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Topic: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9

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ohio1317

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Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« on: October 28, 2019, 10:14:09 AM »
Teams with 1st loss Week 9:
Oklahoma

Teams with 2nd loss Week 9:
Auburn
Wisconsin
Notre Dame

Teams with 1st win Week 9:
none

Maximum number of Undefeated Teams at the End of the Regular Season:
6: Clemson, Baylor, Alabama/LSU, Ohio State/Minnesota/Penn State, SMU, Appalachian State
No change in max number this week.

Teams with 1st loss:
Week 0 and 1: 35.38% (46 of 130)
Week 2: 38.01% (32 of 84)
Week 3: 32.69% (17 of 52)
Week 4: 34.29% (12 of 35)
Week 5: 21.74% (5 of 23)
Week 6: 11.11% (2 of 18)
Week 7: 25% (4 of 16)
Week 8: 16.67% (2 of 12)
Week 9: 10% (1 of 10)

Week 9 Thoughts:

-We lost our last 1-loss independent with Notre Dame falling to Michigan.

-Biggest news of day was definitely Oklahoma falling to Kansas State. This leaves just Baylor as undefeated in the Big 12. A 1-loss Big 12 champ would be much easier to leave out of the CFP bowls than an undefeated one. For the moment, this most helps out 1-loss Oregon (who narrowly escaped last night) and potential 1-loss non conference champ SEC teams (Alabama/LSU). Oklahoma is not out of it, but they now do not completely control their destiny.

-Ohio State and LSU winning their big games leaves everything on track for them and likely eliminates Wisconsin and Auburn (if Auburn could win the SEC with their schedule, even at 2 losses, might even be OK, but very doubtful LSU and Alabama both losing twice). It also clears the biggest road blocks to a monstrous LSU/Alabama game and potentially an Ohio State/Penn State won a few weeks later (although Penn State still plays Minnesota).

-We now have 13 undefeated or 1-loss teams from the power 5 conferences. If our trends continue, all 4 of our playoff bowl teams will come from among those 13 teams. Even if this winds up being the first year with a 2 loss team (and this does not feel like a year for that), at least 3 of 4 should be.

-On the Group of 5 Cotton Bowl race this week, our story was about teams holding on. SMU won a close one at Houston on Thursday. Tulsa missed a field goal at the end allowing Memphis to hold on. Navy and San Diego State won by 3 on the road.

Week 10 Thoughts:
Our undefeated teams play in the following games next week: West Virginia @ undefeated Baylor (Thursday), Georgia Southern @ undefeated Appalachian State (Thursday), undefeated SMU @ 1-loss Memphis, and Wofford @ undefeated Clemson. All 5 of our undefeated teams from the Big Ten and SEC are off this week.

Our winless teams play in the following: Winless Akron @ 2-6 Bowling Green, and 5-3 Marshall @ winless Rice. New Mexico State is off. Akron has to be most likely to win of the two.

1-loss Georgia vs. 1-loss Florida: Winner is overwhelming favorite to win the east and will be only team from the east with a shot at the CFP.
Undefeated SMU @ 1-loss Memphis: Game to sit atop the American west division. Memphis chances of a Cotton Bowl bid extremely small with a loss. SMU could probably recover (although would need one more Memphis loss).

1-loss Oregon @ USC: Game important on several fronts. Oregon is somewhat quietly rising back into CFP bowl conversation and this is a must win. USC, on the other hand though, sits atop the PAC-12 south with Utah and has the tie breaker over the Utes. With 3 losses, USC is out of playoff bowl running, but in control of everything else. Utah needs Oregon to win this one.

1-loss Utah @ Washington: Speaking of Utah, win this road game and they be mentioned more as a CFP bowl contender. A major comparison could be made between how they play at Washington and how Oregon did.

1-loss UAB @ Tennessee: UAB is likely not in the Cotton Bowl race, but a win here would push them more into conversation.

West Virginia @ undefeated Baylor: The Bears get attention as the last undefeated team and atop the standings in the Big 12 for the first time on Thursday.

Remaining Undefeated Teams: ACC: 1, American Athletic: 1, Big 12: 1, Big Ten: 3, SEC: 2, Sun Belt: 1, total: 9
Clemson
Baylor
Minnesota
Ohio State
Penn State
Southern Methodist
Alabama
Louisiana State
Appalachian State


1-loss Teams: ACC: 1, American: 3, Big 12: 1, Big Ten: 0, Conference USA: 2, Mountain West: 2, PAC-12: 2, SEC: 2, Sun Belt: 0, independents: 0, total: 13
Cincinnati
Louisiana Tech
San Diego State
Oregon
Utah
Navy
UAB
Georgia
Florida
Wake Forest
Memphis
Boise State
Oklahoma

Remaining Winless Teams: Conference USA: 1, MAC: 1, independents: 1, total: 3
Rice
Akron
New Mexico State

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2019, 10:41:12 AM »
There are less potential games between undefeated teams but now two of them are guaranteed to happen.  Remaining potential games between undefeated teams:

  • 11/9:   LSU at Bama (this will definitely happen as both teams are off this week)
  • 11/9:  PSU at Minnesota (this will definitely happen as both teams are off this week)
  • 11/23:  PSU at tOSU, or
  • 12/7:  tOSU vs Minnesota (B1GCG)

So we are now down to four potential games but only three possible because the PSU/MN game will necessarily eliminate either PSU/tOSU or tOSU/MN.  

Undefeated teams in the polls (using AP here):
  • #1 LSU
  • #2 Bama
  • #3 tOSU
  • #4 Clemson
  • #5 PSU
  • #12 Baylor
  • #13 Minnesota
  • #15 SMU
  • #20 Appalachian State

The contiguous block of undefeated P5 teams at the top shrunk to five.  Those five plus Baylor, Minnesota, and the two 1-loss SEC teams effectively control their own destiny.  Everybody else is pretty much waiting for somebody to lose.  

Last week I stated that eleven teams controlled their own destiny:
  • Eight P5 undefeated teams
  • Three 1-loss SEC teams
This week that is down to nine because Oklahoma and Auburn have lost control.  

Regarding the undefeated teams that are NOT already in the top-5:
#12 Baylor:
The Bears' best win is over KSU which looks a LOT better today than it did last week.  On Thursday they host WVU but the Mountaineers are sub .500 so that will not help much.  After that they travel to Fort Worth to take on TCU then host #10 Oklahoma.  I think right now that nobody knows how good Baylor is but if they win their next three I am confident that they will jump into at least the top-5.  

#13 Minnesota:
Like Baylor, the Gophers SoS thus far leaves a lot to be desired but also like Baylor, it is about to get real.  They have a week off then host #5 PSU then travel to Iowa City to take on #19 Iowa.  After that they get a more restful week against NU then host the Badgers on 11/30.  Note that the Gophers now have a two game lead in the B1G-W.  

#15 SMU:
The Mustangs get a chance to impress the voters (and more importantly the committee) this weekend when they travel to Tennessee to take on the #24 Memphis Tigers.  After that, their only potential game against a ranked team would be the AACCG likely against #17 Cincinnati.  

#20 Appalachian State:
We'll know more when the CFP rankings come out but my guess is that the Mountaineers need a lot of help to get the G5's major bowl slot.  In the AP poll they trail both #15 SMU and #17 Cincy of the AAC.  Thus, the AAC Championship Game will not help them unless one or both of those teams lose before it happens.  At this point, if chalk holds, it looks like SMU/Cincy will be playing not only for the AAC Championship but also for a major bowl.  


CWSooner

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2019, 09:13:08 PM »

Quote
This week that is down to nine because Oklahoma and Auburn have lost control.
Medina:


If "control their own destiny" refers to the conference championship, Oklahoma has not lost control.  The Sooners have yet to play Baylor.  If the Sooners win out, they will be in the [worthless, unnecessary, doing-it-solely-for-the-money] Big 12 CCG.
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CatsbyAZ

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2019, 09:15:36 PM »


1-loss Teams: ACC: 1, Big 12: 1, Big Ten: 0, PAC-12: 2, SEC: 2,






Some nuances on this:
PAC 12: 2 teams with 1 loss and 0 teams with 2 losses (no 6-2s)

ACC: 1 team with 1 loss (Wake) and 0 teams with 2 losses (no 6-2s); no counting VTech's 5-2 because two of those wins are over FCS schools

B12: Also no 6-2s (though KState is 5-2 so we'll count them)

SEC: 5 teams 6-2 or better, all ranked in the Top 11 - LSU, Alabama, Florida, Georgia, and Auburn

B10: 7 teams 6-2 or better, of which 6 are ranked

My point in all this is that two conference has established strong 2nd tiers within themselves (SEC & B10) while the other three blew their chances this week. The first two being the PAC 12 with Arizona St losing their ranking and dropping to 5-3 at the thrashing of a laughable UCLA program AND the B12 with Texas and Iowa State dropping to 5-3 at the hands of underdogs. The worst offender in all this is the ACC with Pittsburgh and Virginia dropping to 5-3 after losing grip against teams they should've beaten. Top that off with limping Miami and Florida State facing off at 4-4 this weekend.

Since we argue conferences endlessly, I'd like to point out how the SEC and B10 have the strongest midsections.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2019, 10:01:32 PM »
For the winless teams:

Rice's best chance for a W is in the finale vs UTep. The Miners' lone win was by 2 points vs FCS Houston Baptist.

For NMSU it would either be Incarnate World, who is a 5-3 FCS team that has a pair of Ws against ranked FCS teams. Or UTep, which is one of their big rivalry games (neighboring towns).

For Akron it would be this Saturday vs Bowling Green (2-5/1-3), so they are probably screwed since BG was good enough to upset Toledo, who has a winning record. After that they get EMU, Miami and Ohio, all three of which are 4-4. 
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2019, 11:18:45 PM »

Medina:
If "control their own destiny" refers to the conference championship, Oklahoma has not lost control.  The Sooners have yet to play Baylor.  If the Sooners win out, they will be in the [worthless, unnecessary, doing-it-solely-for-the-money] Big 12 CCG.
I meant in terms of the CFP.

I'm confident that those nine would make the CFP if they won out. They would either be an undefeated P5 Champion or a 1-loss SEC Champion with no more than three undefeated P5 Champions (Clemson, tOSU/PSU/MN, Baylor).

I do not view any other teams as being in control of their own destiny because I'm not sure who the next team in would be.

ohio1317

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2019, 12:32:46 AM »
Enjoy the read Medina and catsby

Cincydawg

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2019, 06:05:44 AM »
In the next two weeks, obviously some additional "clarity" will occur and these analyses should become a lot shorter.

They are quite interesting.  I think seeing three unbeaten P5 level teams at the end of the year will be a rare occurrence.  Seeing one plus 4-5 one loss teams will be routine.

And there seems often to be a 2 loss team that is in the conversation.  If Oklahoma ends up 12-1, and say Utah likewise, and add to this say UGA (for fun) and Ohio State (with one loss) and Clemson at 13-0 and you have an interesting discussion.  ND is gone at least and not cluttering the works.

Likely the cache of the SEC and B1G carry the day leaving one open spot for two teams.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2019, 08:41:04 AM »
Appy St lost last night, while Baylor barely escaped by a FG.
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2019, 10:37:09 AM »
Appy St lost last night, while Baylor barely escaped by a FG.
Very interesting results. My take:

Ap State's loss effectively eliminates the Sun Belt from the race for the G5 spot.  They were ranked #20 behind #15 SMU and #17 Cincy (both of the AAC) but there was at least a chance that both could lose and that an undefeated ApState could end up ahead of the AAC and MWC Champions.  Now the G5 spot is clearly the AAC's to lose with BoiseSt and SDSU (MWC) waiting in the wings.  

Baylor's near-loss against WVU reinforces the suspicion that a lot of us already held that Baylor isn't very good and their 5-0/8-0 record is mostly a product of a relatively weak schedule so far.  WVU is a 1-4/3-5 team that already lost to:
  • Mizzou by 31
  • Texas by 11
  • Iowa State by 24
  • Oklahoma by 38
Baylor is now 5-0/8-0 but their wins have been:
  • Over FCS Stephen F Austin
  • Over middling CUSA UTSA
  • Over perennial Bottom Ten resident Rice
  • Over 3-2/5-3 ISU by two
  • Over 2-2/5-2 KSU by 19
  • Over 1-4/3-5 TxTech by a FG
  • Over 2-3/5-3 OkSU by 18
  • Over 1-4/3-5 WVU by a FG
Of Baylor's eight wins, only the KSU and OkSU wins really move the needle in any meaningful way.  The rest are either very close or against crap opposition or both.  

Their four remaining games represent a substantial step up in competition:
  • AT 2-2/4-3 TCU
  • vs 4-1/7-1 OU
  • vs 3-2/5-3 TX
  • AT 1-4/3-5 Kansas


Cincydawg

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2019, 11:03:44 AM »
Cincinnati looks pretty good for a G5 (and is making OSU look good as a result).  They have a shot at winning out.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2019, 04:58:17 PM »
Cincinnati looks pretty good for a G5 (and is making OSU look good as a result).  They have a shot at winning out.
If Ohio State wins out it will not matter because at 13-0 nobody will be arguing about their SoS but Cincinnati is good insurance for the Buckeyes in the event of a loss (particularly if that loss is to PSU and costs the Buckeyes a B1GCG appearance).  

Cincy is 3-0/6-1 and effectively as a two game lead in the AAC-East because they already beat 3-1 UCF and everybody else has at least two AAC losses.  Their remaining games are all AAC Contests:
  • AT 0-4/3-5 ECU
  • vs 0-4/2-6 UCONN
  • AT 2-2/4-4 USF
  • vs 2-2/5-3 Temple
  • AT #24 3-1/7-1 Memphis
Then, if they make it, their most likely AACCG opponent is #15 4-0/8-0 SMU.  


Cincydawg

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2019, 05:17:47 PM »
Ohio State could be 12-1 with a narrow loss in the CG and perhaps still be in the discussion, and that UC win would look good.  But all the contingencies here are the ones you are better at laying out than me of course.


medinabuckeye1

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Re: Remaining Undefeated, 1-Loss, and Winless Teams after Week 9
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2019, 05:24:17 PM »
Ohio State could be 12-1 with a narrow loss in the CG and perhaps still be in the discussion, and that UC win would look good.  But all the contingencies here are the ones you are better at laying out than me of course.
With five weeks of regular season and the CG's still to be played there are WAY too many plausible contingencies to lay them all out but I think it basically comes down to this for Ohio State:
  • If they go undefeated they are obviously in.  
  • If they lose any one game but still get to and win the B1GCG I think they are in.  Only undefeated teams Clemson, Bama/LSU, and Baylor would definitely be ahead of them and I think they would have a better profile than the potential 1-loss PAC Champions.  
  • If they lose one game and either miss the B1GCG or the loss is in the B1GCG then how they look and their SoS could be of MAJOR importance.  In this case, it helps immensely if Cincy wins out.  
  • If they lose two games they are almost certainly out unless they somehow manage to lose two games and still win the B1GCG in which case they might have a chance pending what happens in the other P5 conferences.  


 

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