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Topic: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes

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medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35476 on: August 01, 2024, 02:55:13 PM »
The takeaway for me is the most likely victims of gun violence are violent felons. And in reality, the most likely victims in the spike of homicides have been violent felons. Draw your own conclusions on how much money we should spend stopping that.
So now you have 'owned it' and are you saying that the victims are subhuman garbage so we shouldn't spend any money keeping them from getting killed?  

I disagree with this for two reasons:

First, they are citizens and it may be possible to rehabilitate at least some of them.  

Second:
Their aim usually is not more than 'spray and pray', meaning a lot of bystanders get shot too.
^^^^This, exactly this.^^^^

If you want to know what urban gun crime really looks like I highly recommend an A&E show called "The First 48".  They follow homicide investigations for the first 48 hours after the report.  There is no script.  It isn't racially biased like the scripted fictional shows.  It is just real homicide investigations of real murders.  

The name of the show and the reason for the 48 hour window, according to the show's intro is based on some stat that if the cops don't have a solid lead in 48 hours, the murder will probably go unsolved.  

My two biggest take-aways from watching:
First, I previously thought that when the news talked about a "drug related murder" it was something like Tony Soprano taking out Tony Montana or vice-versa in an organized crime turf war over MILLIONS of dollars in drug profits.  The sad reality of modern urban America is that these "drug related murders" aren't high level fights between real-life versions of New Jersey Mob Boss Tony Soprano and Miami Mob Boss Tony Montana.  Instead the reality is usually some knucklehead spraying gunfire at a gathering hoping to hit or at least intimidate some other knucklehead that knucklehead #1 feels "dissed" him.  Either that or fights over dime bags.  

It was eye opening for me to learn that and it is frankly insane.  I'm not endorsing Soprano/Montana level killings, but I can understand that a rational person might decide it was worth risking a homicide rap to capture literally MILLIONS in drug trade.  I can't for the life of me understand how anyone can think that a dime bag is worth killing someone over.  Even if I completely ignored the morality of killing another person, I can't understand how anyone would think it was worth risking a homicide rap over something so trivial.  

Second, most of the murders on the show aren't "drug related", they are about "disrespect".  Mind you this is among knuckleheads who NOBODY should respect but it is what it is.  Knucklehead #1 does something to "diss" knucklehead #2 whereupon knucklehead #2 either pulls out a gun or goes somewhere (car, home, grandma's house) to retrieve his gun and proceeds to come back and, as @Cincydawg put it, "spray and pray" shooting up a whole park, party, backyard bbq, whatever.  

The appalling thing about these murders is the depravity of the killers.  They literally think that life is so meaningless that it is perfectly reasonable to kill someone over a trivial "disrespect" issue.  Worse, they think NOTHING of the lives of the innocent bystanders who are put at risk and sometimes killed in these "spray and pray" attacks.  

The knuckleheads described above are EXACTLY the people that we need to get guns away from.  Nearly EVERY killer in every episode I've seen had prior convictions.  Almost every time the cops get a name in one of the investigations they go to the database and pull up multiple mug shots from prior arrests for lesser but still violent crimes. 

The way to disarm these idiots is through a lot of police interactions.  The kinds of knuckleheads who spray gunfire at parties over trivial disrespect aren't generally very good at following other laws either so they tend to have stolen cars, expired or suspended licenses, outstanding warrants, prior felony convictions that prohibit possession of firearms, etc and they also tend to speed and otherwise recklessly operate motor vehicles.  If police pull over speeders (rather than mailing them tickets) the officer has an interaction with them.  They call in the name, check if the car and driver are licensed, check for warrants, look for contraband, etc.  

The interactions described in the foregoing paragraph declined precipitously due to BLM and the left-wing push for depolicing.  When those police interactions declined, chaos ensued.  That is so blindingly obvious that it is analogous to saying that night follows day.  The idiots who pushed this lunacy either knew better or were so depraved that they didn't care because:
"the most likely victims of gun violence are violent felons. And in reality, the most likely victims in the spike of homicides have been violent felons. Draw your own conclusions on how much money we should spend stopping that."

Those people, the left, have blood on their hands.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35477 on: August 01, 2024, 02:55:23 PM »
Yes - I didn't find there to be much to "depolicing," as I've stated repeatedly. I don't think the homicide rates had much to do with anything related to policing, just as their drop from the 1990's on had anything to do with policing. I find policing to be the most overrated factor in all conversations about crime.
Your imagination isn't factual.  Please try to keep up.  According to the NYT, police interactions dropped precipitously.  That is a fact.  It is also an admission against interest because I took it from a left wing rag specifically so that you couldn't just say "right wing misinformation."  

Police interactions dropped, that is a fact.  @MaximumSam says "I didn't find there to be much to 'depolicing' isn't factual, it is your imagination.  

Policing dropped and people died.  The left wing has blood on their hands.  Own it.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35478 on: August 01, 2024, 02:55:33 PM »
Once voted in like Chavez, they can be tough to pry loose.  They've had these fake elections for years now, and the head dude stays in.
You can vote your way into socialism but you have to shoot your way out.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35479 on: August 01, 2024, 03:10:57 PM »
In other news,

Dow tumbles over 500 points after fresh data ignite fears about slowing economy (msn.com)
I've mentioned this a few times but I've been seeing this coming for a few months.  I track municipal income tax receipts for a local municipality.  I do a chart of ttm (trailing twelve months for those not in the financial sector) receipts.  They peaked in the twelve months ending in March (April, 2023 through March, 2024).  Since then:
  • May-23 through April-24 was down 0.26% as compared to Apr-23 through March-24.  
  • June-23 through May-24 was down 0.37% as compared to May-23 through Apr-24 and 0.63% off peak.  
  • July-23 through June-24 was down 1.24% as compared to June-23 through May-24 and 1.86% off peak.  
  • August-23 through July-24 was up 0.19%* as compared to July-23 through June-24 still 1.67% off peak.  

These aren't big moves but they are consistent.  Three of the last four months have seen this measure drop.  It has been a long time since I've seen that . . . It happened in 2020 but that was due to the delayed filing deadline so it was only a timing issue not an actual decrease.  The time before that was during the 2008 credit bubble crash.  


*Note:
August-23 through July-24 was up slightly but that is actually a problem.  The way withholding tax gets collected for this city, the amount collected in July was withheld in May.  Well, May of 2024 had five Fridays (May 3, May 10, May 17, May 24, May 31).  May of 2023 had only the usual four.  Since most people are paid on Fridays, the City typically sees significant increases in revenue from the four or five five-Friday months each year.  That paltry 0.19% increase is MUCH lower than typical.  

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35480 on: August 01, 2024, 03:14:41 PM »
Is that sales tax you're talking about?
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35481 on: August 01, 2024, 03:23:11 PM »
Is that sales tax you're talking about?
Local Income Tax.

Ohio is somewhat unusual in that municipalities are funded mostly through what is called an "Income Tax" but as a practical matter is more of a "payroll tax".

Ie, what those #'s tell you is that payrolls in this locality are slightly but consistently down. 

It is only one locality. It is possible that we are an outlier, but I don't think so. We usually aren't. With the 2008 crash our drop, the timing of it, the severity of it, and the timing of the recovery tracked National results almost exactly. 

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35482 on: August 01, 2024, 03:36:03 PM »
Interesting tax strategy there. I've never heard of such a thing.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35483 on: August 01, 2024, 03:49:05 PM »
Interesting tax strategy there. I've never heard of such a thing.
You aren't the only one. We get people all the time who move here from other states, don't realize that Ohio Municipalities have Income Taxes, then get caught a few years later and dinged with back taxes, interest, and nonfiler penalties.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35484 on: August 01, 2024, 03:52:01 PM »
Yeah, I paid municipal income tax, flat rate, around 2% of everything nearly every year.

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35485 on: August 01, 2024, 03:54:00 PM »
Is there also a sales tax?
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35486 on: August 01, 2024, 04:03:19 PM »
Is there also a sales tax?
Yes, but it isn't Municipal. 

I realize that as a taxpayer you wouldn't care but on the other side, governments in Ohio are *MOSTLY* funded as follows:
  • Cities, income tax
  • Schools, property tax
  • Counties, sales tax
  • Townships, property tax
  • State, all of the above and more plus the lottery which is a tax on people who are bad at math.


Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35487 on: August 01, 2024, 04:09:35 PM »
I think sales tax where I was was 6%, but it was 0% on "groceries", including take out.  Oddly enough where I live now it's 8.9%, and our state income tax is slightly higher than in Ohio.

North Caroline had personal property tax, which really irked me, it was steep for a student.  I left without paying it my last year and they finally caught up to me.

847badgerfan

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35488 on: August 01, 2024, 04:15:13 PM »
We pay 6.5% sales. No state income tax. Property taxes are very low compared to what I got used to in Illinois.

Our place here would be about 4-5X more in tax if it were in Palatine, Cook County, IL.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #35489 on: August 01, 2024, 04:26:15 PM »
Florida taxes tourists, which is a great strategy for them.

My property tax is the same rate as in Ohio, give or take, but is a lot higher because the valuation is higher.

Move from a 3600 sf house to a condo and get chachinged.

 

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