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Topic: In other news ...

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MrNubbz

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19656 on: October 26, 2022, 03:53:50 PM »
Quote from: MarqHusker on October 26, 2022, 01:57:24 PM
One person has been executed in WI history since 1848.  As noted, no penalty since 1853.
That's not including backwoods justice - only what you have on the books
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19657 on: October 26, 2022, 06:56:42 PM »
Quote from: bayareabadger on October 26, 2022, 03:42:13 PM
Always interested in how the machinations of the criminal justice system get boiled down.
I'm all for having the right to an attorney and all the fair and good things. 
But the justice system is one thing that SHOULD be socialist.  The 'blind justice' statues are a sick joke.  On the scales should be stacks of money, with their being very uneven.
Judges shouldn't easily be identified as liberal or conservative.  We should have no idea what their politics are. 
.
But let's keep pretending that those who can afford weaselly BS artists deserve them. 
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19658 on: October 26, 2022, 07:43:32 PM »
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1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19659 on: October 26, 2022, 11:03:57 PM »
Quote from: MarqHusker on October 26, 2022, 01:57:24 PM
  As noted, no penalty since 1853.
That's when UF was founded.
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19660 on: October 26, 2022, 11:56:26 PM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on October 26, 2022, 06:56:42 PM
I'm all for having the right to an attorney and all the fair and good things. 
But the justice system is one thing that SHOULD be socialist.  The 'blind justice' statues are a sick joke.  On the scales should be stacks of money, with their being very uneven.
Judges shouldn't easily be identified as liberal or conservative.  We should have no idea what their politics are. 
.
But let's keep pretending that those who can afford weaselly BS artists deserve them. 
I mean, you lamented the decorum of people having a vigorous but desperate defense. Like, the point is that if your client is super guilty, the best defense might be real bad (like the one you described) and then the system (in theory) recognizes that is bunk and convicts. 

The fact that the most likely guilty have someone looking out for their rights in the face of the government is a good thing. And you bet there are all sorts of issues, almost all far more nuanced than "the rich can afford a good defense attorney." 
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Brutus Buckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19661 on: October 27, 2022, 12:05:54 AM »
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1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19662 on: October 27, 2022, 06:02:04 AM »


I-68 in Maryland, Sidling Hill cut, it's pretty neat.
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MikeDeTiger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19663 on: October 27, 2022, 10:07:21 AM »
How did the case turn out?  If the guy was convicted anyway, it doesn't matter what his lawyer said or did.  

I don't actually much care what defense lawyers do, as long as it's legal.  Their whole point is to ensure prosecution makes their point beyond reasonable doubt, which is a good thing no matter how sleazy the defense team truly is.  The system is built on an old philosophical axiom that it's better to let a guilty man go free than to imprison an innocent man.  Prosecution should be held to a standard and dot their i's and cross their t's.  

If and when a defense team breaks the law, or games it, or an individual is granted leniency because of who they are, that is not okay.  
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GopherRock

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19664 on: October 27, 2022, 10:46:45 AM »
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FearlessF

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19665 on: October 28, 2022, 12:20:15 PM »
FORE!!!

mid-60s and sunny
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19666 on: October 28, 2022, 02:07:10 PM »
Quote from: bayareabadger on October 26, 2022, 11:56:26 PM
I mean, you lamented the decorum of people having a vigorous but desperate defense. Like, the point is that if your client is super guilty, the best defense might be real bad (like the one you described) and then the system (in theory) recognizes that is bunk and convicts.

The fact that the most likely guilty have someone looking out for their rights in the face of the government is a good thing. And you bet there are all sorts of issues, almost all far more nuanced than "the rich can afford a good defense attorney."
I'd just prefer some honesty.  
My client is sorry he got caught.  The end.
.
I agree it's a good thing that there's someone looking out for every defendant.  
.
Doesn't the rich affording better lawyers negate the nuance?  Doesn't it make every 'maybe' or 'could be' a little less scary?  If it changes 1 coin toss out of 10, that's something.  
Isn't the system corrupt if the best bull-shitter is the most successful?  
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19667 on: October 28, 2022, 02:46:13 PM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on October 28, 2022, 02:07:10 PM
I'd just prefer some honesty. 
My client is sorry he got caught.  The end.
This would be called accepting a Guilty plea.  If he didn't, he merits a defense.  It's a basic part of our System.

The rich generally get better health care, live in nicer houses, drive nicer cars, etc. etc. etc.  
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FearlessF

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19668 on: October 30, 2022, 09:54:28 AM »
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #19669 on: October 30, 2022, 05:50:12 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on October 28, 2022, 02:46:13 PM


The rich generally get better health care, live in nicer houses, drive nicer cars, etc. etc. etc. 
The last 2 are fine.  

A person's medical care and their standing in a court of law should absolutely not be income-specific.  I know this, you know this, we all know this.  But it's just ignored and shrugged at.  
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier
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