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Topic: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class

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FearlessF

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2019, 10:40:17 PM »
pine tar, spit balls, sand paper, corked bats.......... all in good clean fun

just keeping the umps on their toes
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"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2019, 10:45:43 PM »
Who is the worst player to ever find their way into the HoF? 
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1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

FearlessF

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2019, 10:52:56 PM »
worst at what?

cheating?
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"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2019, 10:59:12 PM »
Worst at playing baseball. 
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1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

fezzador

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2019, 11:10:10 PM »
Gotta say Ray Schalk.  Tremendous defense, almost literally no offense.  Even Ozzie Smith had his redeeming qualities outside of his glove.
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MarqHusker

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2019, 12:57:53 AM »
Paul Waner, High Pockets Kelly, tinkers and evers.
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2019, 01:01:08 AM »
Whether it was cheating or not, Sosa & McGwire did revive baseball in 1998 and some people still give them that credit.  Sosa hit the most HRs in any 10-year stretch in history - 479.  More than Ruth or Bonds or anyone else.  Yes, it was during the highest HR era ever and yes it was through murky means, but it still happened.  No, just hitting HRs does not a great player make, but it is the best thing a batter can do in any given at-bat, in any situation.  


If Sosa had played in the 80s or earlier, his slash line numbers would be great.  But because of his run-scoring environment, his 128 career OPS+ is pretty pedestrian.  Yet he had over 400 total bases in a season TWICE, which is nuts.  The only time that's been done outside Coors Field guys in the last 40 years was Bonds and Luis Gonzalez's big year in Arizona.  
Gonzalez is the big all-time DBacks "guy" here in Arizona, but look at a picture of him in 1993 vs 2001 and tell me he wasn't injecting horse tranquilizers into his aortas......but Bonds and Clemens are the only ones good enough to have to "pay" for their transgressions.


Alex Rodriguez comes up for the HOF in 3 years, in Bonds' and Clemens' final years.  Won't that be interesting.
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2019, 01:01:31 AM »
Quote from: MarqHusker on January 24, 2019, 12:57:53 AM
Paul Waner, High Pockets Kelly, tinkers and evers.
...but High Pockets Kelly has a HOF nickname, so you make allowances...
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2019, 07:24:54 AM »
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1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

fezzador

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2019, 08:19:48 AM »
So Swinging Sammy has become a pink Michael Jackson.  Strange.
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Brutus Buckeye

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #24 on: January 24, 2019, 08:55:00 AM »
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1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

847badgerfan

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #25 on: January 24, 2019, 09:13:31 AM »
Perfect look for one of the most selfish players the game ever saw.
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U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

JerseyTerrapin

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #26 on: January 24, 2019, 10:44:45 AM »
For me, it should be based on what they accomplished on the field, regardless of how they got there and what they did to improve their performance, etc. (I realize that my view is a minority one).

Sure, the stats from the steroids era are wonky, but so are stats from the dead ball era, etc.  There's never been a reasonable way to compare stats from different eras, anyway.

If you open cans of worms like "he has weird politics" "he took steroids" and "he gambled," what about cans of worms like "training is more advanced nowadays," "he threw spitballs," and "he didn't have to pitch to black players" or simply "he was an asshole" ?  

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fezzador

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Re: OT: 2019 Baseball HOF Class
« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2019, 11:40:34 AM »
If being a "nice guy" was a prerequisite for being in the Hall of Fame, it would look more like a Coffee Table of Fame.

Then again, I also think a lot of players from the bygone era get a bit of a bad rap.  Ty Cobb probably carries the stigma of being a jerk more than any other professional athlete, ever, but a lot of those stories about him were either exaggerated or not true at all.  Sure, some of his reputation was well-earned, but he wasn't even close to being the biggest a-hole in baseball in the pre-color barrier days.  His playing style led other players to believe that he was being excessively aggressive (in his own words, he played that much harder to honor his late father, who never got to see him play professionally).  He did maintain several friendships with other players (and even was sort of a mentor to the generation of players that followed him) and had a surprisingly progressive stance regarding black ballplayers (he had positive things to say about Jackie Robinson, and said that Willie Mays was one of a very select few players he'd pay money to watch in person).  Was he intimidating?  Sure.  A bit of a jerk?  Probably.  But he was not dishonest, he played the game tough and he played within the rules.  He'd probably be irate with the current state of sports.
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