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Topic: The Ukraine Topic

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CatsbyAZ

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1428 on: March 22, 2022, 11:42:55 AM »
think I'll stock up on frozen pizzas

Speaking of which, here's your daily reminder on how fragile government stability can be: According to Michael Tanchum of the Middle East Institute, "keeping the price of Egypt's staple food affordable has been the bedrock of regime stability" for 60 years.



https://twitter.com/IBTimes/status/1504443119382765572

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1429 on: March 22, 2022, 11:48:40 AM »
Speaking of which, here's your daily reminder on how fragile government stability can be: According to Michael Tanchum of the Middle East Institute, "keeping the price of Egypt's staple food affordable has been the bedrock of regime stability" for 60 years.



https://twitter.com/IBTimes/status/1504443119382765572
Bread and circuses. Gov't can do pretty much whatever they want as long as people are eating and entertained...

utee94

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1430 on: March 22, 2022, 11:49:19 AM »
They have no bread?

Let them eat circus animals!


MrNubbz

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1432 on: March 22, 2022, 02:46:00 PM »
Or espionage
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

Mdot21

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1433 on: March 22, 2022, 03:35:59 PM »
so just to recap here, Russia is obviously the bad guys here, but man Ukraine has been moving further and further from openness and democracy since US overthrew their government in 2014.

Zelensky just moved to ban 11 political parties in Ukraine, including the Opposition Platform for Life party, which came second in the recent elections, currently holds 44 seats (roughly 10% of all seats) in the 450-seat Ukrainian Parliament, and is the largest opposition party to Zelensky's Servant of the People party.

Here are some excerpts from a recent article on this written by a Ukrainian author/sociologist Volodymyr Ishchenko who works at a university in Berlin and wrote a book about the Euromaidan protests in 2013-2014; link


"The suspensions have more to do with the post-Euromaidan polarisation of Ukrainian politics than genuine security concerns related to the Russian invasion.

These parties do command significant public support. For example, three of the recently suspended parties participated in the parliamentary elections in 2019 and combined received about 2.7 million votes (18.3 percent) and in the most recent polls conducted before Russia’s invasion, these parties collectively scored about 16-20 percent of the vote.

So, this isn't good. Has been a pattern in Ukraine however. They've been banning parties, censoring media, and arresting opposition since 2014 without much evidence/due process. They have now banned the #1 and #2 largest opposition parties in the country. They banned the #2 largest opposition party last year. No banning of ultra-right wing parties or disbanding of state sponsored neo-nazi militias/police though....


https://twitter.com/MarkAmesExiled/status/1505963988470968328?s=20&t=nIk_1dQX6OK_fX4R_6A_hw


Mdot21

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1434 on: March 22, 2022, 03:36:49 PM »

Mdot21

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1435 on: March 22, 2022, 03:44:00 PM »
seems like Hillary Clinton (when she went on MSNBC and almost cheerleading "bleeding Russia") isn't the only DC elite publicly letting the cat out of the bag...seems like US plan is to use Ukraine as a quasi-Afghanistan to bleed Russia.


https://twitter.com/Bershidsky/status/1506329273262563328?s=20&t=nIk_1dQX6OK_fX4R_6A_hw



https://twitter.com/yashalevine/status/1506337825242894337?s=20&t=dfECDVOdjeOQinELBdAROg



https://twitter.com/MarkAmesExiled/status/1506350013701627910?s=20&t=dfECDVOdjeOQinELBdAROg

Honestbuckeye

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1436 on: March 22, 2022, 03:59:34 PM »
so just to recap here, Russia is obviously the bad guys here, but man Ukraine has been moving further and further from openness and democracy since US overthrew their government in 2014.

Zelensky just moved to ban 11 political parties in Ukraine, including the Opposition Platform for Life party, which came second in the recent elections, currently holds 44 seats (roughly 10% of all seats) in the 450-seat Ukrainian Parliament, and is the largest opposition party to Zelensky's Servant of the People party.

Here are some excerpts from a recent article on this written by a Ukrainian author/sociologist Volodymyr Ishchenko who works at a university in Berlin and wrote a book about the Euromaidan protests in 2013-2014; link


"The suspensions have more to do with the post-Euromaidan polarisation of Ukrainian politics than genuine security concerns related to the Russian invasion.

These parties do command significant public support. For example, three of the recently suspended parties participated in the parliamentary elections in 2019 and combined received about 2.7 million votes (18.3 percent) and in the most recent polls conducted before Russia’s invasion, these parties collectively scored about 16-20 percent of the vote.

So, this isn't good. Has been a pattern in Ukraine however. They've been banning parties, censoring media, and arresting opposition since 2014 without much evidence/due process. They have now banned the #1 and #2 largest opposition parties in the country. They banned the #2 largest opposition party last year. No banning of ultra-right wing parties or disbanding of state sponsored neo-nazi militias/police though....


https://twitter.com/MarkAmesExiled/status/1505963988470968328?s=20&t=nIk_1dQX6OK_fX4R_6A_hw


Agree that obviously this invasion is a tragedy. Russia sucks and Putin is a dickface. (Utee is teaching me a new language😂)

As for Zelensky- he would fit right in here in Murica   
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

longhorn320

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1437 on: March 22, 2022, 04:25:44 PM »
I dont feel a bit sorry for Russia even if the dems might have a different reason for supporting sanctions.  All Putin has to do is pull out of Ukraine and our relations might begin to heal.  I do want to see Putin charged for war crimes.

As far as Ukraine's actions concerning a reduction of democracy I dont like it but am willing to give them a temp pass until this thing is over.  Even Lincoln took away some individual rights during the Civil War.

They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

Mdot21

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1438 on: March 22, 2022, 05:23:01 PM »
in I'll take...Ukraine is an insanely corrupt country for $400....


An ex-deputy of former US sock puppet/Ukrainian Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk ("Yats" as US diplomat/coup extraordinaire Victoria Nuland lovingly referred to him as) and former member of the Ukrainian Parliament- Igor Kotvitsky - of the pro-west nationalist People’s Front party- the party started by "Yats" - you know- the US hand-picked sock puppet in the coup to overthrow the democratically elected government of Viktor Yanukovych - has been caught trying to flee Ukraine with $28 million US in cash and another 1.3 million Euros in cash.
 


https://twitter.com/MarkAmesExiled/status/1505699645959331840?s=20&t=8NaCBwGK4RzVc2YXQNT9yQ

utee94

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1439 on: March 22, 2022, 05:24:41 PM »
All that, and still not anywhere close to as corrupt as dickface putin's Russia.

Mdot21

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1440 on: March 22, 2022, 05:26:33 PM »
I dont feel a bit sorry for Russia even if the dems might have a different reason for supporting sanctions.  All Putin has to do is pull out of Ukraine and our relations might begin to heal.  I do want to see Putin charged for war crimes.


I feel sorry for average Russians who did not want this war, and who are getting crushed by the sanctions. Obviously I feel worse for the Ukrainians who actually being killed and having their homes and cities destroyed. It's just an ugly, sad, awful tragedy all the way around. 


Putin is not going to be charged with war crimes. And US can't and won't call for that either, for obvious reasons. Throwing stones, glass houses and all that. US also doesn't even recognize the ICC or ICJ as legitimiate.



As far as Ukraine's actions concerning a reduction of democracy I dont like it but am willing to give them a temp pass until this thing is over.  Even Lincoln took away some individual rights during the Civil War.

it's very concerning, and it's a trend in that country unfortunately, not something that just popped up overnight because of this war. My gut is they are probably using the war as an excuse/pretext to crackdown on opposition and seize more authority/power as governments tend to do. Suspending some civil rights and imposing martial law during a war is not that uncommon. Flat out banning your political opposition parties- not sure on that one. I don't recall Lincoln banning political parties during the Civil War. 

Last year the Zelenskyy government banned the second largest opposition party in Ukraine. They have now just banned the largest opposition party now in Ukraine, a party that holds 10% of the seats in Parliament and gets around 20% of the vote. Can't just go around banning the #1 and #2 parties that are your biggest opposition. Governments that seize power, rarely if ever let go of said power. That's why point blank, you can't let them have more and expanding power in the first place.

Mdot21

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #1441 on: March 22, 2022, 05:37:35 PM »
All that, and still not anywhere close to as corrupt as dickface putin's Russia.
I have no idea how they come up with these corruption indexes, but they're not that far apart in them. They rank 180 countries. #180 is the most corrupt, #1 is the least corrupt. South Sudan is most corrupt at #180, Denmark is least corrupt at #1.  

https://www.nationsonline.org/oneworld/corruption-part-II.htm

Ukraine - ranked #121, Russia - ranked #133. 

You're probably right though as Russia is a much bigger and wealthier nation (100+ million more people, GDP roughly 10x the size) and it's entire system has been built on corruption since the collapse of the Soviet Union.

 

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