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Topic: In other news ...

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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11620 on: January 26, 2022, 06:17:44 PM »
I dont disagree
The question thats begging to be asked is why are various cost of sales expenses higher in California

Why are taxes higher then many other states
Why is the land more expensive then many other states
Why do utilities cost more then many other states
Why have a state minimum wage twice the federal amount

why are Californias leaders electing to do this

My theory is that a lot of things are more expensive (including gov't) because when a place is desirable to live, politicians know they can take more and more and more and people STILL want to live there. 

I put up with a lot of bullshit to live in California, because California is pretty awesome. 


bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11621 on: January 26, 2022, 06:18:24 PM »
I dont disagree
The question thats begging to be asked is why are various cost of sales expenses higher in California

Why are taxes higher then many other states
Why is the land more expensive then many other states
Why do utilities cost more then many other states
Why have a state minimum wage twice the federal amount

why are Californias leaders electing to do this

To answer the questions, in order:

Because they don't seem to have an issue with it.

Because more people want to live there and because wages are higher. 

Not sure about utilities. Maybe something to do with the fact that infrastructure has fallen into disrepair? I have someone in my life who knows more about the ins and outs of the power business. Maybe I should check.

Because the idea of not allowing companies to pay poverty wages appeals to them. 

And it's all held up because people, for some reason, really, really, REALLY want to live there. 

bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11622 on: January 26, 2022, 06:20:43 PM »
I remember how expensive it was 30 years ago, when my wife and I were both working.
Someone at my old office hit a certain number of kids and realized her salary was the price of day care. Thus she quit. 

bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11623 on: January 26, 2022, 06:35:34 PM »
Well, I think it's twofold.

Your house, for most people in this country, is the biggest financial decision you'll ever make that doesn't include marriage or children. Not only is it massive from a financial sense, but it's also emotional. It's about choosing who you are, where you want to be, and what sort of community you want to live in. You put down roots, you have kids (who go to school), you become a part of that community.

  • When outside forces like "zoning boards" try to make changes and that means the very nature of your community might change, you can't simply decouple the emotional aspects. It's your life. Do you want to blow up friendships, do you want to force your kids into new schools in a new community, do you want to uproot exactly what you've built? No.
  • When those same forces do something that will negatively affect the financial value of your asset, and you can exert political pressure to support the financial value, it's basically a no-brainer to exert that pressure to preserve it. If not only does the actions of a zoning board mean that your community will change and make you want to sell your house and move somewhere else, if the actions of that zoning board means that you're not going to get for your house what it was worth before they made their decision, you're gonna fight like hell.

NIMBY is a lot of things, but irrational isn't one of them.


It's funny because in my econ major brain, I see the strong rationality in No. 2, but scoff at the irrational part of No. 1, even if the mechanism is essentially the same. 

As you said, it's emotional, and people will leverage their wealth and power to protect their feeling. But there's such a rich sense of entitlement that as a stakeholder in a community, you deserve a really strong hand in deciding the shape of it like that. The nature of a community is ever-changing. Factors, such as zoning, likely brought it into existence and can tweak it as well. I'm sure wherever someone lives, someone way back wouldn't have been the most keen on someone like the newcomers being there, but in America there's freedom and changes and whatever else. 

And the entitlement to be free of that without giving something up strikes me as irrational in its way, even if the mechanism follows it's own type of rationality. 

(Some of this comes out of convos with a close friend. He contended his company should pay employees at a certain level, the one he was at and a high-ish one, enough to be able to afford a house in the town where the company is based. And in some ways, this is rational. But it's in an expensive place. And he wanted to be part of a certain "community." Which meant inflexibility when it came to location. And of course the people in the "community" he eventually found a place in are either happy with his spending driving up prices, if their have an appreciating asset, or unhappy becuase rising housing prices mean they'll be pushed out. Only they're the sort of folks without the financial weight to be listened to, which means they'll lose friendships, move kids because of the flows of economics and policy)

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11624 on: January 26, 2022, 06:40:25 PM »
I wonder who today works for minimum wage and why they do so.  I read a lot of folks do, but I don't understand why.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11625 on: January 26, 2022, 06:43:22 PM »
To answer the questions, in order:

Because they don't seem to have an issue with it.

Because more people want to live there and because wages are higher.

Not sure about utilities. Maybe something to do with the fact that infrastructure has fallen into disrepair? I have someone in my life who knows more about the ins and outs of the power business. Maybe I should check.

Because the idea of not allowing companies to pay poverty wages appeals to them.

And it's all held up because people, for some reason, really, really, REALLY want to live there.
Isn't all of the "bad" of CA exactly what people would find unremarkable if it was run as a private business?  

People are flooding in and demand is sky-high?  Charge more and more.

But since it's government-run, it's evil and stupid and crazy.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

utee94

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11626 on: January 26, 2022, 06:43:39 PM »
My first paying job in high school, working at a Mexican restaurant, paid the minimum wage of $3.35 at the time.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11627 on: January 26, 2022, 06:44:27 PM »
I wonder who today works for minimum wage and why they do so.  I read a lot of folks do, but I don't understand why.
People don't just marry other people.  They marry much of the familiar.  Scared of anything different.  Scared of anything unknown.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

utee94

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11628 on: January 26, 2022, 06:44:47 PM »
Isn't all of the "bad" of CA exactly what people would find unremarkable if it was run as a private business? 

People are flooding in and demand is sky-high?  Charge more and more.

But since it's government-run, it's evil and stupid and crazy. 


Are you suggesting that it's appropriate for governments to operate as For-Profit entities?

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11629 on: January 26, 2022, 06:46:25 PM »
My first paying job in high school, working at a Mexican restaurant, paid the minimum wage of $3.35 at the time.
Mine was working for my dad at $4.35/hr, doing fire and flood restoration.
The first 3 days I ever officially worked, I worked 39 hours in 3 days, crawling under carpet to pull all the wet padding, demolition, water suction, etc. 

It was a great motivator to NOT do that kind of thing for the rest of my life.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11630 on: January 26, 2022, 06:48:12 PM »
Are you suggesting that it's appropriate for governments to operate as For-Profit entities?
I'm suggesting many here get hard-ons for private businesses operating a certain way and bitch about a gov't entity doing the same thing.  

Reminds me of Obama having accomplished the top 8 things Newt Gingrich claimed he'd do as president early in on the primaries.  He did all these things a Republican wanted to do, but he's still awful.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Honestbuckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11631 on: January 26, 2022, 06:49:10 PM »
I wonder who today works for minimum wage and why they do so.  I read a lot of folks do, but I don't understand why.
Because they want to make money. I worked for a number of years for minimum wage while I was going to school so I had some spending money since I had no other source to get spending money. Seems pretty simple to me, if you want to earn some money you need to work and the value of your pay is related to the value you bring to the business.

Not working at all- and living off others who are in some form, is still lazy.  
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11632 on: January 26, 2022, 06:50:20 PM »
I'm suggesting many here get hard-ons for private businesses operating a certain way and bitch about a gov't entity doing the same thing. 

Reminds me of Obama having accomplished the top 8 things Newt Gingrich claimed he'd do as president early in on the primaries.  He did all these things a Republican wanted to do, but he's still awful. 
😂😂😂😂
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #11633 on: January 26, 2022, 06:51:16 PM »
I wonder who today works for minimum wage and why they do so.  I read a lot of folks do, but I don't understand why.
didnt you ever have a part time job while in high school or college

the minimum wage laws have decreased part time job opportunities for the college bound kid
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

 

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