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Topic: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas

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longhorn320

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3710 on: May 11, 2020, 03:21:38 PM »
Quote from: bwarbiany on May 11, 2020, 02:13:55 PM
Sorry, I realized I was REALLY unclear when I talked about that. I call our lockdown a "REAL" lockdown, or as close to one as Americans would tolerate. I wouldn't support a China-style lockdown, and that wasn't the impression I was trying to get across. But I can see how it would be interpreted that way, and I apologize for being unclear.

The bulk of my point was that Americans would never have dutifully taken a "voluntary" stay at home suggestion the way the Swedes have done. We would have completely disregarded it and gone about our lives until this thing exploded in our faces.

The reason we needed the stay at home orders instead of suggestions was to smack Americans upside the head and get them to pay attention.
Its my impression that the bulk of America did it voluntarily even if ordered

You cant shut down an economy the size of the US unless it was voluntary
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Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3711 on: May 11, 2020, 03:27:29 PM »
I doubt anyone has been arrested LEGALLY for being outside their home.  I don't see how that would be LEGAL.  

We've always been able to go to Kroger of course, and I think everyone else has as well.  Who has been pulled over for driving somewhere?  What law was violated?

Who has been arrested in general for walking outside?  A handful of cases that won't be prosecuted?


This is mostly voluntary.  Businesses that are licensed like restaurants and barbershops can be closed.

The construction projects near us are beehives of activity.
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3712 on: May 11, 2020, 03:57:32 PM »
Quote from: longhorn320 on May 11, 2020, 03:21:38 PM
Its my impression that the bulk of America did it voluntarily even if ordered

You cant shut down an economy the size of the US unless it was voluntary
That was always the plan. No cop wanted to be arresting or even citing people for stay at home violations. 

The goal was behavior modification, not enforcement. 

I'm just saying that "order" has more force to it. Even if you realized that enforcement was basically impossible because there were so many loopholes in the stay at home order, and that nobody was going to be pulling cars over demanding to know whether they were engaged in "essential" business. 

If the Bay Area counties that kicked this all off with their actual stay at home order had just made it a voluntary suggestion, SOME people would have followed it, but IMHO not nearly enough. 
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847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3713 on: May 11, 2020, 04:07:14 PM »
There were a lot of moving parts on this thing early on. We even had people like the NY Governor and Mayor saying to keep going on with life. It was downplayed by the White House too. It was downplayed in San Fran. Downplayed everywhere. We were told masks wouldn't help. 

I think knowing better back then about what this was would have "scared" people into social distancing - no order needed. It's certainly doing that now. Almost everyone is wearing masks and respecting space. It's no different here than in Illinois, from that standpoint. 

Except things are starting to open up here.

Wisconsin is starting to open up. The only problem with that is I have to drive through Illinois to get to Wisconsin.
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longhorn320

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3714 on: May 11, 2020, 04:09:18 PM »
Quote from: bwarbiany on May 11, 2020, 03:57:32 PM
That was always the plan. No cop wanted to be arresting or even citing people for stay at home violations.

The goal was behavior modification, not enforcement.

I'm just saying that "order" has more force to it. Even if you realized that enforcement was basically impossible because there were so many loopholes in the stay at home order, and that nobody was going to be pulling cars over demanding to know whether they were engaged in "essential" business.

If the Bay Area counties that kicked this all off with their actual stay at home order had just made it a voluntary suggestion, SOME people would have followed it, but IMHO not nearly enough.
when the government makes a bad order which California in large part is doing Americans will object to it

California is too slow in reopening

Its almost as if California doesnt want the shut down to end
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FearlessF

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3715 on: May 11, 2020, 04:10:58 PM »
Quote from: longhorn320 on May 11, 2020, 04:09:18 PM
when the government makes a bad order which California in large part is doing Americans will object to it

California is too slow in reopening

Its almost as if California doesnt want the shut down to end
politics, unfortunately
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847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3716 on: May 11, 2020, 04:20:11 PM »
Phase 5: Illinois restored


Testing, tracing and treatment are widely available throughout the state. Either a vaccine or treatment options are readily available that ensures health care capacity is no longer a concern, or there are no new cases over a sustained period.

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Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3717 on: May 11, 2020, 04:28:34 PM »
No new cases over a sustained period ....  um ....
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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3718 on: May 11, 2020, 04:43:45 PM »
That's Phase 5 which might as well read, "Probably Never"

But ok
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847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3719 on: May 11, 2020, 04:44:17 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on May 11, 2020, 04:28:34 PM
No new cases over a sustained period ....  um ....
I'm proposing to just fill Illinois up with a glacier. Same difference.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3720 on: May 11, 2020, 04:47:17 PM »
Does anyone believe this is "going away" totally?  Or is it more a "new reality" to which we will have to adjust?

One key is the immunity question.  That could be THE key.
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utee94

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3721 on: May 11, 2020, 04:50:49 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on May 11, 2020, 04:47:17 PM
Does anyone believe this is "going away" totally?  Or is it more a "new reality" to which we will have to adjust?

One key is the immunity question.  That could be THE key.
That's definitely THE key.

I'm also not sure what people mean when they talk about the "new normal."  What does that even mean?

I suspect the new normal will look pretty much identical to the old normal.  It'll take many months to get there, but I don't anticipate any permanent changes to behavior, not in this country anyway.
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847badgerfan

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3722 on: May 11, 2020, 04:51:19 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on May 11, 2020, 04:47:17 PM
Does anyone believe this is "going away" totally?  Or is it more a "new reality" to which we will have to adjust?

One key is the immunity question.  That could be THE key.
I do not. We will adjust - we have to - until there is a proven vaccine. That could be near, or never.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #3723 on: May 11, 2020, 05:02:58 PM »
I was chatting with the wife about hotels/motels/travel during our walk today.    I think this will be SLOW to come back, very slow.  This city relies heavily on conventions, with the money that brings to the hospitality industry here now mostly shuttered.  When might a large convention happen again?  Maybe it all goes virtual.  When will many folks feel comfortable flying somewhere for pleasure?  When does air traffic return to 75%?

We used to like to  take a 2-3 day trip up into the mountains, or stay a week at Hilton Head, all that is on hold obv.

This looks like a long term evolution to me, to some kind of changed existence.
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