header pic

Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

The 'Old' CFN/Scout Crowd- Enjoy Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching 'takes' and discussing topics surrounding the game. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE site and to take part in our community- a community with you- the user, the fan, -and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean place to interact.


Author

Topic: Texas and OU to where?!?!

 (Read 24592 times)

OrangeAfroMan

  • Stats Porn
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 18940
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #252 on: July 26, 2021, 07:36:11 PM »
Exactly the kind of thing I was thinking of.  Guys like you might live in a fast-growing sunbelt state but your team is from where you came from.  I would guess that tOSU/M is a bigger deal in a substantial portion of Florida than UF/FSU for the same reason. 
Uhhh, no.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

  • Stats Porn
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 18940
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #253 on: July 26, 2021, 07:38:03 PM »
Someone told me Atlanta has the largest OSU fan club outside of Columbus.  I know there are several OSU bars in town, to the point they feature OSU when they are playing on their TVs and you'd better not ask them to change the channel.


Those bars are in every big city.  There's a Nebraska, Oregon, and Florida bar in Phoenix.  I'm sure there's a dozen others.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Brutus Buckeye

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 11253
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #254 on: July 26, 2021, 07:57:20 PM »
The Conference that had the most insane realignment history was definitely the WAC. So just for fun here is a (slightly abridged/consolidated) history of that Conference.

It was born in a similar manner as the Big Twelve. The Border Conference got its best member poached in Texas Tech (SWC), while the Skyline Conference had it's best member poached in Colorado (Big 6). Instead of a merger between the remaining Border and Skyline Conference members, the haves ditched the have nots, and the original WAC was constructed as follows.

1962-78

Border

  • Arizona
  • Arizona State
  • New Mexico
  • Utep

Skyline

  • BYU
  • Utah
  • Colorado State
  • Wyoming


Utah St and New Mexico St were the biggest names in each Conference to get "ditched" as a result of this merger.

1979-95

In 1978 the Wac got raided by the Pac 12, who poached the Arizona twins. As a result they poached the top team from the Big West, San Diego St, along with the top two western D1 Independents, Air Force and Hawaii. In 1992 they raided the Big West again, adding Fresno as team #10.


  • New Mexico
  • UTEP
  • BYU
  • Utah
  • Wyoming
  • Colorado St
  • Air Force
  • Hawaii
  • San Diego State
  • Fresno State (1992)


This was the Wac's "glory line up" when they won a NC and a produced a Heisman winner. So basically just a bunch of teams riding BYU's coattails, more or less.

1996-99

The Wac cleaned out the SWC's closet, adding SMUw, TCU and Rice. Additionally they raided the Big West for the third time, poaching their top two teams/markets in San Jose State and UNLV. On top of all that they also added D1 Independent Tulsa in order to create a 16 team mega conference with four "pods."

Quadrant 1

  • Hawaii
  • Fresno
  • San Diego
  • San Jose


Quadrant 2

  • UNLV
  • Air Force
  • Colorado St
  • Wyoming


Quadrant 3

  • BYU
  • Utah
  • New Mexico
  • UTEP


Quadrant 4

  • Tulsa
  • TCU
  • SMU
  • Rice

This bloated alignment was about three decades ahead of its time. So half the members split off in order to form the Mountain West: BYU, Utah, Wyoming, Colorado St, Air Force, San Diego St and UNLV. TCU would depart for a brief stint in CUSA, before joining the Mountain West as well.

2000-04

With most of the Wac's glory line up off to the Mountain West, what you were left with was a bunch of scrubs with a major East/West geographic divide. So of course they raid the Big West once again for their top two teams, Nevada and Boise St, to beef up the west, and then they added D1 Independent Louisiana Tech to the East block. There were no divisions, due to the unevenness of the geographic divide.

  • Hawaii
  • Fresno
  • San Jose
  • UNLV
  • Nevada
  • Boise

  • UTEP
  • SMU
  • Rice
  • Tulsa
  • Louisiana Tech

It was in this era that Boise really took off.

2005-11

CUSA raided the WAC for UTEP, SMU, Rice and Tulsa. So that eliminated the entire eastern block except for Louisiana Tech, who would become an extreme outlier, geographically. So they raided the Sunbelt (which the Big West had morphed into, after having to replace most of their western teams with southeastern teams) for Utah State, Idaho and New Mexico State.

  • Boise
  • Idaho
  • Fresno
  • San Jose
  • Nevada
  • Utah State
  • New Mexico State
  • Hawaii
  • Louisiana Tech

The Boise domination continued through this stretch.

2012

The Wac got raided by the Mountain West for Boise, Fresno, San Jose, Nevada, Hawaii and Utah State. They also got raided by CUSA who took Louisiana Tech. The Mountain West raid was actually two raids, the first of which the WAC tried to rectify with the addition of upstart San Antonio and FCS Texas St, allowing them to limp through one final season of FBS Football with the following lineup.

  • New Mexico St
  • Idaho
  • Utah St
  • San Jose
  • Louisiana Tech
  • Texas St
  • San Antonio

After this season Utah St and San Jose were off to the Mountain West, Texas St, UTSA and Louisiana Tech were off to CUSA, Idaho moved down to the Big Sky (FCS) after crawling back to the Belt for a brief stint.

2013-21

The WAC carried on without Football, essentially existing only as a place for New Mexico St to park their Olympic Sports while their football team carried on as an FBS Independent (after crawling back to the Belt for a brief stint).

There has been somewhat of a revolving door of D1 dregs and D2 call ups. I won't break it all down, but it primarily included

  • New Mexico State
  • Seattle
  • Utah Valley
  • Rio Grande (TX)
  • Kansas City
  • Chicago State
  • Cal Baptist
  • Bakersfield (CA)
  • Grand Canyon (AZ)

Going Forward

WAC Football makes it's triumphant return at the FCS level, with a bunch of teams from Texas and Utah, poaching members from the Southland, Big Sky, and D2.

Football (all sports)
  • Dixie State (UT)
  • Southern Utah
  • Sam Houston (TX)
  • Lamar (TX)
  • Stephen F Austin (TX)
  • Tarleton (TX)
  • Abilene Christian (TX)

non-Football
  • New Mexico St (FBS Independent for FB)
  • Grand Canyon (AZ)
  • Rio Grande (TX)
  • Cal Bap
  • Seattle

Now if they can somehow manage to convince NMSU to throw in the towel and move their FB team down to FCS, then they could probably poach N Arizona and Weber from the Big Sky, and possibly even Cal Poly and UC Davis, who are "Football only" members of the Big Sky.








1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

OrangeAfroMan

  • Stats Porn
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 18940
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #255 on: July 26, 2021, 09:49:37 PM »

1996-99

The Wac cleaned out the SWC's closet, adding SMUw, TCU and Rice. Additionally they raided the Big West for the third time, poaching their top two teams/markets in San Jose State and UNLV. On top of all that they also added D1 Independent Tulsa in order to create a 16 team mega conference with four "pods."

Quadrant 1

  • Hawaii
  • Fresno
  • San Diego
  • San Jose


Quadrant 2

  • UNLV
  • Air Force
  • Colorado St
  • Wyoming


Quadrant 3

  • BYU
  • Utah
  • New Mexico
  • UTEP


Quadrant 4

  • Tulsa
  • TCU
  • SMU
  • Rice

This bloated alignment was about three decades ahead of its time. So half the members split off in order to form the Mountain West: BYU, Utah, Wyoming, Colorado St, Air Force, San Diego St and UNLV. TCU would depart for a brief stint in CUSA, before joining the Mountain West as well.
I wonder how many years of being a superconference before the SEC does this.  The haves split off from the have-nots.  
Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, LSU, Oklahoma, Texas, and A&M/Tennessee split off......it'd be interesting.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

bayareabadger

  • Legend
  • ****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 7877
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #256 on: July 26, 2021, 10:07:33 PM »
The main thing I'm going to be fascinated to see is how each team's fortunes shift and how the fanbases react. 

I mean, in Oklahoma's case, it's very likely the Sooners will lose more, even if it's marginally more. Texas, who knows, but the disappointing 8-5 might be 1-3 wins worse, which in turn feels very bad. That's the issue with feeling like you're too big for your conference. You step up in competition, the mathematical outcome is more losses. And as much as people hem and haw about all the other stuff, the losses do stick. 

I say this as someone whose alma mater is in an easier division, but who lives near a school with a top-10 schedule difficulty of late. And the teams they field that could go 8-4 or 9-3 some years are fighting to go 7-5 or 6-6 (or when things have gone very bad, they can pull an upset and still miss a bowl by a few games). They're a historical have not, and even then, they don't say "A tough 7-5 is worthwhile in its way" they still want it all. 

Makes me pretty damn content with my program's lot. 

Kris60

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 2514
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #257 on: July 26, 2021, 10:55:08 PM »
The main thing I'm going to be fascinated to see is how each team's fortunes shift and how the fanbases react.

I mean, in Oklahoma's case, it's very likely the Sooners will lose more, even if it's marginally more. Texas, who knows, but the disappointing 8-5 might be 1-3 wins worse, which in turn feels very bad. That's the issue with feeling like you're too big for your conference. You step up in competition, the mathematical outcome is more losses. And as much as people hem and haw about all the other stuff, the losses do stick.

I say this as someone whose alma mater is in an easier division, but who lives near a school with a top-10 schedule difficulty of late. And the teams they field that could go 8-4 or 9-3 some years are fighting to go 7-5 or 6-6 (or when things have gone very bad, they can pull an upset and still miss a bowl by a few games). They're a historical have not, and even then, they don't say "A tough 7-5 is worthwhile in its way" they still want it all.

Makes me pretty damn content with my program's lot.
Very true.  When WVU went to the Big 12 there was a ton of excitement about playing new teams.  And it was fun.  I’ve went to Morgantown to see Oklahoma twice and Texas once (and KSU once too), but the reality of less wins starts to set in after a few seasons and it knocks some of the luster off. Playing Oklahoma is fun until you find yourself down 21-3 at the end of the first quarter.

It’s going to be awesome for OU and UT to see these new teams come to their stadium but once the game starts they may find it isn’t as enjoyable.

Gigem

  • Starter
  • *****
  • Posts: 2153
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #258 on: July 26, 2021, 11:05:21 PM »
I wonder how many years of being a superconference before the SEC does this.  The haves split off from the have-nots. 
Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, LSU, Oklahoma, Texas, and A&M/Tennessee split off......it'd be interesting.
On that note do you think teams like Vanderbilt and such will be left behind?  I mean seriously what does Vandy really bring to the conference?  

bayareabadger

  • Legend
  • ****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 7877
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #259 on: July 26, 2021, 11:13:40 PM »
On that note do you think teams like Vanderbilt and such will be left behind?  I mean seriously what does Vandy really bring to the conference? 
Wins for everyone else.

The thing about that 8-team league, someone has to be last. Even worse, only one team can be first. 

The way A&M rode into the SEC has always been fascinating, BTW

Brutus Buckeye

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 11253
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #260 on: July 26, 2021, 11:25:07 PM »
On that note do you think teams like Vanderbilt and such will be left behind?  I mean seriously what does Vandy really bring to the conference? 
Yeah, they'd probably get Riced. 
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

Brutus Buckeye

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 11253
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #261 on: July 26, 2021, 11:33:55 PM »
I wonder how many years of being a superconference before the SEC does this.  The haves split off from the have-nots. 
Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, LSU, Oklahoma, Texas, and A&M/Tennessee split off......it'd be interesting.


When the Mountain West was formed, it caused the 65 team NCAA Hoops Tournament format because the other conferences didn't want to relinquish an "at large" bid. 

So your idea might lead to a 13 team playoff. 
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

medinabuckeye1

  • Legend
  • ****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 8941
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #262 on: July 26, 2021, 11:36:53 PM »
Uhhh, no.
Uhhh, yes. There are clearly more former Ohioans than there are former Floridians.

Florida didn't pass Ohio in population until the 1990 census. There were possibly more births in Ohio (currently 30s) and there were definitely more births in Ohio in the 1970's (currently 40s) and prior (currently 50+). Thus, in the age cohorts of roughly anything over 35 there are more people born in Ohio than born in Florida despite Florida now having almost 2x the population.

Certainly not all, but obviously some of those former Ohioans retain Ohio State Fandom. Same for the rest of the slower growth states.

Florida still has a lot of retirees and in those retirement communities there are bound to be lots more PSU/tOSU/M/UW/MN fans than UF/FSU fans so yes, tOSU/M and the Axe are going to be bigger deals than UF/FSU.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2021, 11:44:29 PM by medinabuckeye1 »

Brutus Buckeye

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 11253
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #263 on: July 26, 2021, 11:43:29 PM »
The Ohio State fandom remains intact, the pro sports fandom got shaken up quite a bit. 

The Browns taught me never to be "loyal" to a professional franchise. It's all just mindless entertainment and the teams move around all the time, so you might as well follow the teams that get the most coverage in your current market. 
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

OrangeAfroMan

  • Stats Porn
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 18940
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #264 on: July 27, 2021, 02:47:58 AM »
Uhhh, yes. There are clearly more former Ohioans than there are former Floridians.

Florida didn't pass Ohio in population until the 1990 census. There were possibly more births in Ohio (currently 30s) and there were definitely more births in Ohio in the 1970's (currently 40s) and prior (currently 50+). Thus, in the age cohorts of roughly anything over 35 there are more people born in Ohio than born in Florida despite Florida now having almost 2x the population.

Certainly not all, but obviously some of those former Ohioans retain Ohio State Fandom. Same for the rest of the slower growth states.

Florida still has a lot of retirees and in those retirement communities there are bound to be lots more PSU/tOSU/M/UW/MN fans than UF/FSU fans so yes, tOSU/M and the Axe are going to be bigger deals than UF/FSU.
A few bars have a B1G slant vs all of the rest of the everything.  
mkay
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 25481
  • Liked:
Re: Texas and OU to where?!?!
« Reply #265 on: July 27, 2021, 06:36:49 AM »
Uhhh, no. 
You need to come down to visit my area. Uhhh, yes.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

 

Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.