header pic

Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

The 'Old' CFN/Scout Crowd- Enjoy Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching 'takes' and discussing topics surrounding the game. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE site and to take part in our community- a community with you- the user, the fan, -and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean place to interact.


Author

Topic: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model

 (Read 782 times)

OrangeAfroMan

  • Stats Porn
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 14287
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #42 on: May 18, 2022, 07:04:38 PM »
I find it interesting that 12 to 14 teams = this 3+5+5 model, but once you get to 16, it's pod city.
.
A 16 team pod could be described as 3+4+2+2
.
Wouldn't that be fun?  If the B1G changed to an 8-game conference slate and the SEC to a 9-gamer?  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Brutus Buckeye

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 10003
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #43 on: May 18, 2022, 08:04:25 PM »
It's not about ducking, it's about some semblance of equity.  No one said anything about a cakewalk.  How can you be so radically wrong about so many different things?!?
If Penn State and Michigan are off of the schedule, it's a cakewalk. 

If their biggest challenge is "gee, I hope Purdue doesn't catch us napping again" then what the Hell is the point? It's like playing the old NCAA video game on "JV Mode." 
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

ELA

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 15847
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #44 on: May 18, 2022, 10:36:24 PM »
If Penn State and Michigan are off of the schedule, it's a cakewalk.

If their biggest challenge is "gee, I hope Purdue doesn't catch us napping again" then what the Hell is the point? It's like playing the old NCAA video game on "JV Mode."
Nah, it was the Heisman mode where Purdue would randomly pick you off 6 times and you were convinced the game was rigged

medinabuckeye1

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5610
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #45 on: May 19, 2022, 11:22:25 AM »
I find it interesting that 12 to 14 teams = this 3+5+5 model, but once you get to 16, it's pod city.
I think it is because of some things that everyone "knows" but most people haven't really thought through.  

I've spent some time in the past working out hypothetical schedules and anytime you have a divisionless CG with more than one conference team missed you have to follow the rule that no two teams that miss each other can also miss a common third team.  

That made it sound extremely complicated so an example will make it easier:
  • If Ohio State doesn't play Iowa and Purdue then Iowa and Purdue HAVE to play each other.  

The obvious reason is that if you have three teams not playing each other then you have the possibility of ending up with three undefeated teams.  Ie:
  • If Ohio State doesn't play Iowa and Purdue, and
  • Iowa doesn't play Ohio State and Purdue, and
  • Purdue doesn't play Ohio State and Iowa, then
  • It is possible for Ohio State, Iowa, and Purdue to all go undefeated.  

This is important, I think, because while it sucks when your team is one of three with one loss that misses out it is a completely different thing for an undefeated team to miss out.  Ie, if Ohio State, Iowa, and Purdue all go 8-1 and my Buckeyes miss the CG due to tiebreakers I obviously would be disappointed but I'd understand and just figure "well that sucks but it happens".  However, if Ohio State, Iowa, and Purdue all go 9-0 and my Buckeyes miss the CG due to tiebreakers I'd be livid.  My team beat everybody in front of them, how can they not even have a chance at the league title?  

In theory you can figure this all out in your head but as a practical matter it is a lot easier to basically create "quasi-divisions" where all the teams in each play each other and then miss some fraction of the other.  

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 16659
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #46 on: May 19, 2022, 12:12:02 PM »
if Ohio State, Iowa, and Purdue all go 9-0...
...the B1G brass would figure out a way to pair Ohio State and Michigan in the CCG.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

medinabuckeye1

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5610
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #47 on: May 19, 2022, 03:41:50 PM »
...the B1G brass would figure out a way to pair Ohio State and Michigan in the CCG.
LoL.  For reasons of ratings/revenue I'm sure they'd try to make sure that tOSU was in but they wouldn't actually jump a team with a worse record into it even if that worse record team was named tOSU or Michigan.  

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 16659
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #48 on: May 19, 2022, 03:48:28 PM »
Depends who they think is the better team perhaps. Or maybe the playoff committee rankings??
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

FearlessF

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 24102
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #49 on: May 19, 2022, 04:18:17 PM »
it doesn't have to be logical or fair

the only logic is $$$
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

MrNubbz

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 12279
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #50 on: May 19, 2022, 06:17:20 PM »
...the B1G brass would figure out a way to pair Ohio State and Michigan in the CCG.
As long as UW keeps tanking in or before INDY what's it to you 😁

  



« Last Edit: May 19, 2022, 06:27:59 PM by MrNubbz »
"The longer I live, the more convinced am I that this planet is used by other planets as a lunatic asylum." - George Bernard Shaw

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 16659
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #51 on: May 20, 2022, 07:32:37 AM »
UW has not the payroll of OSU, and never will.

The last time UW beat OSU was 2010. 

I'm glad to have been there to witness the Badgers' final win against the evil empire.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

medinabuckeye1

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5610
  • Liked:
Re: Conferences with the 3+5+5 scheduling model
« Reply #52 on: May 20, 2022, 09:45:01 AM »
UW has not the payroll of OSU, and never will.

The last time UW beat OSU was 2010.

I'm glad to have been there to witness the Badgers' final win against the evil empire.
Eh, things are cyclical.  As an Ohio State fan I'm obviously enjoying the current run but things change.  

Wisconsin lost 21 in a row to the Buckeyes from 1960-1980 by an average score of 33-8.  That included shutouts of:
  • 21-0 in 1989
  • 59-0 in 1979
  • 42-0 in 1977
  • 56-0 in 1975
  • 24-0 in 1973
That was preceded by a Wisconsin win in 1959, a tie in 1958, six more tOSU wins (1952-1957), another tie (1951, Woody's first year), then three more tOSU wins (1948-1950.  In total from 1948-1980 Wisconsin went 1-30-2 against Ohio State with an average score of 28-10.  Then things changed dramatically with Wisconsin winning five out of seven against the Buckeyes from 1981-1987.  This is amazing when you consider that prior to the 1981 win Wisconsin had only beaten Ohio State seven times ever and their prior five wins took place over nearly 70 years:
  • 12-3 in 1959 in Madison
  • 20-7 in 1946 in Madison
  • 17-7 in 1942 in Madison
  • 14-3 in 1918 in Columbus
  • 21-0 in 1915 in Madison


Looking at the series overall:
  • Wisconsin was the stronger program when Ohio State first joined the league and won four of the first six going 4-2 from 1913 (tOSU's first year in the league) through 1918.  
  • Ohio State flat out dominated for a LONG time going 37-3-4 from 1919-1980
  • Wisconsin went 5-2 from 1981-1987
  • Ohio State won four straight from 1988-1991
  • The series was pretty even with Ohio State holding just an 8-6-1 edge from 1992-2010
  • Ohio State has won eight straight since the 2010 loss including three B1GCG's (59-0 in 2014, 27-21 in 2017, and 34-21 in 2019).  

The spacing of the games in a little goofy:
  • Eight years in a row from 1913-1920 then not again until
  • Four years in a row from 1930-1933 then not again until
  • H&H in 1941/42 then a year off then
  • Three years in a row from 1944-1946 then a year off then
  • 49 years in a row from 1948-1996 then two years off then
  • Six years in a row from 1999-2004 then two years off then 
  • Seven years in a row from 2007-2013
  • Played in the B1GCG in 2014 but not scheduled to play then a year off
  • Played in 2016
  • Played in the B1GCG in 2017 but not scheduled to play then a year off
  • Twice in 2019 (scheduled and B1GCG)

Those last eight aren't a knock on Wisconsin.  Of the seven tOSU teams that have beaten Wisconsin since 2010 only the 2011 team finished with more than two losses.  The other six finished:
  • Undefeated in 2012
  • 1 loss to VaTech and won the NC in 2014
  • 1 loss in 2019 to Clemson in the CFP Semi-Final (this team beat UW twice)
  • 2 losses in 2017 (CFP Participant OU and Iowa)
  • 2 losses in 2016 (PSU and in the CFP Semi-Final to Clemson)
  • 2 losses in 2013 (MSU and Clemson)


 

Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.