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Topic: In other news (apolitical thread)...

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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1974 on: August 01, 2025, 06:55:08 AM »
Well I think your starting salary assumption is pretty optimistic.  Engineers and other STEM folks get that, while liberal arts types can be down in the 40-50K range.  You're really outlining a best case scenario, not an average or median one.
Engineering grads right out of school are commanding $85-90K/year right now. There are bidding wars. Don't ask me how I know this, because you know that I know that you know that I know.

Combined taxes on $140K would be more like $20K rather than the $35K tossed out. State income tax would be zero here, and $7K in Georgia.
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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1975 on: August 01, 2025, 06:57:40 AM »
A condo is an apartment you own, no rent, but an HOA.  Mine is over a grand per month.
I live in what is called a land condo.

We own the house and 3 feet of land around it. That's it.
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1976 on: August 01, 2025, 06:58:06 AM »
It could be tough to find a single family anywhere near ATL for $200 K that wasn't in a bad area and/or in really bad shape.  New housing is going to be pricey because land is pricey and builders make more profit if they sell pricey houses.  

1846 Shamrock Dr, Decatur, GA 30032 | For Sale ($200,000) | MLS# 7603037 | Redfin

I found this one, it doesn't appear to be "move in ready" and it's not in a great area.  The windows are boarded up, usually not a great sign.




Cincydawg

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1977 on: August 01, 2025, 06:59:26 AM »
I live in what is called a land condo.

We own the house and 3 feet of land around it. That's it.
I've heard the term "landominium".  There probably are some variations I've never heard of.

847badgerfan

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1978 on: August 01, 2025, 07:08:32 AM »
I don't think you could touch anything decent around here for $200K. Maybe a condo but not a house.

I can think of some areas with the same zip code where you probably could but would not want to.

This is the cheapest unit for sale in the Marina right now. Extremely dated.

601 Islamorada Blvd APT 24B, Punta Gorda, FL 33955 | MLS #C7510131 | Zillow

Found this for $175K. Would ya want it?

12474 Poem Ave, Punta Gorda, FL 33955 | MLS #224073542 | Zillow

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Gigem

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1979 on: August 01, 2025, 08:13:29 AM »
I kinda think we are talking about different things now. I am referring to stater homes for young married couples in a metropolitan area. I am just not able to process how an old 70’s 3BR2ba can cost upwards of $600-700,000 and how a younger married couple can live in an area like that. I gave an example of a house down the street from me for $290,000 and it’s brand new. 

bayareabadger

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1980 on: August 01, 2025, 08:13:58 AM »
in the city I live in, major Metro, but not one of the really notable ones, it appears there are 12 houses or condos for sale for under $200,000.

It’s a little funky because the city has a big footprint, so it’s not like there are any really close in suburbs.

Also, about 12 years ago I moved somewhere for a new job and ended up renting a room in someone’s house to save money when I first got there. The person told me they had bought there 1200 foot ranch home with a garage for about $80,000. I did not like living in that town, but for that rate, I would’ve considered it. 

FearlessF

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1981 on: August 01, 2025, 08:39:44 AM »
I live in what is called a land condo.

We own the house and 3 feet of land around it. That's it.
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utee94

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1982 on: August 01, 2025, 08:46:41 AM »
The phrasing of all this has been a bit unclear, in part because there aren’t many young married couples who are on starting salaries at all and a lot of young people these days don’t intend to have kids until their late 20s or early 30s anyway.

So if a couple is young and married, but don’t intend to have kids for a bit, they might stay with having an in-town place, live life, and then consider the ‘burbs when they need more space/schools. Or might just not want to live in the suburbs until economics forces it.
Yeah I think folks on this thread are talking about a couple of different things.

Not to put words in his mouth, but what I think Gigem is getting at, is that in some areas of the country-- perhaps many areas of the country not named California or downtown Atlanta-- there are options for younger people that aren't outrageously expensive.  California is a bit of an outlier here though and I don't really want to discuss it in this post, because even an OLD professional we know, on this very thread, has talked about his tale of loss and not being able to buy back into the market.  So I'd like to remove that type of situation from the discussion because although it has similar drivers, the bubble in California is a bit of its own thing.

So anyway I think Gigem's take might be stemming from a lot of the current complaints I, too,  commonly hear-- that owning housing simply isn't possible for young people, not the way it was for us, or for our parents' generation.  That we were the "lucky" ones and they are just completely shit outta luck.

The reality is, that the above isn't necessarily a true take.  Sure, a young professional or a young couple might not be able to afford something in downtown Atlanta.  But just because living in downtown Atlanta might be desirable for them, it doesn't make it the only option.

Cincy brought up the point that they might have to commute if they bought further out.

Well, duh.

My wife and I were young professionals making plenty of money and couldn't afford to live in downtown Austin, or anywhere near downtown Austin.  We had to buy in the suburbs and commute.  When I was working at AMD my commute was 45 minutes each way at peak traffic times.  This is true for pretty much everyone I know who is my age.  To varying degrees, we all had to move further away from the center of town than we would have liked, in order to be able to afford a house that fit within our budgets. 

I looked up "average home price in Austin" and the internet tells me it's $550,000 - $600,000.  Sure, that's a lot.  That's even more than my current house cost me 13 years ago. 

But I just found this listing for a house in Pflugerville-- a suburb just outside of Austin proper, between Austin and Round Rock.  $220,000 for a 1051 sqft 3-2.

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/16012-Windermere-Dr-Pflugerville-TX-78660/29452004_zpid/?

Sure that's not huge or glamorous.  It's a STARTER home.  It's sufficient for any young professional or young couple that would like to own rather than rent.  It's 15 miles away from downtown Austin, 28 minutes in current rush-hour traffic.  My first house was also 15 miles away from downtown Austin.  It cost $125,000 and that was 25 years ago.  $220,000 doesn't seem all that unreasonable given the increase in starting salaries since then. 

FearlessF

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1983 on: August 01, 2025, 08:53:02 AM »
Yeah I think folks on this thread are talking about a couple of different things.

Sure that's not huge or glamorous.  It's a STARTER home.  It's sufficient for any young professional or young couple that would like to own rather than rent.  It's 15 miles away from downtown Austin, 28 minutes in current rush-hour traffic.  My first house was also 15 miles away from downtown Austin.  It cost $125,000 and that was 25 years ago.  $220,000 doesn't seem all that unreasonable given the increase in starting salaries since then.
Ed Zachery - a starter home!

folks have choices - live downtown or in a house they can't afford and struggle financially - perhaps putting themselves in debt that can cause problems for decades or  choose the safe financial path with a starter home, build equity, save  for a rainy day, start a retirement account but live in the burbs in a starter home and commute.  
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1984 on: August 01, 2025, 09:11:54 AM »
I'm guessing folks living in some pretty luxurious apartment don't want a "starter home", which may also be part of the problem.  Their parents may have owned, as I did, a 3,000 sf suburban house on a half acre plus lot in a nice area.  So, they want the same, or nearly so.

So, a lot of good points here.  It can be done, outside CA anyway, it may not be the "house of your dreams" initially.  And you likely need two incomes at a pretty solid above average level.


FearlessF

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1985 on: August 01, 2025, 09:21:49 AM »
I bought a starter home in 1989 in a small town 7 miles from the small town I grew up in for $44,000.
a similar house in the town I wanted to live in was $70K - so, I commuted

I really didn't want to live in this town - I could have afforded the $70K house, but thought it silly to pay that price.

after divorce the starter home became enough home for me.  I'm still here.  over the decades I've saved money that could have gone into bigger homes in better locations and all the interest and other associated fees to realtors and bankers

just one reason that I'm now able to retire comfortably and buy a sports car.
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1986 on: August 01, 2025, 09:27:39 AM »
My daughter bought a small house north of Columbus maybe 15 years ago, lived there a bit, it needed some work, bought another house and rented the first house.  She told me she sold it for $240,000 a year or so back, having paid $83,000 originally.  She's been renting her other house and lives in Vancouver, BC.

The other topic here is whether RE markets are topping out or not.  I see a lot of corporate owned houses, my realtor friend says it's definitely a factor pushing prices up.  It starts to look like tulips at times.

If we hit an economic downturn, there could be some panic selling and the market would .... zip.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: In other news (apolitical thread)...
« Reply #1987 on: August 01, 2025, 09:41:37 AM »
Ed Zachery - a starter home!

folks have choices - live downtown or in a house they can't afford and struggle financially - perhaps putting themselves in debt that can cause problems for decades or  choose the safe financial path with a starter home, build equity, save  for a rainy day, start a retirement account but live in the burbs in a starter home and commute. 
However, there's another angle to this. A starter home out in the 'burbs might be more financially attainable, but it won't build as much equity and won't appreciate as quickly as a more expensive home in a more desirable location. 

Especially for a young couple starting out, I'd almost prefer to see them "stretch" a bit on the house, even if it means driving older cars and eating out less, than I'd see them skimp on the house so they can afford better cars, more leisure, more gas for their dreary long commutes, etc. Because not only is that money that you're "paying yourself" in that it builds equity, that home in the more desirable area will likely grow in value faster and higher than the less desirable area. 

For example, that house I bought in 2010 was certainly a financial stretch. But if I'd been able to keep it, considering the amount in principal I'd have paid down by now (14 years later) and the increase in value of the house, I'd probably be sitting on $750-800K in equity right now. Fast forward a few years to when my youngest graduates HS, and I might be able to cash out of that house for a million or more, and go buy elsewhere in the country like utee or Badge's neighborhoods for straight cash. 

You mention your $44K vs $70K decision. Any idea what the relative values of those two houses are now, 36 years later? 

 

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