Author
Topic: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy
(Read 531236 times)

longhorn320 · « **Reply #7378 on:** April 18, 2023, 02:22:17 PM »

Quote from: 847badgerfan on April 18, 2023, 02:08:34 PM

^^^ What happens when an engineer and an accountant argue about CO2.

I think being an accountant is to my benefit

Cincydawg · « **Reply #7379 on:** April 18, 2023, 02:25:26 PM »

Yes, I am generally familiar with the composition of our atmosphere. I know for example nearly 1% is argon, and nearly 80% is nitrogen. I also understand how a tiny tiny portion of a thing can be deleterious. Take fluoromethyl sulfate, something so toxic Aldric Chemical stopped making it.

It's bad stuff. Then there is palytoxin, one of the most toxic nonpeptides known. I can appreciate that a tiny amount of a thing can have very serious effects.

But no doubt some think that because a thing is only present in ppm concentrations it can't possibly have any real impact. Fine with me.

longhorn320 · « **Reply #7380 on:** April 18, 2023, 02:32:46 PM »

Quote from: Cincydawg on April 18, 2023, 02:25:26 PM

Yes, I am generally familiar with the composition of our atmosphere. I know for example nearly 1% is argon, and nearly 80% is nitrogen. I also understand how a tiny tiny portion of a thing can be deleterious. Take fluoromethyl sulfate, something so toxic Aldric Chemical stopped making it.

It's bad stuff. Then there is palytoxin, one of the most toxic nonpeptides known. I can appreciate that a tiny amount of a thing can have very serious effects.

But no doubt some think that because a thing is only present in ppm concentrations it can't possibly have any real impact. Fine with me.

Im very skeptical about this as you can tell
I fear this is just a political tool being used as an excuse to glean power

Cincydawg · « **Reply #7381 on:** April 18, 2023, 02:37:10 PM »

It clearly is a political tool, in my view, as well. There is much about this that makes little or no sense, to me, including this myth that "we" are doing very much about it.

This is why no one has a practicable plan to "solve" the issue, presuming it exists. I'm personally less bothered by the basis of climate change than I am by the actions "we" are taking while pretending to solve anything. IF climate change is real and truly serious, why aren't "we" moving aggressively with real plans to manage it?

"We" are just throwing money at it, and saying "wind and solar", with no clue about it.

longhorn320 · « **Reply #7382 on:** April 18, 2023, 02:38:47 PM »

Quote from: Cincydawg on April 18, 2023, 02:37:10 PM

It clearly is a political tool, in my view, as well. There is much about this that makes little or no sense, to me, including this myth that "we" are doing very much about it.

This is why no one has a practicable plan to "solve" the issue, presuming it exists. I'm personally less bothered by the basis of climate change than I am by the actions "we" are taking while pretending to solve anything. IF climate change is real and truly serious, why aren't "we" moving aggressively with real plans to manage it?

"We" are just throwing money at it, and saying "wind and solar", with no clue about it.

amen

Cincydawg · « **Reply #7383 on:** April 18, 2023, 02:39:43 PM »

Germany shuts down last nuclear power plants, some scientists aghast (cnbc.com)

“While a legitimate decision, it is not a wise decision,” Storch told CNBC. “This out phasing of nuclear, with existing plants, leads to an increase of greenhouse gas emissions in Germany, even though according to another political decision, the fast decarbonization should have priority,” Storch said.

“For me, as a climate scientist, the whole thing is incomprehensible,” Storch told CNBC.

betarhoalphadelta · « **Reply #7384 on:** April 18, 2023, 02:59:54 PM »

Quote from: longhorn320 on April 18, 2023, 02:19:35 PM

Do you have any idea how much methane in our atmosphere is man made or caused?

Its about 10 parts per million.

Seems pretty small to me.

Clearly you didn't read yesterday when I said that Methane was about 1.8 ppm in the atmosphere, which seems tiny compared to the 400+ ppm of CO2, but since methane has a warming effect about 80x stronger than CO2, it's believed to account for 25% or so of the total observed global warming.

Small things can have big effects.

Quote from: longhorn320 on April 18, 2023, 02:32:46 PM

Im very skeptical about this as you can tell
I fear this is just a political tool being used as an excuse to glean power

I understand being skeptical of politicians. However, the science FAR predates anything the politicians have done about it.

But, I don't know why I keep typing. You don't seem to be reading it.

longhorn320 · « **Reply #7385 on:** April 18, 2023, 03:04:52 PM »

Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on April 18, 2023, 02:59:54 PM

But, I don't know why I keep typing. You don't seem to be reading it.

I do read your posts I just dont share your view

also the only articles Ive seen say that methane is 25 times that of co2 not 80

betarhoalphadelta · « **Reply #7386 on:** April 18, 2023, 03:09:21 PM »

Quote from: longhorn320 on April 18, 2023, 03:04:52 PM

I do read your posts I just share your view

also the only articles Ive seen say that methane is 25 times that of co2 not 80

Here's one from Stanford: https://earth.stanford.edu/news/methane-and-climate-change

The claim is 80x over the first two decades after its release. Total lifetime effect might be lower (and could be 25x although I haven't seen that number) as methane does not remain in the atmosphere over periods as long as CO2. Thus if we curb emissions now, it will have a MUCH bigger effect by 2050 than if we were to curb CO2 emissions now.

But if we keep emitting it, it'll keep doing its thing.

Cincydawg · « **Reply #7387 on:** April 18, 2023, 03:14:58 PM »

Why do we compare methane to carbon dioxide over a 100-year timeframe? Are we underrating the importance of methane emissions? | MIT Climate Portal

The trouble is that the answer changes depending on how far in the future you look. Let’s say a factory releases a ton of methane and a ton of CO₂ into the atmosphere today. The methane immediately begins to trap a lot of heat—at least 100 times as much as the CO₂. But the methane starts to break down and leave the atmosphere relatively quickly. As more time goes by, and as more of that original ton of methane disappears, the steady warming effect of the CO₂ slowly closes the gap. Over 20 years, the methane would trap about 80 times as much heat as the CO₂. Over 100 years, that original ton of methane would trap about 25 times as much heat as the ton of CO₂.

longhorn320 · « **Reply #7388 on:** April 18, 2023, 03:15:28 PM »

Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on April 18, 2023, 03:09:21 PM

Here's one from Stanford: https://earth.stanford.edu/news/methane-and-climate-change

The claim is 80x over the first two decades after its release. Total lifetime effect might be lower (and could be 25x although I haven't seen that number) as methane does not remain in the atmosphere over periods as long as CO2. Thus if we curb emissions now, it will have a MUCH bigger effect by 2050 than if we were to curb CO2 emissions now.

But if we keep emitting it, it'll keep doing its thing.

heres one saying 25

https://www.epa.gov/gmi/importance-methane#:~:text=Methane%20is%20more%20than%2025,due%20to%20human%2Drelated%20activities.

Cincydawg · « **Reply #7389 on:** April 18, 2023, 03:17:07 PM »

Both answers are correct.

Cincydawg · « **Reply #7390 on:** April 18, 2023, 03:18:43 PM »

How Potent Is Methane? - FactCheck.org

Sen. Bernie Sanders said methane is 86 times more potent than carbon dioxide, while others, including New Jersey Rep. Frank Pallone, said it was 25 times as potent. So, which is it — 86 or 25 times?

Perhaps surprisingly, both numbers are accurate. The amounts greatly vary, though, because they correspond to different time frames — a detail that often goes unmentioned when these statistics are given.

MrNubbz · « **Reply #7391 on:** April 18, 2023, 03:32:29 PM »

Quote from: longhorn320 on April 18, 2023, 02:19:35 PM

Do you have any idea how much methane in our atmosphere is man made or caused?

Its about 10 parts per million.

Seems pretty small to me.

Testify 320,Damn straight use that math

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Topic: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

longhorn320

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

Cincydawg

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

longhorn320

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

Cincydawg

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

longhorn320

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

Cincydawg

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

betarhoalphadelta

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

longhorn320

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

betarhoalphadelta

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

Cincydawg

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

longhorn320

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

Cincydawg

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

Cincydawg

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

MrNubbz

Re: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy