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Topic: Rankings ... ugh

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FearlessF

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2240 on: May 24, 2024, 08:39:40 AM »
yes sir

I'm searching for the page

wondering about 83 Nebraska as a non-champ
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

FearlessF

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2241 on: May 24, 2024, 09:44:50 AM »
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2242 on: May 24, 2024, 11:46:38 AM »
This is a good illustration about another thing about rankings.  Some folks might have a bar discussion obviously over the ten best teams and maybe argue about 4 vs 5.  Most everyone agrees about BYU.  I doubt anyone seriously cares about whether 18 should be 20 or 30 should be 27.  You could throw the teams in the middle of this and stir them up and spit out a random ranking that would be probably OK. 
Yes, that's why I shared clusters of teams for the most part.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Cincydawg

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2243 on: May 24, 2024, 11:48:55 AM »
Another ranking, and there is some above, would be "best team not named NC that year".  I can make a solid argument for Pitt in 1980 for example.  I know there are many.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2244 on: May 24, 2024, 11:59:00 AM »
yes sir

I'm searching for the page

wondering about 83 Nebraska as a non-champ
I went year-by-year.  School year just ended.  I have time to kill.

83 Nebraska doesn't make my list, as they weren't the NC, nor were they the top-rated team (Auburn was, with that schedule).
They rank well above 83 Miami, near the middle of the NCs list....maybe around the 40-45% percentile.
83 Nebraska is in a cluster with 79 Bama and 87 Miami.
If I had to describe them, they'd be a poor man's 19 LSU:  huge O, not great D (for an elite team), but with a weaker schedule.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2245 on: May 24, 2024, 12:06:41 PM »
2 things:
First, I may be using rankings and ratings interchangeably, and I shouldn't.  SRS is a rating, and I took the time to rank them by their rating.
Second, non-NC 73 OU has a higher rating than 71 Nebraska.  So a non-NC has the highest rating of the last 50-some years. 
.
Those Sooners played 7 top-20 teams.  They tied #1, had a close win vs another, then beat the shit out of the other five.  And destroyed all the unranked opponents as well.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2246 on: May 24, 2024, 01:16:03 PM »
Ranked by rating:
73 OU (non-NC)
71 Nebraska
72 USC
70 Texas
20 Bama
70 Nebraska
71 OU (non-NC)
74 OU
19 OSU (non-NC)
95 Nebraska
cluster: 
77 ND
18 Clemson
91 Warshington
01 Miami
72 OU (non-NC)
94 Penn St (non-NC)
« Last Edit: May 24, 2024, 01:21:41 PM by OrangeAfroMan »
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

847badgerfan

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2247 on: May 24, 2024, 04:24:15 PM »
You are doing some great work here 'Fro.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2248 on: May 24, 2024, 08:14:58 PM »
Busy work maybe.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Rankings ... ugh
« Reply #2249 on: May 24, 2024, 10:41:33 PM »
A fun aspect of SRS is that it has both an offensive and defensive rating. 
I looked at defenses only and did the same exercise as before.  I jotted down whoever the NC's defense rating was as well as whoever the best (or next best if it was the NC's) defenses were.  Here's what I found:
2021 Georgia has the best defense rating ever.  Comfortably ahead of #2.
Remember, this is simply how they performed against who they played.  No style points, no fame or fortune, no draft stock or recruiting stars.  Just the facts, ma'am.

Behind the Dawgs, we have a pair of non-NCs:  85 UM and 72 OU.  Like with the overall ratings, non-NCs are among the best of all-time.

Then there's 2012 Alabama.  The 2011 Tide D had the legendary pass D, but the '12 version was better overall.
Then another pair of non-NCs:  73 OSU and 17 Bama.

We have a cluster after that:  18 Clemson, 11 Bama, 91 Miami
Then 11 LSU, 00 FSU, 16 Bama, 09 Bama, 71 Nebraska, 08 USC
One could make the claim that Saban's defenses during their run of NCs were the best of all time, as a program. 
Close cluster after that:  23 UM, 01 Miami, 97 UM
Yes, this year's Wolverine D rates as good as the 97 unit. 
Small gap.
02 OSU, 93 FSU, 23 OSU, 18 Miss St, 86 OU, 74 UM
.
Some defenses with great reputations that sort of finished down in the 'others receiving votes' level:
2000 OU, 99 FSU, 78 Bama and 92 Bama rate in the lower third of all NCs.  Those surprised me. 

I must mention an all-time great defense across several seasons:  87-88-89 Auburn under Pat Dye.  All non-NCs, but all ranking very highly.  With this quick once-over, they'd be my vote for 2nd-best multi-season defense of all-time.

Nebraska is on both lists (NCs, non-NCs) plenty, so you understand where the Blackshirts notoriety came from. 
1980 Pitt rates a very pedestrian middle ground in the non-NCs list and overall.  That's interesting.

Now for the ugly list:
Worst NC defense rating:  2010 Auburn...which makes what Newton did all the more amazing.
Next-worst raised my eyebrow:  68 OSU. 
03 USC is next.  Wow!
All worse than 84 BYU.  Yeeesh.
Next ugly cluster:  19 LSU, 14 OSU, 07 LSU, 96 Florida
.
Some noteworthy takeaways from non-NC defenses:
22 Iowa is toward the lower end
In 2006, no one had a particularly good defense.  Outlier season.
2020 N'Western's defense rates about the same as their 95 defense.
.
I think teams and fans really take pride in a strong defense, more so than a big O.  I guess that's why I chose this side of the ball first. 
Any thoughts?
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

 

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