header pic

Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

The 'Old' CFN/Scout Crowd- Enjoy Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching 'takes' and discussing topics surrounding the game. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE site and to take part in our community- a community with you- the user, the fan, -and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean place to interact.


« previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 9 10 [11] 12 13 ... 153   Go Down
Author

Topic: The Ukraine Topic

 (Read 76898 times)

Mdot21

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 14379
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #140 on: February 28, 2022, 05:40:28 PM »
Ukraine saying any foreigners who want to come to Ukraine can come join the fight- they'll have you. All the chickenhawks in US establishment who are desperate to go to war over Ukraine and start WWIII and push the world toward nuclear war- not even any need for that- just take Ukraine up on this call. Fly to Ukraine, contact the government and pick up your free weapons and fight. Adam Kinzinger your ticket is on me pal.



https://twitter.com/richimedhurst/status/1498411948840529930?s=20&t=xdKxLLFLRJJWyK-k1d5dNg


https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1498413471821615113?s=20&t=xdKxLLFLRJJWyK-k1d5dNg
Logged

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 71604
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #141 on: February 28, 2022, 05:44:10 PM »
Is there a specific individual "CNN chicken hawk" saying we should get involved militarily?

Anyone I've heard of?  I'm sure there are some fairly obscure folks saying this.  (I'm curious who on CNN has advocated for this.)
Logged

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 71604
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #142 on: February 28, 2022, 05:47:15 PM »
GOP Rep. Adam Kinzinger calls for U.S.-enforced no-fly zone over Ukraine (theweek.com)

I found one, he's not on CNN generally.  Maybe he is a chicken hawk, not very prominent in the news much.
Logged

Mdot21

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 14379
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #143 on: February 28, 2022, 05:52:08 PM »
Quote from: GopherRock on February 28, 2022, 05:37:00 PM
Nuclear weapons.
this basically just prevents a nation from invasion. it does not make a nation a power on the worlds stage. North Korea has nuclear weapons too- which is probably the primary reason they haven't been invaded and toppled. 

France is barely even a regional power in Europe. Germany and UK are both more powerful countries in Europe alone. Germany has the largest economy in Europe, the ECB is headquartered in Germany and Germany has the most influence/sway over the ECB and the EU of any single nation in Europe. Other European nations are bitching about this all of the time. UK also has a larger economy than France and much closer/tighter relationship with the worlds still lone superpower (US) - and London is still one of the handful of financial hubs of the entire world and along with New York City make up the two major financial hubs of the entire Western world.

France has next to zero power on the worlds stage. They are the #3 guy in their own little backyard. 
Logged

utee94

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 17710
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #144 on: February 28, 2022, 05:52:08 PM »
Over the past few days, there are all kinds of people asking about the US or NATO creating a no-fly zone.  Mostly people who really don't like watching Ukrainians die.  And the vast majority of them don't understand that it would represent escalation to a shooting war between the US and Russia, which is obviously to be avoided.

I have no idea what a "CNN Chickenhawk" is though.

It it this little guy right here?








Logged

Mdot21

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 14379
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #145 on: February 28, 2022, 05:53:49 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on February 28, 2022, 05:44:10 PM
Is there a specific individual "CNN chicken hawk" saying we should get involved militarily?

Anyone I've heard of?  I'm sure there are some fairly obscure folks saying this.  (I'm curious who on CNN has advocated for this.)
Idk could be wrong, but I think the guy is just referring to all media members who clamor for escalation as CNN chickenhawks. 

And there are plenty of people in US establishment media and the US gov't calling for No Fly Zones or declarations of war all over social media. It's a shitshow- as usual.
Logged

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 71604
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #146 on: February 28, 2022, 05:58:18 PM »
I found one, I imagine there are a few more somewhere.  I don't think it's a popularly held opinion.  And folks of course are free to voice such opinions, just as others can counter them.  I bet there are a similar number claiming none of this should concern us, it's not our problem, let them sort it out, no sanctions etc.

I personally don't get too jazzed up about what a handful of fairly unimportant people opine on a topic.
Logged

utee94

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 17710
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #147 on: February 28, 2022, 05:58:32 PM »
On social media and in real discussions with actual humans, I've seen quite a few people ask for a "No Fly Zone" and it's obvious they don't understand what that means.  Their hearts are in the right place, they really don't want to see continued bombings of Ukrainian cities, they don't want to see the death and destruction that comes along with that.  With respect to the folks I've interacted with, they're not intentionally advocating for war, they just don't know any better.

They seem to think we can just declare one and then nobody can fly there. They don't realize it would require enforcement, which would result in air combat, which means a direct shooting war between Russia and whatever forces are attempting to enforce the No Fly Zone.

I suspect they've just heard the term from war movies or spy movies and think it sounds official.
Logged

Mdot21

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 14379
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #148 on: February 28, 2022, 06:00:01 PM »
Zelenskyy has asked Biden to impose a No Fly Zone over Ukraine. 

The President's spokeswoman Jen Psaki on a US no-fly zone: "That is definitely escalatory. That is not something the president wants to do."

U.K. Defense Secretary Ben Wallace has also ruled out the idea, saying that "NATO would have to effectively declare war on Russia."

So luckily the people in power are not stupid and don't listen to catcalls for escalation by stupid people who apparently want WWIII to start and for all of us to die. 
Logged

utee94

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 17710
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #149 on: February 28, 2022, 06:04:41 PM »
Quote from: Mdot21 on February 28, 2022, 06:00:01 PM
Zelenskyy has asked Biden to impose a No Fly Zone over Ukraine.

The President's spokeswoman Jen Psaki on a US no-fly zone: "That is definitely escalatory. That is not something the president wants to do."

U.K. Defense Secretary Ben Wallace has also ruled out the idea, saying that "NATO would have to effectively declare war on Russia."

So luckily the people in power are not stupid and don't listen to catcalls for escalation by stupid people who apparently want WWIII to start and for all of us to die.

Well I mean, Zelenskyy's reasons for asking for one are obvious.  Of course he'd ask for one.  I don't fault him for the request, in fact he wouldn't be doing his job if he DIDN'T ask for one.

He's doing the appropriate thing, and the US and UK are responding appropriately.

I'm sure there are some war hawks in US government that are itching to get involved, because there are always war hawks in government and that's what war hawks do.

And there are lots of well-meaning but ignorant civilian citizens around the globe that think that we should be doing more to help, and a "No Fly Zone" sounds a lot less kill-y than committing ground troops.  Their hearts are in the right place, they just don't understand that "That's not how any of this works."

Logged

Mdot21

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 14379
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #150 on: February 28, 2022, 06:05:06 PM »
Quote from: utee94 on February 28, 2022, 05:58:32 PM
On social media and in real discussions with actual humans, I've seen quite a few people ask for a "No Fly Zone" and it's obvious they don't understand what that means.  Their hearts are in the right place, they really don't want to see continued bombings of Ukrainian cities, they don't want to see the death and destruction that comes along with that.  With respect to the folks I've interacted with, they're not intentionally advocating for war, they just don't know any better.

They seem to think we can just declare one and then nobody can fly there. They don't realize it would require enforcement, which would result in air combat, which means a direct shooting war between the Russia and whatever forces are attempting to enforce the No Fly Zone.

I suspect they've just heard the term from war movies or spy movies and think it sounds official.
I think you're right. A lot of people just don't know what they're talking about. And not only would it involve air combat- we'd probably strike their radar and surface to air missile defenses first - which would be an act of war- and then patrol the skies with fighter jets and potentially shoot down Russian aircraft- another act of war. No Fly Zones = an act of war- and you're right - I don't think many people understand that.

But some know better and are still calling for it. Adam Kizinger as a US politician and former US military veteran certainly knows what a No Fly Zone would entail and he's just been droning on for days about implementing one on twitter. 
Logged

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 71604
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #151 on: February 28, 2022, 06:11:32 PM »
Kinzinger doesn't like Trump, and some claim Trump is too sympathetic to Putin's cause, so perhaps Kinzinger is just doing the anti-Trump thing to show he's not Trump, Orange Man Bad, etc.  At any rate, I don't view it as very important.

It's a minority position and them some, and no one is really serious about doing such a thing.  One person here has suggested we bomb Moscow, probably not seriously, I've heard others say we should keep out of it entirely.
Logged

utee94

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 17710
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #152 on: February 28, 2022, 06:11:41 PM »
Quote from: Mdot21 on February 28, 2022, 06:05:06 PM
I think you're right. A lot of people just don't know what they're talking about. And not only would it involve air combat- we'd probably strike their radar and surface to air missile defenses first - which would be an act of war- and then patrol the skies with fighter jets and potentially shoot down Russian aircraft- another act of war. No Fly Zones = an act of war- and you're right - I don't think many people understand that.

But some know better and are still calling for it. Adam Kizinger as a US politician and former US military veteran certainly knows what a No Fly Zone would entail and he's just been droning on for days about implementing one on twitter.
Yeah, you're right for sure-- we'd have to knock out all Russian AA capability, and perform air combat, and likely do all sorts of other war-declaring things that I don't have enough military knowledge to comprehend, in order to establish a no-fly zone.  It would be an immediate escalation to war whether we officially declared it or not.

I don't know who Adam Kizinger is and I haven't seen or heard of any of his remarks.  Sounds like he's probably just a war hawk in general, and there are plenty more where he came from.  Doesn't mean I ever think about them or pay attention to their ramblings.

Fortunately, it seems that the people who matter are making adult decisions.  I'm all in favor of that.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2022, 06:17:24 PM by utee94 »
Logged

Mdot21

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 14379
  • Liked:
Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #153 on: February 28, 2022, 06:41:37 PM »
Image
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 9 10 [11] 12 13 ... 153   Go Up
« previous next »
 
Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.
Smokeys Record Year Hoodie

Smokey Record Hoodie