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Topic: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game

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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #210 on: January 22, 2025, 08:48:20 PM »
1973 is sort of a perfect storm of nearly every blueblood having a great season.  Having 6 such programs going undefeated in the regular season was sick.
Although Penn State was not yet held in such high esteem as it eventually would (didn't help in '94, though), they had experienced great success.  

As for '07 LSU....losing to unranked Arkansas in their regular season finale was certainly an OH FUCK WE'RE DONE moment, falling from #1 to #7.  It took an unprecedented perfect storm for them to parley a 7-point win over a Tennessee team ranked in the teens to immediately jump back up to #2.  

When OSU lost to UM again, all of the chicken little shit had ZERO to do with any playoff ramifications and EVERYTHING to do with losing 4 straight to TTUN and OSU fans' psycho mindsets.
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Brutus Buckeye

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #211 on: January 22, 2025, 09:42:01 PM »
Notre Dame certainly has nothing to feel bad about.  When it was 31-7 it could very easily have become a blowout on the scale of UGA/TCU but the Irish held it together, kept fighting, and ultimately were in a one-score game in the fourth quarter of the National Championship, that is a credit to them and their coach.  A few comments on this:
First, it makes me feel REALLY old.  I well remember ND's NC in 1988 and how can that be 36 years ago. 

Second, do you think, within ND circles that the 1988 NC has a somewhat mythical status that maybe the others don't? 

Let me explain where that second question comes from:  Ohio State has somewhere between 7-9 NC's depending on who you ask but the seven that are pretty widely agreed on are:
  • 1942, Paul Brown won the school's first
  • 1954, Woody Hayes' first, 12 years later
  • 1957, Woody Hayes' second, 3 years later
  • 1968, Woody Hayes' third and last, 11 years later
  • 2002, Jim Tressel won for the first time in 34 years
  • 2014, Urban Meyer won 12 years later
  • 2024, Ryan Day won 10 years later
It always seemed to me that the 1968 team had a sorta mythical status that none of the others have.  I think the reason is simply that they were Ohio State's most recent NC for SOOOOOO long.  I was born in 1975 so the 1968 team was Ohio State's last NC from before I was born until after I had graduated.  In 2002 I was 26 and paid to fly to Vegas and drove down to watch the 2002 NC in person. 

My point is that fanbases are naturally going to reflect back on the most recent NC.  In Ohio State's case, that has only been for a dozen years or less for all of them except the 1968 team which was our most recent for so long that it just grew a sorta mythic status because we were still reflecting back on it even those of us who hadn't been born yet when it happened. 

I'm a few years younger than you, and I didn't hear much about 1968 until 2002. Instead it was Archie Griffin era that was held up as the gold standard of CFB history. He played before we were born as well. 

Really it was just "Woody Hayes" until Urban Meyer got hired. Tressel was just a poor man's Woody Hayes. Or maybe a rich man's Earle Bruce. 

Mdot21

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #212 on: January 23, 2025, 09:21:00 AM »
I'm a few years younger than you, and I didn't hear much about 1968 until 2002. Instead it was Archie Griffin era that was held up as the gold standard of CFB history. He played before we were born as well.

Really it was just "Woody Hayes" until Urban Meyer got hired. Tressel was just a poor man's Woody Hayes. Or maybe a rich man's Earle Bruce.
Tressel does not get his due enough. He is the one that flipped the script in THE GAME and started dominating Michigan. Oh and he also won a Natty and beat probably the most talented college football program ever. Those '01-'02 Canes teams were insane. And he beat em. For the Natty. That's LEGEND status right there.

FearlessF

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #213 on: January 23, 2025, 09:24:29 AM »
ya but, the sweater
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SuperMario

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #214 on: January 23, 2025, 09:30:46 AM »
Tressel does not get his due enough. He is the one that flipped the script in THE GAME and started dominating Michigan. Oh and he also won a Natty and beat probably the most talented college football program ever. Those '01-'02 Canes teams were insane. And he beat em. For the Natty. That's LEGEND status right there.
Completely agree with this. He won a title and beat a completely loaded Miami team with Craig Krenzel. Ohio State has had the luxury of absolutely incredible coaching and it completely shifted when the Sweatervest hit campus. 

Mdot21

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #215 on: January 23, 2025, 09:33:27 AM »
someone should probably tell them about 2024 Ohio State vs 2024 Michigan...lol.  


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medinabuckeye1

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #216 on: January 23, 2025, 10:05:01 AM »
Tressel does not get his due enough. He is the one that flipped the script in THE GAME and started dominating Michigan. Oh and he also won a Natty and beat probably the most talented college football program ever. Those '01-'02 Canes teams were insane. And he beat em. For the Natty. That's LEGEND status right there.
Completely agree with this. He won a title and beat a completely loaded Miami team with Craig Krenzel. Ohio State has had the luxury of absolutely incredible coaching and it completely shifted when the Sweatervest hit campus.
Tressel deserves a lot of credit but there is also another Ohio State coach who deserves some . . .

For as much as most Ohio State fans (not excluding myself here) hated Cooper's repeated losses to Michigan, especially the losses to obviously inferior teams, John Cooper brought Ohio State's recruiting into the modern era and made it national.  

Back when Woody was coaching Ohio State really didn't recruit nationally.  Ohio obviously has a lot of HS Football talent so to some extent they didn't need to but that is also part of the reason that by the end of Woody's tenure the Buckeyes were almost as bad in Bowls as Michigan.  Woody ended up 4-4 in Rose Bowls but note that he was 3-0 before Bo got to Michigan then went 1-4 during the Ten Year War.  Meanwhile Bo went 0-5 so the two teams were a pathetic 1-9 in Rose Bowls from the 1969-1978 seasons (1970-1979 Rose Bowls).  

Early in Woody's tenure he REALLY pissed off the west coast media with a comment that Ohio State's Rose Bowl opponent was a good team, then he said something to the effect that they would probably finish "4th or 5th in 'our' league".  It was probably stupid to say that but it wasn't wrong.  The Big Ten / Pac 8 / Rose Bowl agreement started with the 1946 season (1947 Rose Bowl) and from there the results were:
  • Six straight Big Ten wins (1947-1952)
  • A Pac win (1953)
  • Six straight Big Ten wins (1954-1959)
  • Two Pac wins (1960/61)
  • A Big Ten win (1962)
  • A Pac win (1963)
  • Two Big Ten wins (1964/5)
  • A Pac win (1966)
  • A Big Ten win (1967)
  • A Pac win (1968)
  • A Big Ten win (1969)
Overall, in those first 23 years the Big Ten went 17-6 so when Woody said that the Pac Champions would probably be 4th or 5th in the Big Ten he probably wasn't wrong.  However, that changed as the national population shifted which probably contributed to the Big Ten being so bad in the Rose Bowl in the 1970's.  

Earle Bruce was a terrible recruiter.  He basically just tried to be a continuation of what Woody had done but Woody started in 1951.  Note that in the 1950 US Census:
  • Ohio had only recently been passed by California (Ohio had a larger population in the 1940 census)
  • Ohio still had a larger population than Texas (7.9M vs 7.7M)
  • Ohio's population was roughly 3x the population of Florida (7.9M vs 2.8M)
  • Other than California, in 1950 the only states with larger populations than Ohio were in the midwest (IL) or in the northeast (PA, NY)
In the 1950's there wasn't a need to recruit nationally because there wasn't that much talent in the rest of the country anyway.  

Bruce's attempt to replicate Woody's tenure but ~30 years later resulted in a bunch of pretty good Ohio State teams that weren't great.  They lost exactly three games each year from 1980-1986 and the school pulled the plug in 1987.  Bruce had more-or-less dominated the 'little eight' and he'd been competitive with Michigan (5-4 in his nine years) but he hadn't been nationally competitive.  

Cooper obviously struggled with Michigan and in bowls but he modernized and nationalized Ohio State's.  Tressel won in 2002 mostly with players that John Cooper brought to Columbus.  Tresel maintained that then Urban Meyer REALLY ramped it up.  

FearlessF

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #217 on: January 23, 2025, 10:10:28 AM »
fire ryan day!
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medinabuckeye1

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #218 on: January 23, 2025, 10:24:25 AM »
A couple things I wanted to comment on:

First is that Ohio State's defense deserves a LOT more credit than they'll get for not just the ND win but the CFP run in general.  

Notre Dame rushed 26 times on Monday night and gained 53 yards.  That is 2.0 ypc.  That is pathetic.  It actually gets worse.  When I first saw that stat I thought to myself "didn't they have 40-someting on their first drive?"  I finally took the time to go and check and yes, they did.  On their opening drive Notre Dame rushed 13 times for 44 yards (3.4 ypc).  They also had their two longest runs of the night, an 8 yarder by Riley Leonard on the game's second play and a 9 yarder by Jadarian Price to get into the Red Zone.  If you back out the 13 plays and 44 yards that ND had rushing on the first drive, for the rest of the game they ran 13 more times for 9 more yards.  That is a just flat out insane performance by the Ohio State defense.  

Second is that when you look at the stats it is astounding that this game was as close as it was:

  • tOSU outgained ND 445-308
  • tOSU had an advantage in TOP despite ND's 9 minute opening drive
  • tOSU outgained ND on passing attempts 11-8
  • tOSU outgained ND on rushing attempts 5.2-2.0
  • ND did have an advantage in turnovers 1-0 but that was more-or-less equalized by ND's failed fake punt

I will say that the Egbuka fumble probably prevented this from being a blowout.  At that point the 4th quarter had just started, Ohio State was still up by 16 (31-15), and Egbuka's catch and run had gotten tOSU into the Red Zone.  If he doesn't fumble there the Buckeyes have a 1st down at the ND 21 with a 16 point lead and <15 minutes to go.  


I absolutely despise ND but you have to give them and their Buckeye coach credit for staying in this game.  They could easily have folded down 31-7 but they didn't.  They kept fighting and kept it together and miraculously made this a one-score game in the fourth quarter.  

SuperMario

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #219 on: January 23, 2025, 11:06:07 AM »
Ehh.. You can't really knock the Notre Dame running game because they didn't give it a chance and when they were suddenly down big, they couldn't rely on the run. Their star running back Love had 4 carries. They had 17 QB sneaks. YPC in that scenario aren't exactly going to tell a big story. Secondly, yards per passing attempt changed wildly on the one play that sealed the win for the Buckeyes in the 56 yard pass to Smith, which was incredibly odd defensive move, especially putting Notre Dame's worst DB on the best WR in the country. OSU dominated the game, but I don't think it was their defense that dominated, it was Notre Dame's defense unable to stop OSU's dominant offense. If anyone isn't getting enough love, it's Will Howard. The guy played a perfect game. The second time OSU was unstoppable and went up 14-7, Notre Dame could tell they had to be aggressive and try to score every possession and got away from what they opened the game with. 

As good as Freeman has been all season, he also had two hugely dumb calls. The fake punt and kicking the field goal with the clock working against him. 

SFBadger96

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #220 on: January 23, 2025, 11:22:13 AM »
My take on the deciding factor in the game was OSU's essentially unstoppable offense in the first three quarters--and yeah, the fumble is what got ND back into it. Who knew: turnovers make a big difference? Ordinarily an offense can have a couple of rough drives and still be in the game. Not this time. By the third time ND had the ball, it was clear they were desperate. They were only down 14-7, but OSU had simply carved up their defense, which is no small thing--that was a pretty good defense all year. By the fourt time, ND was in a huge hole. The first (only?) OSU punt was in the fourth quarter, right, after the fumble?

That's not to say that OSU's defense doesn't deserve credit--of course it does--but ND was out of its gameplan early because OSU's offense was so good.

And on the other point: yeah, Tressel was a great head coach for Ohio State. I guess Urban Meyer sucked some of the air out of Tressel's tenure because of how good he was, but that Tressel team was really, really good every year. Woody Hayes was Woody Hayes. Unfair to compare anyone to him. Kind of like Knute Rockne for Notre Dame. He was amazing, but the coaches that came after stood on their own--as does Tressel (or at least he should).

SFBadger96

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #221 on: January 23, 2025, 11:33:18 AM »
Also, comparing different national title teams is always fun. Michigan's title* team from 2023 was really good. 15 wins, no losses, and wins over Alabama, Washington, and very good Ohio State, Iowa, and Penn State teams. That's a solid record--comparable to most any national title team, and with the two playoff wins, that was impressive.

Ohio State this year, because of the playoff format, can boast the best post season by far of any team ever (and the only one to have the opportunity so far). Not only did they win against really good competition, but they won relatively easy. Yeah, the Texas game was close until the end, and yeah, ND managed to make it a 1-score game in the fourth quarter, but the ND game was always pretty well in hand, and the dismantlings of Oregon and Tennessee were impressive. So Ohio State ends the season with wins over teams 2-5 in the final AP poll, and six of the top 10 (since Ohio State is #1, that's six of nine other programs in the AP top 10). Without looking, I suspect Ohio State is the only team that can ever claim that.
...
And two losses. One to the AP #3, by 1, 2000 miles from home. No shame in that. One, at home, to a team that effectively finished 29th in the AP poll. Ouch. So 2024 OSU has both the really great and the really questionable as far as all-time national champions go.
And if I'm an Ohio State fan (good golly I'm not) all you [Michigan] haters can suck on my national title. Enjoy whatever tarnish you want to put on this season, OSU won the whole damn thing fair and square. No asterisk here.

SuperMario

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #222 on: January 23, 2025, 11:53:19 AM »
@SFBadger96 those are two really good posts and spot on.

Except 1 area. It's not hating. It's simply reminding them a large amount of them wanted their coach fired at the end of the regular season because of a specific outcome and all of these seniors are still searching for their misplaced gold pants. They did win fair and square and had a great run and had to be a fun time for a Buckeye fan. To go from a place of great frustration at the end of November to the trophy holding Monday night is a huge roller coaster, yet probably awesome ride. 

Mdot21

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Re: #8 Ohio State 34, #7 Notre Dame 23 Post Game
« Reply #223 on: January 23, 2025, 12:19:41 PM »
Except 1 area. It's not hating. It's simply reminding them a large amount of them wanted their coach fired at the end of the regular season because of a specific outcome and all of these seniors are still searching for their misplaced gold pants. They did win fair and square and had a great run and had to be a fun time for a Buckeye fan. To go from a place of great frustration at the end of November to the trophy holding Monday night is a huge roller coaster, yet probably awesome ride.
100%. 

a huge section of the crazy ass OSU fans actually wanted a guy who had won 90% of his games and been to 4 playoffs in 6 years fired. it’s fun to remind them of that. so much so that Day’s family was getting harassed and death threats and he had to have armed police officers on his street apparently.

of course now all those crazies have amnesia.

 

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