CFP Thread

[utee94]

I always find the phrase “meaningless exhibitions“ kind of weird. Meaninglessness is in the eye of the beholder, and all of sports are basically an exhibition of some point or another.

They were meaningless in trying to determine a national champion. And I suppose it rests, again, in the eye of the beholder how broadly that meaninglessness is held.

See my above response to AAA.

And I'm not a hardcore "MNC or nothing" guy.  It's not that the MNC matters and so all other bowl games do not.  It's actually the opposite. 

I've always understood the origin of bowl games, which were by definition post-season exhibitions.  They didn't matter for conference standings because the conference regular season was over.  Until the late 60s and early 70s, they didn't even impact the final wire service rankings.  And even when that changed for good in 1974, they still only mattered if you really cared about the beauty pageant that was the subjectively voted final Top 20 or Top 25.  

I always wanted my team to win rather than lose, of course, but there's just not that much of import on the line in the bowl games outside of a subjective and sometimes arbitrary ranking of teams from some biased sportswriters and/or coaches.

[Wildcat4E]

Skicat used to refer to bowl season as "silly season."   

The team motivated to actually be there could blow the doors off the more talented/better team.  With that comes the crowing/crying over the result.

Can we go back to circa 1996?  I didn't really have a problem with the polls and the possibility of having co-champs.  I mentioned 2003 in another post, that was the last co-champ result we will ever have, presumably.

Playoffs generate more money I guess, and I guess the student-athlete aspect has long since been abandoned.  That was an argument against playoffs back in the day--playing friggin 16 games like it's the NFL.

[medinabuckeye1]

yup, unless your name is Medina and you're worried about top 10 and/or top 5 finishes in the polls

I do view these things as a measure of relative program strength.  In that context, whether or not you finish in the top-5/10 THIS year is almost completely irrelevant but that you have 15 of the last 30 years matters.  The "15" in my example there isn't all that important.  Ie, 15 isn't all that much better than 14 nor all that much worse than 16 but it is a lot different from 5 or 25.  

[utee94]

Skicat used to refer to bowl season as "silly season." 

The team motivated to actually be there could blow the doors off the more talented/better team.  With that comes the crowing/crying over the result.

Can we go back to circa 1996?  I didn't really have a problem with the polls and the possibility of having co-champs.  I mentioned 2003 in another post, that was the last co-champ result we will ever have, presumably.

Playoffs generate more money I guess, and I guess the student-athlete aspect has long since been abandoned.  That was an argument against playoffs back in the day--playing friggin 16 games like it's the NFL.

This one always rang hollow to me.  The state champs and runners-up in Texas high school football have played 15 games since before I was born.

[847badgerfan]

NYD games meant a lot to me and I considered them an accomplishment. Always a good game against a quality SEC team, or the Rose Bowl (or an occasional Orange/Sugar/Fiesta).

Music City was a lot of fun. Of course, it's Nashville so it's pretty hard to not have fun there.

[jgvol]

I believe bowl season lasting an entire month has changed a lot of perception.

Way back when, when I was watching nearly all the big bowls, on actual New Year's Day --- it felt bigger, and better.  (TWSS)

Who can keep up now....games every day.  PFFFFTTTT

[jgvol]

I always find the phrase “meaningless exhibitions“ kind of weird. Meaninglessness is in the eye of the beholder, and all of sports are basically an exhibition of some point or another.

They were meaningless in trying to determine a national champion. And I suppose it rests, again, in the eye of the beholder how broadly that meaninglessness is held.

Here are your beholders:

[bayareabadger]

See my above response to AAA.

And I'm not a hardcore "MNC or nothing" guy.  It's not that the MNC matters and so all other bowl games do not.  It's actually the opposite.

I've always understood the origin of bowl games, which were by definition post-season exhibitions.  They didn't matter for conference standings because the conference regular season was over.  Until the late 60s and early 70s, they didn't even impact the final wire service rankings.  And even when that changed for good in 1974, they still only mattered if you really cared about the beauty pageant that was the subjectively voted final Top 20 or Top 25. 

I always wanted my team to win rather than lose, of course, but there's just not that much of import on the line in the bowl games outside of a subjective and sometimes arbitrary ranking of teams from some biased sportswriters and/or coaches.

I guess I look at the bolded part and feel like it sort of warps things a bit. 

For the vast majority of college football games, there's not that much of import on the line, and what is important is important to a relatively small group in the vast tapestry of all this. Now I acknowledge, a bowl is lesser, but I think declaring it meaningless exhibition feeds a corrosive attitude that reduces the meaning it could have. And while that meaning ain't as high as Texas-Texas A&M, it seems like the minor meaning should be worth celebrating to a degree.

It's a football game. There's spirit of competition. There's people who put in a bunch of work getting to do the thing they like doing, working together, for the 13th time all year, and it can entertain us. All that work, and they don't get that many chances to put that to use, so a last one doesn't seem like the worst outcome. And if they win, the joy of victory looks pretty sweet, even if it's after winning in Boise or Yankee Stadium. 

Growing up, a parent often told me when I didn't want to do something, you can look at it as shit or look at it as gold. I don't think bowls are gold, don't get me wrong. But wanting to call them meaningless exhibitions (and this is not to pick on you, just in general) strikes as looking at them as shit for the sake of doing so. The hipster urge to be cool by not caring. 

I guess I come back to the idea football should be cool and fun, if possible. Hopefully that's true of small high schools to big colleges to the NFL. Preemptively dampening the cool/fun factor for these games, which has become sort of a corrosive common attitude, just seems like taking away from possible joy for ... I don't really know why. 

[bayareabadger]

Here are your beholders:

So I think those are kind of an interesting mix.

I think ND is being up in its feelings pissy, and K-State is also somewhat in that bag. Iowa State seems like a logistics thing, though I wish they'd try. The other ones are kind of up in the air because I don't know if they'd planned for that. 

Like if you thought you were done, cleaned out the lockers, did end-of-season meetings, and then have to call everyone back, I can see how you would not do that, especially if you had a disappointing year. 

But I also think a lot of this is from that creeping cynicism discussed above. And I don't give much credit for that. 

[jgvol]

So I think those are kind of an interesting mix.

I think ND is being up in its feelings pissy, and K-State is also somewhat in that bag. Iowa State seems like a logistics thing, though I wish they'd try. The other ones are kind of up in the air because I don't know if they'd planned for that.

Like if you thought you were done, cleaned out the lockers, did end-of-season meetings, and then have to call everyone back, I can see how you would not do that, especially if you had a disappointing year.

But I also think a lot of this is from that creeping cynicism discussed above. And I don't give much credit for that.

I think the creeping cynicism is there, because we KNOW -- these mercenary players don't give a RIP, so naturally we fans have thumbed our noses at the entire deal. 

I wish I could put my fingers in my ears and pretend that these players are loyal to our universities (like we falsely believed before), but the bloom is off the rose.  They'd screw over your team, my team, and anyone else's, for a damn nickel.

The mystique has gone the way of the DoDo.

[847badgerfan]

Money is the root of much evil.

[bayareabadger]

I think the creeping cynicism is there, because we KNOW -- these mercenary players don't give a RIP, so naturally we fans have thumbed our noses at the entire deal. 

I wish I could put my fingers in my ears and pretend that these players are loyal to our universities (like we falsely believed before), but the bloom is off the rose.  They'd screw over your team, my team, and anyone else's, for a damn nickel.

The mystique has gone the way of the DoDo.

That means you don't care about the whole kit and caboodle then. Which is fine, but it's specifically about bowls. 

(Alas, the money thing flows from the top down. Coaches and admins model behavior, athletes follow)

[jgvol]

That means you don't care about the whole kit and caboodle then. Which is fine, but it's specifically about bowls.

(Alas, the money thing flows from the top down. Coaches and admins model behavior, athletes follow)

That means you don't care far less about the whole kit and caboodle then. Which is fine, but it's specifically about bowls, which I care even far less about.

[Wildcat4E]

So I think those are kind of an interesting mix.

I think ND is being up in its feelings pissy, and K-State is also somewhat in that bag. Iowa State seems like a logistics thing, though I wish they'd try. 

Just curious what you believe the difference in KSU/ISU is to make that statement in the circumstances that exist.

One coach retired, another took a different job, and their respective successors are each coaching the team they have been employed by in the playoffs/bowl games.

Maybe I'm giving a different impression of K-State fans--I'm in the minority, at least among the very loud people that have voiced their learned opinions online--in supporting declining this year.