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Topic: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)

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ELA

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #336 on: November 25, 2024, 09:25:18 AM »
It's not just Bama, several 3 loss teams have an outside shot depending.
I just meant if we are simply going by Vegas odds, why play the games

Cincydawg

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #337 on: November 25, 2024, 09:49:46 AM »
Yeah, I highly question Ole Miss as being favored over everyone but OSU.  

Cincydawg

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #338 on: November 25, 2024, 09:50:16 AM »
I just meant if we are simply going by Vegas odds, why play the games
The games often defy the odds, but the odds are one way to rank teams before any games.

ELA

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #339 on: November 25, 2024, 09:54:24 AM »
The games often defy the odds, but the odds are one way to rank teams before any games.
Yes.  But when people say, X doesn't belong because how many teams would X actually be favored to beat?

bayareabadger

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #340 on: November 25, 2024, 09:55:41 AM »
Yeah, I highly question Ole Miss as being favored over everyone but OSU. 
I mean, this is why it’s good we have a playoff that lets in teams like 11-1 Indiana if they get there.

Cincydawg

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #341 on: November 25, 2024, 09:59:21 AM »
I'm not suggesting who belongs, only that ONE WAY to rank teams is to use hypothetical matchup odds.  Would it be perfect?  Of course not.  Might it be better than what we do now?  I think probably so.


bayareabadger

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #342 on: November 25, 2024, 10:07:31 AM »
I'm not suggesting who belongs, only that ONE WAY to rank teams is to use hypothetical matchup odds.  Would it be perfect?  Of course not.  Might it be better than what we do now?  I think probably so.


So, this feels like a good idea, and in practice, people wouldn’t like it/it probably wouldn’t be. 

If you follow power rankings (a proxy for odds) there are always some teams whose rating outpaces their record. That makes sense. Odds are supposed to be predictive. 

Bur if you rely on those, you’re saying “you don’t earn your way into the playoff, you make it based on what you might be able to do.” And that doesn’t tend to be a good measure. 

Cincydawg

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #343 on: November 25, 2024, 10:11:57 AM »
People dislike rankings generally.  This is just another variant.

I'd find it interesting.

bayareabadger

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #344 on: November 25, 2024, 10:32:56 AM »
People dislike rankings generally.  This is just another variant.

I'd find it interesting.
But they do like playing out imaginary seasons, as long as they're the ones imagining. 

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #345 on: November 25, 2024, 10:38:23 AM »
I suspect it's closest to a prediction of how folks out there will bet.  I would guess ND gets more attention than "NIU", so they probably stick a few more points in anticipation of ND getting bets to win by fans.  I had a notion one could bet against Big Name teams and maybe break even after the vig.
I suspect if this were true, people with real money to throw down on wagering would be exploiting it to the point where Vegas would have to stop doing it. 

You don't think there are Wall Street quant types who could access 5+ years of Vegas line/result history and look for arbitrage opportunities like this? 

Hell, you don't think that the big sportsbooks EMPLOY Wall Street quant types who are analyzing their own line/result history looking to make sure that there aren't any "blind spots" in their own setting of the lines that are easily exploitable with a system like "bet against Big Name teams and you can't go wrong!"?

MaximumSam

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #346 on: November 25, 2024, 10:45:41 AM »
Yeah, I highly question Ole Miss as being favored over everyone but OSU. 
They wouldn't be. The gap between OSU and Ole Miss is roughly the same as that between Ole Miss and PSU at 10.

Cincydawg

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #347 on: November 25, 2024, 10:47:27 AM »
The point is that the betting line would be influenced by bettors who favored their team, say ND, in numbers sufficient to render the line unbalanced vs "reality".  I'm sure the Vegas boys understand this and set initial lines accordingly, if it's real.  Let's take ND-USC, MAYBE they know ND gets a preference with bettors, so the line would have been say -5, but they set it at -6 by understand that ND bettors over play their team.  Then when the excess bets come in on ND to win, they don't have to readjust much.

My point is not how Vegas judges real lines, but how bettors on certain teams MAY over populate betting on their team.

I do still think one can do OK betting the underdog in bowl games.

FearlessF

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #348 on: November 25, 2024, 11:06:13 AM »
I just meant if we are simply going by Vegas odds, why play the games
well, Vegas obviously wants the games played
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

FearlessF

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Re: The Death Star Comes to Columbus (SOC Week 13)
« Reply #349 on: November 25, 2024, 11:08:39 AM »
pointing out that the Texas schedule is not as strong as others does not mean Texas is a weak team

same goes for Indiana
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

 

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