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Topic: Bad Offensive Lines

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CatsbyAZ

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Bad Offensive Lines
« on: September 21, 2017, 09:33:59 AM »
Anyone in the mood to discuss Offensive Lines? Specifically how bad the Sunday pros are?

Along with the NFL's attendance problem, the offensive lines are receiving as much negative attention.

It was interesting to watch how aggressive NFL GMs went after the small crop of OL free agents this past offseason. They'd rather bring aboard proven, coached-up lineman than risk 1st or 2nd round draft capital on franchise tackles. Gone are the days that a first round pick could guarantee a 5 or 10 season anchor at the LT position. This past draft had only two OL drafted and the first off the board went as late as 20th (to the Broncos.) GMs and coaches are complaining that the latest collective bargaining agreement cuts into the time needed to coach up their OLs which traditionally require the most intensive development. In turn, it's DLs, requiring less coaching, that are running OLs off the field. It certainly doesn't help, as has been widely pointed out, that the spread and quick-snap offenses of so many college programs offer no preparation for the NFL's behind-center Pro style.

It is an irony that in an offense-minded league driven by fantasy stats and talent searches for the next superstar QB it's the defenses now dictating much of the on-field product.


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ELA

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2017, 09:37:02 AM »
A big part of the problem is the lack of padded practices.

These guys have no idea how to run block, and their cohesiveness in pass blocking is lacking now too.

That has been the biggest detriment to the game with those rule changes, but I guess if we are going to 7 on 7 anyway, who cares.

I think as the units work together, and these games are the limited de facto practice time they get, you'll see improvement.

Entropy

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2017, 10:16:19 AM »
The NFL has decided years ago they want more passing and more "excitement".

MaximumSam

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2017, 10:50:48 AM »
With the rules favoring passing, road grading offensive linemen aren't as effective, and instead they get guys who mostly just try to get in the way of uber-athletic pass rushers.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2017, 11:00:57 AM »
I stopped watching the NFL the day that the Browns named Johnny Football the starter. 

I haven't looked back. No regrets. 
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Mdot21

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2017, 12:50:29 PM »
think it has a lot to do with spread offenses in college and with high school teams not preparing it's linemen for college. A lot of high schools run option or spread option and rarely ever pass the ball.

OL recruiting for college and drafting OL in the NFL is the biggest crap-shoot it's ever been. It's almost a complete crap-shoot really. That's why I really don't pay much attention to OL recruiting or fret too much about it. It doesn't matter. The OL coaching and player development and S&C program matter far more.

MarqHusker

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2017, 01:09:54 PM »
think it has a lot to do with spread offenses in college and with high school teams not preparing it's linemen for college. A lot of high schools run option or spread option and rarely ever pass the ball.

OL recruiting for college and drafting OL in the NFL is the biggest crap-shoot it's ever been. It's almost a complete crap-shoot really. That's why I really don't pay much attention to OL recruiting or fret too much about it. It doesn't matter. The OL coaching and player development and S&C program matter far more.
I'm not sure where you're watching/following HS football,   I've observed that passing has proliferated like wild fire in the twenty ish years since I played HS football.   Perhaps I see it more, since I've moved closer to the south.  I rarely see the power I anymore and almost never see the Wing-T.   That was easily 75%+ of the offensive sets when I was in HS in the mid 90s in the state of WI.
I fully support your other points.   Scouts routinely discount run blocking when rating players (because nobody runs in the pros) and thus, the run blocking stinks on Sunday.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2017, 02:37:03 PM »
I've been shocked by how defenses have been so predominant in the early weeks of this NFL season. For a league which wants passing touchdowns and excitement, it seems like they're getting sacks and interceptions instead. Well, I guess if you call pick-sixes passing touchdowns, it counts, right?

ELA

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2017, 02:43:55 PM »
I've been shocked by how defenses have been so predominant in the early weeks of this NFL season. For a league which wants passing touchdowns and excitement, it seems like they're getting sacks and interceptions instead. Well, I guess if you call pick-sixes passing touchdowns, it counts, right?

I think it's been more bad offense than good defense.

I think each new offensive innovation has a wave.  You get a few guys doing it, and it's sparse but successful.  Leads to more people doing it, and frequently at a low execution level, but it still works because defenses haven't caught up.  Once defenses do, you have this.  I think you've seen some very vanilla offense in the NFL, due to lack of practice, and player movement, and the fact that running a lot of this HUNH with west coast principles was working.  Brady and Manning are not doing anything mind blowing.  Just a bunch of quick slant, and heavy uses of rubs and pick plays.  Led to a lot of the league doing the same thing.  But defenses always start to figure it out.  That's where we are now.  A lot of vanilla offense against defenses that have seen it enough that you can't get away with running it at a low level.

Just look at how yards per completion keeps dropping.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2017, 02:46:19 PM by ELA »

847badgerfan

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2017, 03:12:04 PM »
OL recruiting for college and drafting OL in the NFL is the biggest crap-shoot it's ever been. It's almost a complete crap-shoot really. That's why I really don't pay much attention to OL recruiting or fret too much about it. It doesn't matter. The OL coaching and player development and S&C program matter far more.
You could be a spokesman for UW.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Mdot21

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2017, 03:19:34 PM »
You could be a spokesman for UW.
UW is a great example of it. They just keep churnin' 'em out. Not like they are signing 5* OL's every class either.
Michigan went through a stretch with Hoke when they were signing SO many 5* and 4* OL's and virtually none of them panned out. LTT got kicked off the team, Bosch went mental and transferred, David Dawson couldn't crack the two-deep, Kalis looked like a 5* but played like a 3* - the best OL they had was Glasgow- a walk-on.
I think things will start to change for the Michigan OL going forward- but it won't be because of any STARZ they sign. It'll be because they have a head coach in Harbaugh who develops players- and they basically two OL coaches- both of whom have good reps for developing OL's in Drevno and Frey.

Temp430

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2017, 03:24:33 PM »
Two years ago Penn State's OL was abysmal.  Now Coach Franklin claims they're the best in the Big Ten and he may be right.  Same kids I think.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2017, 03:26:11 PM by Temp430 »
A decade of Victory over Penn State.

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Geolion91

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2017, 04:22:40 PM »
Two years ago Penn State's OL was abysmal.  Now Coach Franklin claims they're the best in the Big Ten and he may be right.  Same kids I think.
There has been some addition by subtraction, noteably the Predator, Paris Palmer

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Bad Offensive Lines
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2017, 04:46:52 PM »
The guy that was a human turnstile against Temple's two man rush? 


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