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Topic: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost

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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #462 on: November 24, 2020, 10:55:30 AM »
I'm curious how Cover Zero could be zone.  Say I have three WRs, one in the slot, a typical arrangement, and two DBs and a safety to cover them in ZONE?

How does that work?  Maybe on goal line?  Or fourth and one, but I'm talking about a normal play.

If you play a three man zone D, I'm going to have my guys just sit in an open area all day, or flood one side with two guys against your one.
Only thing I can think of is in a compressed situation where there is no "deep" routes available because it's in the red zone. You could have 6-7 defenders in a shallow zone.

But by definition Cover 1/2/3/4/6 are all shell coverages where you have deep players in a zone. If you have only a shallow zone, where there is no man-to-man responsibility to follow a receiver deep, and nobody over the top, you're in big big trouble.

I've also heard, though, that Saban's scheme tends towards a zone/man hybrid, called pattern matching. But that is still at its base a man coverage, with the only real difference (as I understand it) being that the defenders assign their "man" responsibility based on receiver breaks off the LOS. I.e. if you're the outside corner and the outside WR breaks inside while the slot breaks outside, you and the defender inside of you will switch your man assignments based on those breaks. 

Cincydawg

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #463 on: November 24, 2020, 10:57:47 AM »
Obviously, you don't run Cover 2 on your own 5 yard line.  Anyway, the term was new to me.  And the Dawg QB hit a several long throws, and the Dawgs couldn't run worth spit.  I infer MSU really sold out to stop the run, a good plan, and was vulnerable over the top.


OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #464 on: November 24, 2020, 12:58:59 PM »
I'm curious how Cover Zero could be zone.  Say I have three WRs, one in the slot, a typical arrangement, and two DBs and a safety to cover them in ZONE?

How does that work?  Maybe on goal line?  Or fourth and one, but I'm talking about a normal play.

If you play a three man zone D, I'm going to have my guys just sit in an open area all day, or flood one side with two guys against your one.
I literally specified goal line and 4th-and-1. 

Nubbz needs to calm down.  Playing cover 0 otherwise doesn't make any sense.  MAYBE vs a wildcat formation, but not if you've shown it before (bc then the RB would throw).

I don't care what coaches call it, but there are zone defenses with no one deep.  Hell, goal line necessitates it (if you're in zone).  This is an odd thing to debate.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

MrNubbz

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #465 on: November 24, 2020, 01:02:56 PM »
The alignment isn't cover zero then.It's a man-zone hybrid scheme.Show me a playbook with that formation called as you referred to it.Remember that - CALM DOWN when barging in
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #466 on: November 24, 2020, 01:04:11 PM »
Obviously, you don't run Cover 2 on your own 5 yard line.  Anyway, the term was new to me.  And the Dawg QB hit a several long throws, and the Dawgs couldn't run worth spit.  I infer MSU really sold out to stop the run, a good plan, and was vulnerable over the top.


That could simply just be aggressive safety play - focusing too much on the QB and run game and not enough on being the deepest man.  

Would you ever predict UGA would win a game with 1 yard rushing or whatever it was?  No, so while damaging, the idea behind aggressive safety play towards the LOS made some sense.  They just did it too severely and for too long, I guess.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #467 on: November 24, 2020, 01:05:17 PM »
The alignment isn't cover zero then.It's a man-zone hybrid scheme.Remember that - CALM DOWN when barging in
It's not a man-zone hybrid if it's some sort of all-out blitz. 

It may be mostly utilized in HS vs a team that can't pass for shit, but it does exist, lol.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2020, 01:13:05 PM by OrangeAfroMan »
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

MrNubbz

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #468 on: November 24, 2020, 01:06:58 PM »
Where did you get blitz? I was refering to the very definition - your creating scenarios then naming them
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #469 on: November 24, 2020, 01:13:47 PM »
               S
HB                             HB
         C           FB
____E_  T__ _G ____G_   T _ E____
    E   T   G   C   G   T   E
               QB
        HB     FB     HB





1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #470 on: November 24, 2020, 01:17:31 PM »
Cover 0 simply suggests no one is responsible for the deep part of the field.

You threw in zone-man hybrid and I'm not sure why.  If I'm on the goal line or 99% sure the other team isn't going to take more than a 1-step drop, I may choose to not waste any of my defenders by playing them deep. 

I mentioned blitz to retort your hybrid.  If I'm playing Cover 0 and man-under, that would be odd, but feasible.  But, if I'm blitzing everyone between my DL and DBs, that "shell" with no one deep (of 4-6 players) is going to be responsible for the quick-action (if any) in front of them, as that field was abandoned by the blitzers.

I'm sorry you've never heard of Cover 0.  Suggesting it doesn't exist is arrogant I guess.  And odd to be arguing the point so much.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #471 on: November 24, 2020, 01:18:10 PM »
               S
HB                             HB
         C           FB
____E_  T__ _G ____G_   T _ E____
    E   T   G   C   G   T   E
               QB
        HB     FB     HB







Red Blaik?  lol
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #472 on: November 24, 2020, 01:19:24 PM »
I'm sorry you've never heard of Cover 0.  Suggesting it doesn't exist is arrogant I guess.  And odd to be arguing the point so much.
It was not that cover zero doesn't exist. It's that cover zero zone may not exist. 

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #473 on: November 24, 2020, 01:21:35 PM »
I literally just googled "Cover 0" and this was at the top (warning, it contains some words that may trigger you):
Cover 0 is a coverage scheme with zero deep defenders. This is an entirely man-to-man coverage shell that involves a heavy pass rush ‒ normally six or more defenders. Accordingly, Cover 0 is also called a “zero blitz.”

See, it simply means no one is deep.  
You can deploy it with man-to-man, as you said.
Gasp - the word SHELL!
A heavy pass rush with 6 defenders....hmm, sounds like a BLITZ to me.

Maybe you've heard it called a zero blitz.  Maybe it's just a thing you haven't been exposed to.  Either way, yeah, calm down.  LOL
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #474 on: November 24, 2020, 01:22:55 PM »
It was not that cover zero doesn't exist. It's that cover zero zone may not exist.
It definitely does in high school.  Meh, I'm not bothered by it.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

MrNubbz

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #475 on: November 24, 2020, 01:29:41 PM »
Putting something in red by your definition doesn't mean that is how it is defined.Go back to page 32 and reread what CD said.He mentioned

"I heard the term "Cover Zero" from the Dawg QB, I had not heard that before, I understand the meaning, I'm not sure why the term had escaped me, maybe they just call it man to man otherwise?  He was commenting that Miss State was in Cover Zero fairly often and that is why he went up top (duh)."

No where is a blitz or a zone mentioned I'll make it easy for you
What is cover zero in the NFL?

Cover Zero is an entirely man-to-man coverage that employs a heavy pass rush and has no deep safeties on the back end. It’s a high-risk, high-reward defense that can end up with a sack just as likely as it can end up with a big gain for the offense,

Either way quit talking out your dank crevasse when attempting to correct someone
« Last Edit: November 24, 2020, 01:35:16 PM by MrNubbz »
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

 

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