there never will be.

But even so, it's fine for American citizens to object to American dollars being spent there. 
By peace, I mean no more bombs.

Those atrocities are up to the spineless UN to address. Until THAT happens, the song remains the same. Same goes for the atrocities in China, Africa, etc.

The UN is another topic...
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

utee94

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40874 on: December 19, 2024, 11:45:51 AM »
I don't agree that it's up to the UN, for the precise reason that the UN is both spineless and toothless.

MikeDeTiger

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40875 on: December 19, 2024, 12:01:06 PM »
Not your decision.

There is no negotiating with dickface putin.  There are no concessions that can be made that would in any way prevent future wars of aggression. 

1)  "dickface Putin"--undoubtedly accurate.  Still, my understanding is believe it or not, he's considered their version of liberal, too passive in his expansion goals, for a lot of the oligarchs he has to keep happy, who are much more Soviet Union types and don't mind annexing a nation or two.  I think the guy is a thug and absolutely does not share western values, but I also think his actions are in part to keep people happy that he's got to keep happy. 

2)  That leads to the second part about no concessions being made that would prevent future wars of aggression.  That's what I think most people miss.  I think most people have no idea how Russians (in general) view Ukraine, and have always viewed Ukraine.  Right or wrong, in their mind, it is vital to their continued survival as a nation.  They're always going to be on the brink of doing something with Ukraine, no matter what, imo.  

Could they live in a "good-enough, so long as nothing changes, we're ok" state of affairs with Ukraine?  I don't know....the last time Trump was in office was the only presidential span Russia did not invade Ukraine in my adult life, so that's something, I guess.  But the US made the situation untenable for Russia with each step we pushed Ukraine towards NATO.  And our gub'ment knew that full well.  We blew up whatever chance "good-enough, so long as nothing changes, we're ok" ever had.  And we did it for.....???

At this point, I don't know what a good long-term solution is over there.  There are far worse dickfaces than Putin over there, and they exert pressure on the dickface in office.  I'm just not overly excited to do anything about Ukraine.  I don't mean to say what Russia is doing to people there is okay or that I have no sympathy for the average person there.  But Ukraine's government, and they, as a collective people, are also dickfaces.  They are every bit as corrupt as Russia, they also have no real sense of western values, and it shows up in what passes for hospitals, orphanages, and many other things there.  That is not a place that cares about its people, freedom, or anything else I'm interested in.  It's hard to stomach supporting them.  Yeah, they're smaller and would be toast for Russia without our help, but there's not much redeemable there that makes me think "Yes, send my tax dollars and one day maybe our troops to help them out."  

fyi, I'm not arguing with you, in case it comes across that way.  I'm just adding my own thoughts.  

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40876 on: December 19, 2024, 12:02:18 PM »
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MikeDeTiger

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40877 on: December 19, 2024, 12:13:08 PM »
they're smaller and would be toast for Russia without our help, but there's not much redeemable there that makes me think "Yes, send my tax dollars and one day maybe our troops to help them out." 

To paraphrase Raylen Givens, if one asshole criminal is beating on another asshole criminal, how is that my problem?  

Mdot21

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40878 on: December 19, 2024, 12:14:55 PM »
Positive news, perhaps?

Putin says he’s ‘ready’ for potential talks with Trump during year-end news conference | CNN
very positive news. new leadership in Washington will get on the phones and talk to their counterparts in Russia. current leadership- or lack of leadership I should say had flat refused to talk.

you make peace with your enemies, not your friends. not being able to have a dialogue with your adversaries is a sign of weakness, not strength. we have had the weakest leadership in the history of this country the last 4 years with a President whose brains were literally melting and a VP who was a fucking moron. who the hell was running the country? unelected bureaucrats that should mostly be thrown in jail aka inmates been running the damn asylum.

Mdot21

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40879 on: December 19, 2024, 12:15:44 PM »
The term potential talks doesn’t sound like much to me.  It can only end with Ukraine ceding land.
it was only ever going to end in that unless the United States fought a hot war with Russia.....which it's not going to do. fact that people didn't realize that day one is just lulz.

 

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