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Topic: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level

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Gigem

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #112 on: April 14, 2021, 07:21:18 PM »
So my F-I-L has actually bought two EV's.  The first Bolt, which I picked up for him in Dallas in Feb. 2020 (we live S of Houston) was totaled in a wreck by a drunk driver about 2-3 months ago.  It cost him about $38,000.  

The 2nd bolt, identical to the first in color and year, cost $32,000.  He liked the first one so much he bought the same model, and found the same year.  I'm pretty sure the Bolt is based on the Sonic, which you can buy for about $16,000.  So in his case the EV is 2x the cost of the gas car.  My FIL always wanted an EV (he's 78).  He was around for the oil embargo in the 70's and actually bought a diesel truck in the early 80's because at the time you could always get diesel even during the embargo.  This was well before the powerstroke/durmax era when there was not hardly any diesel vehicles at all save for the ones they put in the oldsmobiles of the era.  The one in the truck, which we still own, is a 6.2L detroit diesel not the 5.7L converted gas engine.  

Off topic I know but he's always been on the bleeding edge of alternate fuels.  

I'm real curious to see what the range of the cybertruck, EV-150, and electric silverado will be loaded and unloaded.  

Gigem

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #113 on: April 14, 2021, 07:39:14 PM »
But back on topic...

The bolt dropped in price $6,000 in less than a year.  The Sonic I'm betting will never get any cheaper.  All the money in electrics are in the batteries and high efficiency motors, but there's very little maintenance.  I drive a 2016 Camry for my DD, I paid about $21K for it new.  The same size car, be it a Tesla or other, would probably cost low $30's.  Even with a moderate amount of driving it would take a long time to get back that extra $10K even over 5-7 years.  

I was commuting about 40-50 miles per day in the Camry at about 30 MPG.  
40 mpd x 30 days is about 1,200 miles in a month.  
1200 / 30 mpg = 40 gallons of fuel per month.  Average cost probably around $2.30 per gallon is $92 per month in fuel.  Throw in oil changes, air filters, misc odds and ends related to a combustion engine and I'd estimate I'm spending $110-120 per month to keep the vehicle on the road, not including major repairs.  

For the EV of the same size calculate 3.5 miles per kWh, or 28.5 kWh per 100 miles.  
1200 miles per month / 3.5 kWh is about 342 kWh.  
342 kWh * $0.12 is about $41.0 per month in energy costs.  No extra oil or filters.  Not sure what hidden costs there are, but solid state stuff > mechanical stuff.  

So about half the cost in fuel, plus no oil changes or filter changes.  I've heard that since EV's are a bit heavier than ICE cars they wear out tires faster, but the regenerative braking means rarely replacing brakes/pads.  

Gigem

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #114 on: April 14, 2021, 08:14:00 PM »
But still, at this point economically speaking it just won't pay for itself.  Do it for fun, do it for the environment.  Do it to be cool.  But just like my diesel truck it won't pay for itself.  But it sure is nice to drive.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #115 on: April 14, 2021, 09:21:38 PM »
The one in the truck, which we still own, is a 6.2L detroit diesel not the 5.7L converted gas engine. 
Lucky for you! That converted gas engine was an absolute piece of junk! A friend's dad had one and he still hasn't forgiven GM. It was just a small block Chevy V8 with really high compression pistons and glow plugs.

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #116 on: April 14, 2021, 10:55:50 PM »
Electric Schmetric 

I am enjoying myself here and the sound is a huge part of the visceral enjoyment:

https://streamable.com/99wlpy



And I wouldn’t enjoy this:

https://streamable.com/hd35lz

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Cincydawg

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #117 on: April 15, 2021, 06:22:13 AM »
The Bolt is not a Sonic, it is about the same dimensions as a Cruze (vide supra), which comparably equipped has an MSRP in the $23 K range.  The Sonic is quite a bit smaller, and less powerful (I owned one, the daughter has it now.)  The Bolt will handily out accelerate a Cruze with any engine, that low end torque is hard to beat.

The Bolt arguably is nicer inside, and the new "EUV" Bolt has the Super Cruise option available, which is a neat semi-autonomous.  Some reviewers like it more than Tesla's.



2022 Chevrolet Bolt EUV Review, Pricing, and Specs (caranddriver.com)

Chevrolet has expanded its electric vehicle lineup for 2022 by introducing the SUV-inspired Bolt EUV (Electric Utility Vehicle), which offers a more spacious cabin than the Bolt hatchback as well as more rugged exterior styling. Under the hood is a 200-hp electric motor that's juiced by a 65.0-kWh battery pack said to deliver up to 250 miles of driving range per charge. When the Bolt EUV hits the market later this year, it will find stiff competition in the form of other EV SUVs including the Hyundai Kona Electric, the Ford Mustang Mach-E, and the Tesla Model Y. Chevrolet is banking on the EUV's futuristic styling, affordable starting price, and available semi-autonomous driving system to rise to the top of the burgeoning EV market segment.

Cincydawg

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #118 on: April 15, 2021, 06:27:10 AM »
The SUV is also capable of DC fast charging, which Chevy says can provide up to 95 miles of range in just 30 minutes.

This is decent, if you need to take a trip somewhere.  Say you want to drive 500 miles a day, you get 220 comfortably off the first charge and stop for lunch and recharge 30 minutes and add maybe 90 miles, so you have 120 miles of range.  Stop again in 1.5 hours for half and hour and add another 90 miles range.  You likely need one more stop to finish the trip.

It's certainly going to take longer than driving in ICE.


Gigem

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #119 on: April 15, 2021, 08:16:36 AM »
My bad. I had heard that they shared the same platform like GM often does for its cars. It was in fact made on the same assembly line as the Sonic, which was the source of my confusion. 

No doubt the bolt is fast. The interior is surprisingly spacious given its size. The seats are horrid. Almost laughingly bad. The dash and panels are not the normal look and materials, they look like some kind of weird styrofoam with a diamond pattern. Takes some getting used to. 

GM is much farther behind on charging speeds. I suspect they are being very conservative, other makes can charge much more quickly. 

Cincydawg

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #120 on: April 15, 2021, 08:36:43 AM »
The first-generation Chevrolet Bolt EV rides on a platform called BEV2 that stands for Battery Electric Vehicle 2. The name is sometimes spelled with two Roman Numerals – BEVII.
Notably, the platform is not the Gamma 2 (G2) platform that is commonly, yet incorrectly, believed to underpin the Bolt.

Engineers initially started out developing the Bolt EV on the Gamma 2 platform, but as development continued, engineers created a new platform now known as BEV2, which doesn’t share components with Gamma.
“There are no Bolt EV parts tied to the G2 architecture,” lead product engineer Josh Tavel was quoted as saying.
Interestingly, the Bolt is assigned the G2UC-E internal program code, which decrypts as follows:
Though the program code indicates that the Bolt uses the G2 platform, the discrepancy is explained by the fact that the Bolt EV program originated on the Gamma architecture, but then evolved to create its own platform, even as the vehicle program maintained the G2UC-E code.


EVs are purpose built to take advantage of battery rigidity to solidify the frame structure in a unique fashion.


betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #121 on: April 15, 2021, 09:45:39 AM »
No doubt the bolt is fast. The interior is surprisingly spacious given its size. The seats are horrid. Almost laughingly bad. The dash and panels are not the normal look and materials, they look like some kind of weird styrofoam with a diamond pattern. Takes some getting used to.
Exterior styling and interior fit&finish is something that Chevy has been unable to do well for a long time now. I don't know how they sell so many damn cars when "ugly & looks cheap" seem to be the design goals.

Cincydawg

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #122 on: April 15, 2021, 09:51:35 AM »
Styling is subjective, I find the Chevy's to look decent myself.  The F&F thing is somewhat subjective, I think they are fine generally speaking, better than Tesla by a mile.


betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #123 on: April 15, 2021, 10:02:14 AM »
I just look at that Bolt and Chevy thinks its "futuristic styling" is going to appeal?

If you have to call something futuristic, it's probably just f'ing ugly.

I haven't been inside a Tesla, so can't speak to its interior fit & finish. Not a huge fan of the Model 3 that looks like a platypus. The Model S is a fine-looking car. Not a huge fan of the Model X or Y. And the CYBRTRK just looks stupid. You'd have to pay me to drive that hideous thing. I hope that gets changed to something that looks like it wasn't designed by a caffeine-fueled 7 year old boy or a coke'd up Elon Musk.

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #124 on: April 15, 2021, 10:15:03 AM »
I just look at that Bolt and Chevy thinks its "futuristic styling" is going to appeal?

If you have to call something futuristic, it's probably just f'ing ugly.

I haven't been inside a Tesla, so can't speak to its interior fit & finish. Not a huge fan of the Model 3 that looks like a platypus. The Model S is a fine-looking car. Not a huge fan of the Model X or Y. And the CYBRTRK just looks stupid. You'd have to pay me to drive that hideous thing. I hope that gets changed to something that looks like it wasn't designed by a caffeine-fueled 7 year old boy or a coke'd up Elon Musk.
Ha!   This!!! 😂😂
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Electric Vehicles - Your Interest level
« Reply #125 on: April 15, 2021, 10:25:42 AM »
The SUV is also capable of DC fast charging, which Chevy says can provide up to 95 miles of range in just 30 minutes.

This is decent, if you need to take a trip somewhere.  Say you want to drive 500 miles a day, you get 220 comfortably off the first charge and stop for lunch and recharge 30 minutes and add maybe 90 miles, so you have 120 miles of range.  Stop again in 1.5 hours for half and hour and add another 90 miles range.  You likely need one more stop to finish the trip.

It's certainly going to take longer than driving in ICE.


If this is the new normal, it won't become normal.  This would drive me insane.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

 

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