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Topic: 2023 Michigan Season Thread

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utee94

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1022 on: October 28, 2023, 09:26:53 AM »
Well now where the heck are we supposed to discuss popular music???

It sounds to me like HB wants to get his pound of flesh from a rival.  I get that.  There's not an NCAA program out there that has cheated longer and more thoroughly than Oklahoma, and I'd love to see them called out for that more often as well.

But this just isn't that kind of place.  I'm sure there are plenty of all-tOSU message boards where posters are willing to wallow in it forever.  That might be a better place to go, to vent your feelings.

If you're posting the same stuff over and over again here, and you're not getting the engagement you want, then I'm not sure what more you want from this message boad?

FearlessF

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1023 on: October 28, 2023, 09:27:54 AM »
and there are rules about derailing threads
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

847badgerfan

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1024 on: October 28, 2023, 09:28:16 AM »
Well now where the heck are we supposed to discuss popular music???

It sounds to me like HB wants to get his pound of flesh from a rival.  I get that, there's not an NCAA program out there who has cheated longer and more thoroughly than Oklahoma, and I'd love to see them called out for that more often as well.

But this just isn't that kind of place.  I'm sure there are plenty of all-tOSU message boards where posters are willing to wallow in it forever.  That might be a better place to go, to vent your feelings.

If you're posting the same stuff over and over again here, and you're not getting the engagement you want, then I'm not sure what more you want from this message boad?
In other news is a catch all, perhaps.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

utee94

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1025 on: October 28, 2023, 09:28:19 AM »
and there are rules about derailing threads
Are there?  Why?  That seems silly and childish.

FearlessF

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1026 on: October 28, 2023, 09:28:49 AM »
Well now where the heck are we supposed to discuss popular music???


the backporch, obviously
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

FearlessF

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1027 on: October 28, 2023, 09:29:54 AM »
Are there?  Why?  That seems silly and childish.
well, it's not like any of us are childish enough to follow those unwritten rulz
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1028 on: October 28, 2023, 09:30:06 AM »
In other news is a catch all, perhaps.
Nah, too much BS politics in that thread.

Maybe we can do it on a thread that nobody cares about.  Purdue Football Season thread or something.  I'll have to think about it.

847badgerfan

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1029 on: October 28, 2023, 09:30:37 AM »
and there are rules about derailing threads
Drew gave us this place in 2017 and I don't recall ever having posted any rules here. It hasn't been needed as we police ourselves. Band of brothers.

HB policed the derailment, I addressed his point.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Cincydawg

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1030 on: October 28, 2023, 09:51:43 AM »
These stories seem to burst onto the scene with a flurry of "news" (leaks mostly) and then some dribs and drabs and a ton of speculation and "analysis" and then a long "quiet period" where not much is revealed/analyzed/known that is new.

SuperMario

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1031 on: October 28, 2023, 09:59:34 AM »
I didn’t want to discuss this topic any more, but my business partner brought up an interesting point. For reference, he is an OSU grad and OSU fan.

While it’s likely Michigan crossed the line and violated rules, how do we know the rest of the staff and players knew how Stalions was figuring out the sign stealing? The sign stealing is legal, so the staff and Harbaugh wouldn’t immediately say that’s wrong or breaking the rules. I think we can all agree that happens almost everywhere.

So what if Stalions pitch was that because of his training, he figured out a way to know the plays coming from video?  He takes it to Harbaugh and staff and says he gathers video and has a third party that helps him produce and analyze the video and sometimes there will be additional expresses they have to analyze the video and they have technical expenses to make it happen. Jim asks, you’re doing all this by video? And Stalions confirms. Harbaugh and staff think this guy is a guru and stumbled upon a way for an edge, taking signs by video.

My partner brought this up because we rely on third parties for a lot of areas of our business, some of them vital. We vet them out upfront, go over their process, but also take their word how some of it is being done is exactly what they say. Running a business is overwhelming and our day to day is putting trust in others that they are doing things far from lines being crossed, including our own staff. Yet there isn’t time to babysit every person’s every action. When some of our staff seems incredibly competent and produce at a high level, our trust there is typically even greater.

So here’s the long-winded point. Stalions was  having people go into stadiums to film. I would be surprised if that many “sources” are incorrect. It seems like there’s a highly likelihood that Michigan was compensating third party or reimbursing Stalions for the expenses of putting this together. Seems likely as well. But how is it that everyone is so confident Harbaugh and the rest of the staff knew how it was happening and that it was crossing any lines? We don’t! Does anyone think Harbaugh or staff were watching videos taken on a cell phone of opposing coaches. Do they have time for that? Or is it more likely they saw a finished product of what signs would be called, descriptions of it .There’s no concrete evidence either way… Yet. So many are jumping to worst case scenario conclusions because it fits their desire, while Michigan fans defend, deflect and go to best case scenario. 

Again, this is an OSU guy that took this position with me, a Michigan guy.  He’s younger than me, is more tied into the Stalions generation and his big stance was with technology, AI, the amount of videos, the amount coverage on each football game, we don’t really know that Stalions didn’t claim he had a technology edge, with a team of people to better analyze video data than anyone in the country.  

Is my hope best case scenario after talking about this? Yes because no one wants their program to be top to bottom guys that cross lines, but it’s also reasonable to say the average person doesn’t know if this is or is not the case. So while some run around screaming cheaters, until there’s proof, there’s also an argument that can be made that nearly everyone thought they had an edge that was still on the right side of things.

So go ahead and tear that thought apart, but the reality is we simply don’t know the facts yet. We know there’s likely lines crossed, but we don’t know the real story.






Cincydawg

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1032 on: October 28, 2023, 10:05:38 AM »

Cincydawg

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1033 on: October 28, 2023, 10:09:49 AM »
FWIW, I think that position is dumb.

Honestbuckeye

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1034 on: October 28, 2023, 10:10:57 AM »
Well now where the heck are we supposed to discuss popular music???

It sounds to me like HB wants to get his pound of flesh from a rival.  I get that.  There's not an NCAA program out there that has cheated longer and more thoroughly than Oklahoma, and I'd love to see them called out for that more often as well.

But this just isn't that kind of place.  I'm sure there are plenty of all-tOSU message boards where posters are willing to wallow in it forever.  That might be a better place to go, to vent your feelings.

If you're posting the same stuff over and over again here, and you're not getting the engagement you want, then I'm not sure what more you want from this message boad?
To the contrary, I do not want a pound of flesh. If you go back through the threads, you will see that I was reacting as opposed to proactively posting stuff, at least in the beginning. 

I am fine leaving it alone if it’s inflammatory or having a debate if it’s respectful.

Besides- there is water under the bridge.  Whatever happened- it can’t be undone. No “ punishment” is going to change it. 

Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

Honestbuckeye

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Re: 2023 Michigan Season Thread
« Reply #1035 on: October 28, 2023, 10:12:25 AM »

Very misleading CDawg.  Day wants to play that game more than anyone.  That is an idiot fan.
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

 

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