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Topic: Misfits Thread

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FearlessF

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8792 on: September 09, 2020, 01:02:52 PM »
oh Lord now we have to hear all the gnashing of teeth and screaming from the left

only Obama is worthy enough
I just left that here to stir the pot
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

FearlessF

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8793 on: September 09, 2020, 01:04:23 PM »

This was filmed up at 5th Street and Hennepin Avenue downtown. Nothing on that end of town was put to the torch.



MPD shot paintballs at people that were out on their own porch. This was in the Wedge neighborhood, just north of Lake Street.
come on, Minneapolis cops are known racists and very aggressive
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bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8794 on: September 09, 2020, 01:09:22 PM »

Again, behavior is generally addressed in contracts that school employees agree to. My guess is that he violated his contract.

I was on our local school board for a few years. There were a few discussions with teachers and other employees engaging in conduct that was in violation of their contract in regards to their behavior and its negative affect on the schools image. And yes, this was a public school. You may not agree with it, but it was never challenged in court and the union agreed to the contract.
The behavior in this case would be what? Cursing in public? Cursing about other government employees?

If memory serves, there's a lot of protections when it comes to public employees making statements on political issues. Usually the way around that is if it makes it difficult to actually do their job. Perhaps saying such things does that, though it seems a tad suspect.

This is a good breakdown of it. https://www.popehat.com/2018/04/18/lawsplainer-can-a-state-university-fire-a-professor-for-being-an-ass-on-twitter/

NorthernOhioBuckeye

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8795 on: September 09, 2020, 01:12:50 PM »
The behavior in this case would be what? Cursing in public? Cursing about other government employees?

If memory serves, there's a lot of protections when it comes to public employees making statements on political issues. Usually the way around that is if it makes it difficult to actually do their job. Perhaps saying such things does that, though it seems a tad suspect.

This is a good breakdown of it. https://www.popehat.com/2018/04/18/lawsplainer-can-a-state-university-fire-a-professor-for-being-an-ass-on-twitter/

It depends upon the standards of conduct in the contract that was signed. F everyone that he disagrees with may be in violation of his contract. But again, I can only speculate. I can say that this would have gotten him a disciplinary hearing at our school. While I can't speak for the other board members at the time, he would have had to come up with a pretty good defense to keep his job as far as I would have been concerned.  

longhorn320

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8796 on: September 09, 2020, 01:13:05 PM »
The behavior in this case would be what? Cursing in public? Cursing about other government employees?

If memory serves, there's a lot of protections when it comes to public employees making statements on political issues. Usually the way around that is if it makes it difficult to actually do their job. Perhaps saying such things does that, though it seems a tad suspect.

This is a good breakdown of it. https://www.popehat.com/2018/04/18/lawsplainer-can-a-state-university-fire-a-professor-for-being-an-ass-on-twitter/

it all depends on what is in his contract
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NorthernOhioBuckeye

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8797 on: September 09, 2020, 01:16:47 PM »
As usual, what Trump may have claimed to be doing and what is actually happening are not identical...

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/09/factchecking-trumps-fox-news-interview-2/

So Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria are almost identical levels to the end of the Obama admin.

Overall overseas is down 7%.

Of the ones being pulled out of that dangerous war-torn nation you mentioned [Germany], half would simply be redeployed within Europe.

It sounds of course like he's trying to make a big election push to pull down numbers... He's pulling out all the stops.

From the article you posted:

Quote
Citing Pentagon leaders, the Washington Post reported in late July that Trump was making a concerted push to significantly reduce overseas troop levels by Election Day in November. But despite the president’s efforts to fulfill his 2016 campaign promise to significantly reduce the number of U.S. troops serving overseas, the article notes, “Trump has been stymied at virtually every turn” as members of his administration and military leaders “have talked Trump out of specific withdrawals or employed delaying tactics.”

Ok, he was not able to get it done, but he appears to be trying to get troops back home. That would be better than sending more troops in, don't you think?

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8798 on: September 09, 2020, 01:19:29 PM »

When you live in a civil society, there are certain rules put in place that you are expected to live by. When you don't, society employs law enforcement to deal with you.

In the cases you allude too, said individuals were reported to have violated the rules that society agreed to live within. In so doing, they grabbed the attention of law enforcement that is charged with enforcing those laws.

When the person reportedly breaking those laws is confronted by LEO's, they have a choice. Comply with the LEO's instructions or decide to fight them. Being as in this country, we allow LEO's to carry lethal force, it is not a smart move by the suspect, to decide to fight. Even then, in almost all cases, the LEO's attempted to subdue the suspect using non-lethal force. However, when the suspect gained the upper hand and put the LEO's life in danger, the LEO resorted to lethal force.

The question here is why do ignore the responsibility of the suspect to follow the law and comply with the LEO's instructions?

As to the allegation of pepper spray, it was not used until the "protesters" turned violent and disregarded law orders by LEO's. You know, like burning down the neighborhood after looting it. 
From this we can read that often the government is in strong position to curtail individual rights. Or at the very least, when any manner of law is broken, those rights are too a degree forfeit. And once those rights are to some degree or another forfeit, the government, by means of if its employees is in the right should it take your life. 

You have asked why one might ignore the responsibility of a suspect to kowtow to to the government, and it speaks to a certain outlook. It is the citizen responsible to the government employee. The government employee is to many degrees shielded from responsibility, certianly to the citizen. 

Now, at times the government must step on our rights, as you have said. It is not a black or white thing. But is is interesting for sure. 

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8799 on: September 09, 2020, 01:25:01 PM »
It depends upon the standards of conduct in the contract that was signed. F everyone that he disagrees with may be in violation of his contract. But again, I can only speculate. I can say that this would have gotten him a disciplinary hearing at our school. While I can't speak for the other board members at the time, he would have had to come up with a pretty good defense to keep his job as far as I would have been concerned. 
That seems unlikely and potentially unenforceable. 

If my government job can force me to not say uncouth things about government employees that doesn't pretty directly impact my job, what's to say they can't work in the mayor, or the governor?

Now it might've landed a disciplinary hearing (there's no penalty for infringing on rights unless it's forced), and most people back off because the secret is fighting because something is legal is more often than not more of a hassle than just being quiet. Most people aren't going to spend to go to the mattresses for their rights, and thus their government employers can step on some of them.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8800 on: September 09, 2020, 01:25:21 PM »

https://youtu.be/85Ut0jNIIfY

This was filmed up at 5th Street and Hennepin Avenue downtown. Nothing on that end of town was put to the torch.


https://youtu.be/LozQg0oX-Gw

MPD shot paintballs at people that were out on their own porch. This was in the Wedge neighborhood, just north of Lake Street.
The White liberals on the porch in the second video were thoroughly warned. Asked to get in their house multiple times, they didn't. Then they had the paint guns pointed at them. They still wouldn't budge. Then they shot one or two paint balls, and they finally got the point and went inside. 
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8801 on: September 09, 2020, 01:28:28 PM »
From the article you posted:

Ok, he was not able to get it done, but he appears to be trying to get troops back home. That would be better than sending more troops in, don't you think?
No argument there. I'll give him credit for that. 

Of course, as commander in chief, it's one of the few areas where he should be able to overrule his underlings who 'talked him out of it'. 

But one area that he has been pretty consistent as far as I can tell is that his public statements have wanted to bring more home.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8802 on: September 09, 2020, 01:31:50 PM »
The White liberals on the porch in the second video were thoroughly warned. Asked to get in their house multiple times, they didn't. Then they had the paint guns pointed at them. They still wouldn't budge. Then they shot one or two paint balls, and they finally got the point and went inside.
At what point were they violent, again?

Now, they didn't do what the cops asked. Partly that's because it's called "protest". Peaceful civil disobedience is common at a protest. 

So who escalated this to violence? The peaceful protestors, or the cops?

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8803 on: September 09, 2020, 01:32:29 PM »
The White liberals on the porch in the second video were thoroughly warned. Asked to get in their house multiple times, they didn't. Then they had the paint guns pointed at them. They still wouldn't budge. Then they shot one or two paint balls, and they finally got the point and went inside.
The government can tell me when I can sit on my porch on my property? If I'm doing nothing but watching what's happening on my street? Interesting.

Oh, and when someone doesn't respond, the government has the right to do low-end damage to the house? 

MaximumSam

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8804 on: September 09, 2020, 01:33:34 PM »
« Last Edit: September 09, 2020, 02:03:53 PM by MaximumSam »

Riffraft

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #8805 on: September 09, 2020, 01:34:15 PM »
You were responding to OAM, but . . . .
I think that the "quotation" that OAM did falls under the category of satire.  I've seen that construction used by other posters on this board.
History is not incidents that happened in the past.  It is the study of those incidents.
It's sort of like the military's distinction between information and intelligence.  Information is just random stuff.  Intelligence is the product of analyzing information for its probable truth, it's significance, etc.  History is the analysis of what happened in the past using what sources we have for those events.  And you never have enough sources that are reliable enough, so you are always making a choice as to whether or how an event happened, and as to whether it is significant or not.
The casual term "a history" as in the question to which you responded just meant "does he do this often?"  Citing one example does not really prove that he does.
For example, "Does Joe Biden have a history of misstatements and/or embarrassing statements?"  The answer would be that, yes he does, and you could cite his plagiarized campaign biography from the '80s, his claims to have graduated at the top of his law school class, his statement about Barack Obama being "a clean negro who speaks articulately" (or words to that effect), him telling a guy he wanted to recognize to stand up when he was in a wheelchair, and on and on and on.  He's a gaffe machine.
Does he have a history of threatening to whip people's asses?  He's done it more than once, I'm pretty sure.
IMO, Biden is no great candidate.  He's flamed out in every national race he has been in and he may well flame out this one too.  He is sometimes called the wise old head in the Democratic Party, but he strikes me as the village idiot.  I thought that he was dumber than everybody's favorite whipping girl Sarah Palin in 2008, and that's a low bar to get under.
But he's not, IMO, nearly as awful as Donald J. Trump, who is our worst President since Andrew Johnson. if not our worst ever.
So would two incident constitute "a history", since I responding to one incident with another incident?

Personally I wasn't interested in writing a dissertation on what constitutes the study of history. I was responding, in kind, to the type of response I received. If you want to defend the way OAM responded to my post and how he generally responses to people he doesn't agree with feel free.

And I think that CincyDawg did a better job displaying that there were more than 2 incidents. 

And just so everyone knows, I have not voted for a Democrat or Republican for President since 1988. And there is a good chance I won't again in this election, though I must confess the unreasonable over the top Trump haters are causing me to reconsider and actually vote for him.  Overall, other than his tweets, his constant hyperbole and in general the way he communicates, I think he has done a good job.  Moving out of all these foreign entanglements, reducing so many regulations and I could go on. Personally I thought his raising tariffs was a mistake, I am a free-trader, but it seem to have work. That said, he hasn't done enough to shrink the government, it hasn't done enough to reduce spending and cutting government programs that need to go away. He has a tendency to want to centralized power rather than decentralize.  All things I think need to be done, but no Republican or Democrat on the national level have done it or has the will to do it, which is why I don't vote for them. 

 

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