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Topic: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas

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847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #9996 on: October 29, 2020, 02:22:41 PM »
I doubt many have had it twice, but many more have had it than testing or illness has confirmed. Probably at least 10 times as many.
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #9997 on: October 29, 2020, 04:18:58 PM »
My 27-year-old daughter just phoned me to let me know that she has tested positive. 

She is healthy and has almost no symptoms besides a small sniffle and occasional cough.

She is a PICU nurse who is not working now but attending anesthesiology program which is now a doctorate program.  Her life consists of being in class and then being in clinicals and labs at the hospital. She has virtually not left the house otherwise.

She has no idea where she got it as she is not attending any events and is a very strict user of a mask, And is often in an N 95 mask as is required at her hospital.   

I was shocked to learn that the hospital that she is currently at on rotation for her degree is not testing people for Covid!  They are treating patients and people are doing elective surgeries and they have made a decision to not test patients.  I was simply blown away by this.

And this is in the state of Michigan. My daughter informed me that most hospitals that she is aware of are definitely testing but the one she’s working at right now is not.

That scares the shit out of me – – when the scientists are not following the obvious science.
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Riffraft

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #9998 on: October 29, 2020, 04:22:35 PM »
Mask seem to make no difference in the spread

https://thefederalist.com/2020/10/29/these-12-graphs-show-mask-mandates-do-nothing-to-stop-covid/?fbclid=IwAR01t2704_7xfrX08HmccDXzXZeeW0moL4hM0iUG0hafhfXu4KeAFsN-4rQ

From the CDC
Parameter values Table 1
[th]Parameter[/th]
[th]Scenario 1[/th]
[th]Scenario 2[/th]
[th]Scenario 3[/th]
[th]Scenario 4[/th]
[th]Scenario 5: Current Best Estimate[/th]


[th]R0*[/th]


2.04.02.5
[th]Infection Fatality Ratio[/th]


0-19 years: 0.00002
20-49 years: 0.00007
50-69 years: 0.0025
70+ years: 0.028
0-19 years: 0.0001
20-49 years: 0.0003
50-69 years: 0.010
70+ years: 0.093
0-19 years: 0.00003
20-49 years: 0.0002
50-69 years: 0.005
70+ years: 0.054
[th]Percent of infections that are asymptomatic§[/th]


10%70%10%70%40%
[th]Infectiousness of asymptomatic individuals relative to symptomatic[/th]


25%100%25%100%75%
[th]Percentage of transmission occurring prior to symptom onset**[/th]


30%70%30%70%50%


Look at the Fatality Ratio.  Almost no change of dying, if you are under 50.  Not much worse if you are under 70.

CDC article is here  https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/planning-scenarios.html

Chart didn't format well. It is in the article


Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #9999 on: October 29, 2020, 04:24:09 PM »
https://www.foxnews.com/health/genetic-mutation-for-coronavirus-may-have-contributed-to-europes-second-wave-report

Yes, that is Fox, didn't see it anywhere else, suggests a new mutation accounts for the surge in Europe.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10000 on: October 29, 2020, 04:44:57 PM »
Mask seem to make no difference in the spread

https://thefederalist.com/2020/10/29/these-12-graphs-show-mask-mandates-do-nothing-to-stop-covid/?fbclid=IwAR01t2704_7xfrX08HmccDXzXZeeW0moL4hM0iUG0hafhfXu4KeAFsN-4rQ

There are so many issues with that one that I don't have the time to take it down... 

I'll just start that with a cursory review of merely the abstracts of the four studies they purport to say that masks don't work, they all said masks work--some said that the purpose was reduce of spread [i.e. potentially infecting OTHERS] rather than individual protection, i.e. reducing R0. 

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10001 on: October 29, 2020, 04:49:13 PM »
https://www.foxnews.com/health/genetic-mutation-for-coronavirus-may-have-contributed-to-europes-second-wave-report

Yes, that is Fox, didn't see it anywhere else, suggests a new mutation accounts for the surge in Europe.
Interesting. I tried to click through to the FT piece that they were referencing, but that was subscription only...

If anyone can find a link to the actual study, I'd like to check it out. 

That previous article I posted from sciencedaily was from August, I believe, regarding the 6 known strains at that time. I would love to see newer info. 

FearlessF

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10002 on: October 29, 2020, 04:55:18 PM »
The White House Coronavirus Task Force in its latest report warned Iowa officials that small gatherings in people's homes are "significantly" increasing spread of coronavirus in the state as the weather cools and outdoor activities are more limited.

The report, dated Monday but released by the Iowa Department of Public Health to reporters on Wednesday night, warns that "current transmissions are linked to home gatherings," as the state faces a surge in new cases, deaths and record hospitalizations.

The experts say Iowa in the "red zone" for cases with 101 or more new cases per 100,000 population last week the 10th highest rate in the country. More than 121,000 Iowans have tested positive and 1,691 have died from COVID-19 since the pandemic began, as of data collected Thursday morning.

The document urges Iowa officials to limit large and small gatherings in an effort to stem the spread, which echoes from previous recommendations in recent weeks.


This comes as 605 Iowans are in the hospital with COVID-19, a new record-number that has continued to rise over the last month. Gov. Reynolds has insisted that the health care system has the resources to manage the surge, but Iowa doctors have cautioned that if this trend continues, it could overwhelm hospitals.

The White House experts in their report also notify Iowa leaders that hospitals could be at risk.

"All indicators of community spread are increasing, including percent of nursing homes with positive staff members and residents," the report says. "And community spread is increasing hospital admissions, leading to potential resource constraints."

The state is receiving nearly one million rapid tests from the federal government, and the experts this week said such tests perform best in school settings. Iowa's schools need to have at least 50% of their instruction in person, according to Gov. Kim Reynolds' proclamation.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10003 on: October 29, 2020, 05:40:17 PM »
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.25.20219063v1

A variant of SARS-CoV-2 emerged in early summer 2020, presumably in Spain, and has since spread to multiple European countries. The variant was first observed in Spain in June and has been at frequencies above 40% since July. Outside of Spain, the frequency of this variant has increased from very low values prior to 15th July to 40-70% in Switzerland, Ireland, and the United Kingdom in September. It is also prevalent in Norway, Latvia, the Netherlands, and France. Little can be said about other European countries because few recent sequences are available. Sequences in this cluster (20A.EU1) differ from ancestral sequences at 6 or more positions, including the mutation A222V in the spike protein and A220V in the nucleoprotein. We show that this variant was exported from Spain to other European countries multiple times and that much of the diversity of this cluster in Spain is observed across Europe. It is currently unclear whether this variant is spreading because of a transmission advantage of the virus or whether high incidence in Spain followed by dissemination through tourists is sufficient to explain the rapid rise in multiple countries.

GopherRock

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10004 on: October 29, 2020, 05:49:53 PM »
We have about 10 million known (reported) cases in the US (327 million population).  Let's triple that and round it, and we get that about 1% of the population has been infected over 6 months.  Where you live can differ of course.

But, your odds of encountering a contagious person are quite low, no matter your safety efforts.  And then do you spend enough time in close proximity with them?

We probably "pass" about 100 people a day, by that I include walking on the street or in the park, but we spent time in proximity with none of them, maybe brief seconds, so I figure my exposure risk is very small for ONE DAY.

I think individual risk is quite low with even reasonable precautions.  But, the public health risk multiplies that over millions of people.

I mentioned my kid in Texas contracted it in March, an infected person came to their HQ and shook hands and confabbed etc.  Nobody knew.
You're off by a full order of magnitude. 30 million of 327 million is about 10%, not 1%

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10005 on: October 29, 2020, 06:08:09 PM »
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.25.20219063v1

A variant of SARS-CoV-2 emerged in early summer 2020, presumably in Spain, and has since spread to multiple European countries. The variant was first observed in Spain in June and has been at frequencies above 40% since July. Outside of Spain, the frequency of this variant has increased from very low values prior to 15th July to 40-70% in Switzerland, Ireland, and the United Kingdom in September. It is also prevalent in Norway, Latvia, the Netherlands, and France. Little can be said about other European countries because few recent sequences are available. Sequences in this cluster (20A.EU1) differ from ancestral sequences at 6 or more positions, including the mutation A222V in the spike protein and A220V in the nucleoprotein. We show that this variant was exported from Spain to other European countries multiple times and that much of the diversity of this cluster in Spain is observed across Europe. It is currently unclear whether this variant is spreading because of a transmission advantage of the virus or whether high incidence in Spain followed by dissemination through tourists is sufficient to explain the rapid rise in multiple countries.
Thanks. Full PDF: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.25.20219063v1.full.pdf

From a reading, it suggests this strain absolutely might be outcompeting previous strains when it comes to transmission, i.e. more transmissible. As is typical, the scientists are not claiming that conclusively [as they shouldn't], but their discussion and numbers suggest it. 

What is yet unknown is whether this mutation affects mortality in any way. 

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10006 on: October 29, 2020, 06:12:52 PM »
You're off by a full order of magnitude. 30 million of 327 million is about 10%, not 1%
Absolutely correct.

I would point out that one of the key tenets though was a discussion of likelihood of being around someone who has the virus and is contagious. 

6 months is ~24 weeks. If you assume a 2 week period of contagion (which is overbroad, but that's the typical quarantine), that means that you can then cut those 24 weeks into roughly 12 2-week periods because people who had it in April aren't a problem to you now...

I.e. if we suggest 10% of the nation has had the virus, that doesn't mean you have a 10% chance of encountering someone with the virus. It means you have a 10% divided by 12 chance of encountering someone who has an active virus right now. Or still under 1%. 

So Cincy was wrong, but right :57:

Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10007 on: October 29, 2020, 07:06:09 PM »
Oops.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10008 on: October 29, 2020, 09:35:38 PM »
So much science and math promoted by non-scientists and non-mathematicians.  Fun.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #10009 on: October 30, 2020, 06:23:47 AM »
So much science and math promoted by non-scientists and non-mathematicians.  Fun.
It's a discussion board, and if you see an error or factual mistake, it helps to correct it specifically, rather than just quibbling about some generality, or the backgrounds of our posters, some of which are fairly esteemed.

 

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