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Topic: North Carolina hires Mack Brown

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longhorn320

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #98 on: September 30, 2019, 01:40:07 PM »
If I have the better team I pick overtime which involves many more variables then running just

one play
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BrownCounty

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #99 on: September 30, 2019, 04:22:34 PM »
If I have the better team I pick overtime

I have always believed that if you are a heavy underdog, and somehow you have squirreled your way into having a chance - avoid OT at all cost.

And no, it doesn't always work.

FearlessF

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #100 on: September 30, 2019, 04:41:43 PM »
nothing works all the time

just because it did or didn't work last Saturday doesn't mean it was the right or wrong answer
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #101 on: September 30, 2019, 05:10:36 PM »
Yeah, no.  If you have the momentum and the home crowd, then gambling everything on one play that they know is coming in regulation, versus an entire set of downs in OT, doesn't make any sense at all.

I'm quite comfortable with my opinion here.  But y'all feel free to continue advocating the strategy that we know didn't work.

FearlessF

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #102 on: September 30, 2019, 06:06:47 PM »
I'm quite comfortable with opinion as well.

and there's absolutely no way for you to prove my opinion wrong

but, feel free to try
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #103 on: September 30, 2019, 06:07:52 PM »
I don't need to prove your wrong.  Mack Brown took care of that for me on Saturday. ;)



FearlessF

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #104 on: September 30, 2019, 06:10:01 PM »
but, you have no way to know with any certainty that Mack would have won the game if he had kicked the point to possibly take the game to OT

two wrongs don't make a right 
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #105 on: September 30, 2019, 06:12:39 PM »
I know for sure that going for two, and failing, ended the game for the North Carolina Tar Heels.  That is a certainty.

And that's all I need to know to rest assured that I am correct.

longhorn320

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #106 on: September 30, 2019, 07:04:46 PM »
I know for sure that going for two, and failing, ended the game for the North Carolina Tar Heels.  That is a certainty.

And that's all I need to know to rest assured that I am correct.
not trying to gang up on ya utee but Mack's team was outgunned at every position

2nd guessing after the results is fine but in reality I feel going for 2 gave him the best shot at a win

but again thats just my opinion 

had he been successful Mack would have been written up as being wise and crafty
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

BrownCounty

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #107 on: September 30, 2019, 08:17:03 PM »
Just pulling numbers out of the air, I would give UNC a 60% chance of converting the go-for-2.

I would give them say a 40% chance of beating Clemson in an OT shootout.

So I go for it.

BrownCounty

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #108 on: September 30, 2019, 08:17:37 PM »
Yeah, no.

What is this, a Ben Stiller impression.

utee94

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #109 on: September 30, 2019, 09:06:35 PM »
not trying to gang up on ya utee but Mack's team was outgunned at every position

2nd guessing after the results is fine but in reality I feel going for 2 gave him the best shot at a win

but again thats just my opinion

had he been successful Mack would have been written up as being wise and crafty
It's alright, I can take it. :)

utee94

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #110 on: October 01, 2019, 07:50:31 AM »
What is this, a Ben Stiller impression.

Yeah, normally I do Seinfeld but I'm trying to mix it up these days.

CWSooner

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Re: North Carolina hires Mack Brown
« Reply #111 on: October 01, 2019, 12:37:13 PM »
Stewart Mandel is not the last word on college football, but he is a reasonably astute observer and analyst of the scene.

THE ATHLETIC: Mandel’s Forward Pass: Despite little movement atop the polls, the pool of national title contenders is growing
By Stewart Mandel Sep 30, 2019

. . . Within seconds of his team scoring a touchdown with 1:17 remaining to cut its deficit against Clemson to 21-20, the camera caught Mack Brown on the sideline holding up two fingers. At that moment, you knew the UNC coach was one play from either being lauded as a national hero or ripped as if it were 2013 and he was back at Texas.

Sure enough, when an ill-advised speed-option play went nowhere, the game broadcasters, Twitter and armchair QBs everywhere wondered why he didn’t just opt for the game-tying extra point.  “Our best chance to win was to go for two,” Brown said afterward.

Earlier Saturday, Northwestern coach Pat Fitzgerald elicited near-universal bewilderment by unsuccessfully going for two twice in the fourth quarter against Wisconsin, first when his team cut the score to 24-9 with 8:45 remaining and then again at 24-15 with 4:10 left. Had he just kicked both times, the Wildcats could have been down just a touchdown by then rather than nine points.

Fitzgerald came to his postgame news conference ready to explain/lecture — complete with a chart.
“When you’re down 15, you go for two because those are the analytics that we pull to try and shorten the game and have less possessions to win the game,” he said. “… You can’t ever know what’s going to happen next, but you have to assume that we have to score as many points right here, right now. That’s the thought process behind that.”

Fitzgerald might be one of the first major college coaches to openly cite game-management analytics, but he won’t be the last. Many NFL coaches already subscribe to it, resulting in a notable increase in that league in the past few years in attempted two-pointers. In fact, in his comments, Fitzgerald cited a video of Baltimore Ravens coach John Harbaugh from last week explaining the math behind going for two down 11 points in the fourth quarter against the Chiefs.

In general, coaches embracing modern analytics is a good thing. But there’s one flaw with going strictly by probabilities: They’re not tailored to the specific game being played.

Fitzgerald is correct that going for two down 15 gets the analytics seal of approval; however, his offense, which is currently tied for last in all of FBS in yards per play (3.9), had managed just 99 yards through three quarters Saturday. When it finally scored a touchdown, it came after Wisconsin muffed a punt at its own 32. The idea that the Cats would suddenly overpower the Badgers’ defense from 2 yards out seems … improbable.

Brown, on the other hand, absolutely made the right decision. Not because of the math, which says UNC’s win probability would be the same either way, but because Clemson was the far more talented team. While the Tigers struggled to sustain drives Saturday, their chances of winning a series of 25-yard chess matches when they have Lawrence, Tee Higgins, Justyn Ross and Travis Etienne would seemingly be much higher than UNC’s.

“We had been out there a lot on defense and were worn down, and they had more depth than we had,” Brown said. “I just felt like it was our chance.”

Unfortunately, OC Phil Longo’s play call, which Clemson apparently saw coming, did not help his boss look smart for it. But perhaps they and coaches everywhere will have an opportunity to get better educated about these decisions very soon.

“I’d love to (teach) a class at Northwestern on analytics,” Fitzgerald said.
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