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Topic: Top 25
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Cincydawg · « **Reply #322 on:** November 13, 2019, 10:56:21 AM »

I do lie how the Gophers have improved of late. That counts with me.

utee94 · « **Reply #323 on:** November 13, 2019, 11:00:32 AM »

Quote from: bayareabadger on November 13, 2019, 10:19:27 AM

What exactly is the root of this feeling? That they jumped 12-1 UW in 2017? That they are high in the rankings that don't count?

If the helmet is what matters, does Bama jump 12-1 LSU if it loses to UGA? Does OSU jump LSU in that case if the Buckeyes get popped by PSU?

My assumption in all of this is a sense that someone somewhere is doing something untoward and in favor of a team we don't like, and I'm just not sure how solid it is.

I think there's a lot of Alabama fatigue in the college football world right now, which is understandable. But the truth is that they've been very good for a decade now and are reeling off an unprecedented string of NCs in the modern era of football.

I'm in the "not gonna worry about it til it happens camp." But this year, Alabama's schedule certainly isn't lining up for them to claim some juggernaut-type status. If they win out but don't go to the SECCG, then I'd certainly be disappointed in seeing them selected to the CFP at 11-1 and as a non-champ, over any undefeated or 1-loss P5 champ. But like I said, I'm not gonna worry about it unless it happens. Lots of football still to be played.

MrNubbz · « **Reply #324 on:** November 13, 2019, 11:25:00 AM »

Quote from: utee94 on November 13, 2019, 11:00:32 AM

I think there's a lot of Alabama fatigue in the college football world right now, which is understandable. But the truth is that they've been very good for a decade now and are reeling off an unprecedented string of NCs in the modern era of football.

This season there is no reason/rationale for them to be given the benefit of the doubt IMO.They are not returning national champs they got thumped like tOSU 3 yrs back.Therefore you must show your work.2 weeks to prepare and at Home and losing is not meeting that criteria.In the last 6 post seasons Bama has lost 4 times to Ohio State & Oklahoma once apiece and Clemson twice.If that was the Sooners we'd here Choklahoma or the the Buckeyes we'd here Slowhio from the Southern realms.The Chuckie doll that is Gary Danielson and his demented take needs to be boxed and put back in the attic.Don't lose or don't bitch 1 loss bama has not demonstrated over those 6 years they are the proper pick every year.Last Saturday just made that point

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #325 on:** November 13, 2019, 11:28:07 AM »

Quote from: bayareabadger on November 13, 2019, 10:19:27 AM

What exactly is the root of this feeling? That they jumped 12-1 UW in 2017? That they are high in the rankings that don't count?

If the helmet is what matters, does Bama jump 12-1 LSU if it loses to UGA? Does OSU jump LSU in that case if the Buckeyes get popped by PSU?

My assumption in all of this is a sense that someone somewhere is doing something untoward and in favor of a team we don't like, and I'm just not sure how solid it is.

This is where I am. If there appears to be evidence of helmet bias or some other kind of bias then we'll argue about it then.

For now, there are plenty of reasons to justify ranking Minnesota lower than the seven teams ahead of them in a mid-season ranking. If they get to 13-0 they will have wins that definitely justify their inclusion in the CFP but if they don't then this is a non-issue.

NorthernOhioBuckeye · « **Reply #326 on:** November 13, 2019, 11:39:45 AM »

Quote from: bayareabadger on November 13, 2019, 10:19:27 AM

What exactly is the root of this feeling? That they jumped 12-1 UW in 2017? That they are high in the rankings that don't count?

If the helmet is what matters, does Bama jump 12-1 LSU if it loses to UGA? Does OSU jump LSU in that case if the Buckeyes get popped by PSU?

My assumption in all of this is a sense that someone somewhere is doing something untoward and in favor of a team we don't like, and I'm just not sure how solid it is.

Experience! We've all seen it happen. And it is not only Bama, Ohio State was the benefit of Helmet status once also.

MikeDeTiger posted this upthread.

Code: [Select]

# of losses not being the ONLY criteria, as discussed here, I think Penn St. had an argument in 2016.  I'm not saying I fully supported them, but I'm saying they had a case.  And I'm also saying the CFPC basically "helmeted" them.  They talked a lot about how they valued conference championships, and I get PSU had more losses, but they spent a LOT of time talking about Ohio State's "best loss."  When they got done bloviating, it all just sounded like "Ohio State has a shinier helmet than PSU."

I agree with his sentiment. I also feel that even Ohio State does not get the same benefit of the doubt that Alabama does. It has been that way since the BCS days and continues today.

Just my opinion.

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #327 on:** November 13, 2019, 11:44:58 AM »

Quote from: utee94 on November 13, 2019, 11:00:32 AM

I think there's a lot of Alabama fatigue in the college football world right now, which is understandable. But the truth is that they've been very good for a decade now and are reeling off an unprecedented string of NCs in the modern era of football.

I'm in the "not gonna worry about it til it happens camp." But this year, Alabama's schedule certainly isn't lining up for them to claim some juggernaut-type status. If they win out but don't go to the SECCG, then I'd certainly be disappointed in seeing them selected to the CFP at 11-1 and as a non-champ, over any undefeated or 1-loss P5 champ. But like I said, I'm not gonna worry about it unless it happens. Lots of football still to be played.

Possible undefeated and 1-loss P5 Conference Champions:

13-0 LSU
13-0 Ohio State
13-0 Clemson
13-0 Minnesota
13-0 Baylor
12-1 LSU
12-1 Ohio State
12-1 Georgia
12-1 Penn State
12-1 Clemson
12-1 Minnesota
12-1 Baylor
12-1 Bama (if LSU collapses)
12-1 Oregon
12-1 Utah
12-1 Oklahoma

I think that there is basically no chance of Bama being put in the CFP while excluding any of #1 through #9. That leaves #10 through #16:

#10, 12-1 Clemson: The problem for the Tigers is that their loss would be bad. It couldn't be in the ACCCG so it would have to be either unranked Wake or unranked USCe.
#11, 12-1 Minnesota: I think that a 12-1 Minnesota would get in ahead of an 11-1 Bama but it might hinge on who Minnesota beat and by how much and who they lost to and by how much.
#12, 12-1 Baylor: Like Minnesota, the Bears have a ridiculously weak OOC and multiple close wins over mediocre-to-bad teams. Baylor would be easier to ignore though because they could finish 12-1 with only one win over a ranked team.
#13, 12-1 Bama: n/a
#14, 12-1 Oregon: Oregon could theoretically finish 12-1 with only one (or even zero) win over a ranked team and a loss to an Auburn team that Bama beat. This would be particularly problematic for the Ducks if the Tide demolish Auburn.
#15, 12-1 Utah: Same as Oregon only without the common opponent.
#16, 12-1 Oklahoma: Oklahoma's OOC is questionable at best. Houston is 1-4 in the AAC, SDST is FCS, and UCLA is sub .500. Baylor(13), Texas(19), OkSU(22), and KSU(24) are all ranked but three of them could fall out of the rankings by year end. If Oklahoma finished 12-1 with a loss to an unranked team and only one win over a ranked team that would be tenuous.

utee94 · « **Reply #328 on:** November 13, 2019, 12:14:32 PM »

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

All of the above to reiterate-- not gonna worry about it unless/until it happens.

MrNubbz · « **Reply #329 on:** November 13, 2019, 12:54:46 PM »

You're no fun we're not asking you to worry about it.You need to poke the bear,stir the pot,hell even rowe the boat if you want

Cincydawg · « **Reply #330 on:** November 13, 2019, 01:06:14 PM »

I stayed up all night worrying.

I hope Minnesota is 13-0. I hope UGA is 12-1. That Sotuh Carolina game was ugly, but four more wins would erase it.

utee94 · « **Reply #331 on:** November 13, 2019, 01:11:41 PM »

OK then.

Everyone above #19 Texas loses out, Horns win out, and Texas wins the B12 and goes to the CFP at 10-3.

Boom.

Benthere2 · « **Reply #332 on:** November 13, 2019, 01:45:39 PM »

Quote from: Cincydawg on November 13, 2019, 10:16:40 AM

Those three are mediocre teams at best. A top team should be penalized if any of them stayed close even once.

yeah the fact is that there are teams that dont get penalized for winning by a TD or 10 points to a lesser team. And dare I say that some teams CAN lose a game and dont get penalized

I do think things will work themselves out and yes I think Minnesota is slighted because of the lack of success over the past 30-50 years but that is why they play the games.

MrNubbz · « **Reply #333 on:** November 13, 2019, 01:48:01 PM »

Quote from: utee94 on November 13, 2019, 01:11:41 PM

OK then.

Everyone above #19 Texas loses out, Horns win out, and Texas wins the B12 and goes to the CFP at 10-3.

Boom.

Go back to not worrying

RestingB!tchFace · « **Reply #334 on:** November 13, 2019, 02:08:45 PM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on November 13, 2019, 10:21:50 AM

The problem with this whole paragraph is that it would be true, if we were talking about whether Minnesota should be #15 or #20 but it simply is NOT true when we are talking about whether Minnesota should be #10 or #5.

As you climb up the ladder you get compared to better and better teams. Earlier this season when I was comparing Minnesota to Nebraska, Maryland, and Northwestern their TD win over Purdue would have been great. Nebraska (lost by 4), Maryland (lost by 26), and Northwestern (lost by 2) all did worse. If you are comparing Minnesota to Iowa then their TD win over Purdue is ok, but not great. Iowa beat Purdue by 6 but Iowa's game was at home while Minnesota's was on the road so Minnesota's is better but not substantially better. If you want Minnesota to be compared to Penn State, their TD win over Purdue isn't good. Penn State beat them by 28.

The same is true of Minnesota's 42 point win over Maryland:
Looks great compared to RU (lost by 41)
Looks good compared to PU (won by 26) and Michigan (won by 31)
Looks bad compared to tOSU and PSU (won by 59 each)

You can say that an opponent is one of the best D1-AA teams when you are talking about being ranked 15th or 20th but that frankly sounds silly when you are talking about a top-10 team. Top-10 teams don't struggle with FCS teams at all. Nobody cares if the FCS team was a "good" FCS team, they are still an FCS team and a top-10 team should mop the floor with them.

Fresno may have battled Boise for the MWC in the past but this year they aren't anywhere close. They are 2-3 in the MWC and also sub .500 overall.

Georgia Southern did upset Appalachian State but they also lost to Louisiana, Troy, and Louisiana State. This is another team that a legitimate top-10 team should mop the floor with. Oh, a legitimate top-10 team named Louisiana State DID mop the floor with them in a 55-3 romp. That is what a top-10 team does to Georgia Southern, not escape with a 35-32 win on a TD in the final seconds of the game after trailing 7-0, 10-7, and 32-28.

You were better off just admitting that Minnesota's early games were not impressive and arguing that Minnesota had improved because trying to justify Minnesota's close wins over crap opposition is not getting you anywhere.

Have I EVER said that their first three games were impressive? No. And comparing wins by point spreads....especially when it gets to multiple touchdowns is a silly activity. I mean....Fleck doesn't on-sides kick against a far inferior opponents that they are already beating by two touchdowns in the first quarter. And when Minnesota puts in their second string....it's not a bunch of four and five star backups.

Comparing win spreads against the bottom of the league is a fools errand. Box score analysts like you make laugh. For a second....you almost tricked me into thinking that you actually WATCHED all those games!

utee94 · « **Reply #335 on:** November 13, 2019, 02:25:16 PM »

Quote from: MrNubbz on November 13, 2019, 01:48:01 PM

Go back to not worrying

Now you see my point???

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Topic: Top 25

Cincydawg

Re: Top 25

utee94

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MrNubbz

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medinabuckeye1

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NorthernOhioBuckeye

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medinabuckeye1

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utee94

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MrNubbz

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Cincydawg

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utee94

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Benthere2

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MrNubbz

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RestingB!tchFace

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utee94

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