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Topic: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas

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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16758 on: December 23, 2021, 07:28:39 PM »
Quote from: ELA on December 23, 2021, 07:15:42 PM
If we had a pandemic of motorcycle crashes filling up the ICUs, and 88% of the ones hospitalized weren't wearing helmets, then yeah, they would only get a bed if one wasn't needed
Heh, you avoided smokers I see.

All of them are unfairly over-utilizing scarce resources.  If you're truly only concerned with resource utilization, and you have a problem with one class doing so, then I'd expect you to have a problem with all classes doing so.

If you only choose to single out one class, then it's something other than a resource-driven discussion.

Another and less charitable way to look at it, is, if we didn't already have a baseline of dumbass smokers and fatties clogging up the ICUs with their host of various, unnecessary, and completely self-inflicted maladies, then those resources would be more ready to accept people fighting to survive in the midst of a global pandemic.

 
« Last Edit: December 23, 2021, 07:37:08 PM by utee94 »
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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16759 on: December 23, 2021, 07:30:23 PM »
Quote from: ELA on December 23, 2021, 07:18:37 PM
Seems like we aren't. Not even a whisper of shutdowns here.

I expect regions that have been quick to shut-down before, to continue that behavior.  And I expect regions that have remained open before, to continue that behavior as well.
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16760 on: December 23, 2021, 07:40:06 PM »
The fact that our system puts the imaginary borders as obstacles to EVERYONE being vaccinated is embarrassingly stupid.  Viruses don't understand political maps, only physical ones.
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ELA

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16761 on: December 23, 2021, 07:40:12 PM »
Quote from: utee94 on December 23, 2021, 07:28:39 PM
Heh, you avoided smokers I see.

All of them are unfairly over-utilizing scarce resources.  If you're truly only concerned with resource utilization, and you have a problem with one class doing so, then I'd expect you to have a problem with all classes doing so.

If you only choose to single out one class, then it's something other than a resource-driven discussion.

Another and less charitable way to look at it, is, if we didn't already have a baseline of dumbass smokers and fatties clogging up the ICUs with their various unnecessary and completely self-inflicted maladies, then those resources would be more ready to accept people fighting to survive in the midst of a global pandemic.
Yes, if we had a lung disease pandemic filling the ICUs, and 88% of them were smokers, and there weren't enough beds, I'd kick them out too.

This is one specific global event, and ideally a relatively short one.  I am more than happy to discuss the drain that smokers and drinkers and the obese have on our health care system, and our insurance costs, at large, but that isn't what this is.
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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16762 on: December 23, 2021, 07:44:53 PM »
Quote from: ELA on December 23, 2021, 07:40:12 PM
Yes, if we had a lung disease pandemic filling the ICUs, and 88% of them were smokers, and there weren't enough beds, I'd kick them out too.

This is one specific global event, and ideally a relatively short one.  I am more than happy to discuss the drain that smokers and drinkers and the obese have on our health care system, and our insurance costs, at large, but that isn't what this is.
Of course that's what this is.  Throughout the pandemic and even on the previous couple of pages, we've seen fear-porn from the mediots that ICUs are 90% full, when only 10-15% of those beds have been dedicated to COVID patients.  Where the heck do you think all those other sick people are coming from?  Pianos being dropped on their heads?

There is a baseline of sick people that fill up our ICU, and in large part their illnesses are related to smoking, obesity, and all sorts of other self-inflicted problems.

They are all exactly the same and finding fault with one class while dismissing the fault of the other classes, is nonsensical.
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ELA

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16763 on: December 23, 2021, 07:46:39 PM »
Currently in Pennsylvania, 45% of ICU beds are COVID patients, 88% unvaccinated
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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16764 on: December 23, 2021, 07:47:31 PM »
Quote from: ELA on December 23, 2021, 07:46:39 PM
Currently in Pennsylvania, 45% of ICU beds are COVID patients, 88% unvaccinated
Cool.  What's the total ICU capacity utilization?  
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ELA

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16765 on: December 23, 2021, 08:05:30 PM »
Quote from: utee94 on December 23, 2021, 07:47:31 PM
Cool.  What's the total ICU capacity utilization? 
I'm sure it varies hospital to hospital.  I'm sure some it's not an issue, and in others it is
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ELA

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16766 on: December 23, 2021, 08:11:48 PM »
The UMPC system currently reports ICU beds at 95% utilization, with 44.7% being COVID
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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16767 on: December 23, 2021, 08:20:22 PM »
Quote from: ELA on December 23, 2021, 08:11:48 PM
The UMPC system currently reports ICU beds at 95% utilization, with 44.7% being COVID
So 40% are not COVID.  That's a pretty high percentage.  Eliminate that baseline and you've got a lot more capacity to handle the global pandemic.  

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ELA

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16768 on: December 23, 2021, 08:23:58 PM »
I don't disagree, but with unvaccinated accounting for 88% of hospitalizations,  You are essentially saying they are accounting for every other reason for admission combined
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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16769 on: December 23, 2021, 08:29:40 PM »
Quote from: ELA on December 23, 2021, 08:23:58 PM
I don't disagree, but with unvaccinated accounting for 88% of hospitalizations,  You are essentially saying they are accounting for every other reason for admission combined
Nah, I hear you, I really do.  I too am all in favor of vaxing and in disbelief at the people that come up with their various excuses not do to so, in the face of the science, which I believe is sound.

I just don't think it's a step we can take as a society, to start refusing treatment to one class.  That introduces discretion and a potential for prejudice that frightens me.
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16770 on: December 23, 2021, 08:47:50 PM »
That we are still having this conversation is a bit surprising. 

The elephant in the room is either:
-narrative “a”, that unvaccinated pose
A threat to the vaccinated (this is the prevalent narrative among MSM)
Or
- they don’t. 

If “a” is true, doesn’t that mean the vaccine is not effective?

If it is a false narrative- then why do we keep hearing things like we did today from the Director of CDC, Fauci, that you should avoid inviting the unvaccinated friends and family into your home during the Holidays?
And, even if you’re fully vaccinated with a booster, like I am, you should avoid large gatherings?

I mean I plan on going to the Orange bowl. Why should I worry about the unvaccinated who are there? And if I should what is the value of my vaccination?
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #16771 on: December 23, 2021, 09:14:24 PM »
Quote from: FearlessF on December 23, 2021, 07:17:24 PM
Helmet Laws SUCK!!!
Helmet laws suck.

Wear a goddamn helmet.

Vaccine mandates suck.

Get the goddamn jab. 
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