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Topic: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters

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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #196 on: Today at 10:17:30 AM »
What additional specific penalities do you thing SHOULD be attached?
Minimum vacate every win for the 2 1/2 years it was going on. Perhaps even vacate the rest of that year and the NC as "fruit of the poisoned tree".

If you can't retroactively apply the 2 year show cause for Moore, suspend him for the next two years. No football activities allowed. 

Maybe post-House, bar them from using any of the revenue sharing on football for 3 years (equal to the length off time this was going on). 

Gigem

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #197 on: Today at 10:18:00 AM »
he founded, owns, and runs the most popular online sports media company in the US. he's got who knows how many tens of millions of followers on social media platforms from YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, and X/Twitter.

Fox Sports is dying on the vine and trying to compete with ESPN and trying to attract new viewership to keep up with the Jonses. It's not that hard to believe at all. I actually can't believe that you can't believe they would be putting be this asshole on TV.

They are desperate to bring in eyeballs.
I don't even know who or what you're talking about....so how can be the most popular platform?  I see their stuff all over my feeds, but I rarely click and when I do it's just low level bullshit.  No quality in their stuff.  

Gigem

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #198 on: Today at 10:26:54 AM »
Minimum vacate every win for the 2 1/2 years it was going on. Perhaps even vacate the rest of that year and the NC as "fruit of the poisoned tree".

If you can't retroactively apply the 2 year show cause for Moore, suspend him for the next two years. No football activities allowed.

Maybe post-House, bar them from using any of the revenue sharing on football for 3 years (equal to the length off time this was going on).
I honestly agree with the gist of this.  Fining them money does absolutely nothing, because a college program like Michigan literally has money to burn.  Well, not literally, but figuratively has money to burn.  Hell, A&M is still paying Jimbo over $50 million and he hasn't been our coach for two years.  I can promise you if the powers that be at most underperforming school thought they could pay $100,000,000 for a MNC they would do it in a heartbeat (*my school excluded, because as you all know, we're on the up and up).  We're talking about Texas Tech, Auburn, Ole Miss, Arkansas.  And once you break that seal, the cheating will only get more and more rampant until it's utter lawlessness because there is no way the rest of the country will let them on-up them.  

The reason is that all you did was show that you can egregiously cheat and nothing major will happen.  You have to inflict real pain, not just some kind of made-up embarrassment and a slap on the wrist fine.  

FearlessF

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #199 on: Today at 10:27:04 AM »
unfortunately those programs don't bring the type of eyeballs to television sets that Michigan does- which in turn makes the conference billions of dollars and those schools hundreds of millions of dollars every single year.

if you're talking about the 5 most watched programs in the sport- Michigan is way up there with Ohio State, Notre Dame, Texas and whoever is ontop in the SEC at the moment- Florida was the IT program for a minute- then it was Bama for a decade and a half- now it's been Georgia the last 5-ish years.

ever heard the saying....don't bite the hand that feeds you? yeah...B1G conference heads and those school President heads & AD's aren't going to upset the apple cart and try to bite the hand that feeds them. it's common sense really. keep. it. simple. stupid.
I agree, but a severe penalty won't stop the conference from reaping the $$$ benefits from Michigan TV revenue
and if it REALLY pisses off Michigan, so what?  What are they gonna do, crawl to the SEC for an invite?
F no
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Mdot21

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #200 on: Today at 10:27:08 AM »
I don't even know who or what you're talking about....so how can be the most popular platform?  I see their stuff all over my feeds, but I rarely click and when I do it's just low level bullshit.  No quality in their stuff. 
you do not = rest of the American public and particularly the most important demographic- 18 to 34, genius.

Cincydawg

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #201 on: Today at 10:29:30 AM »
Why is 18-34 the most important demographic?  To the extent money is the most important thing "in life", it's not.


Mdot21

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #202 on: Today at 10:31:55 AM »
Why is 18-34 the most important demographic?  To the extent money is the most important thing "in life", it's not.
it's the demographic advertisers pay absolute top dollar for. ask them why that is. not me. 

Gigem

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #203 on: Today at 10:32:23 AM »
you do not = rest of the American public and particularly the most important demographic- 18 to 34, genius.
I'd wager these sports fans on this board agree with me, genius.  

Mdot21

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #204 on: Today at 10:33:20 AM »
I'd wager these sports fans on this board agree with me, genius. 
CDN media

MrNubbz

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #205 on: Today at 10:36:55 AM »
I agree, but a severe penalty won't stop the conference from reaping the $$$ benefits from Michigan TV revenue
and if it REALLY pisses off Michigan, so what?  What are they gonna do, crawl to the SEC for an invite?
F no
TV revenue was NEVER the problem,just as many watched to see Harbaugh get his ass handed to him
"Uecker - grab a bat, get in there and put a stop to this rally! - Phillies Manager Gene Mauch

Cincydawg

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #206 on: Today at 10:40:24 AM »
it's the demographic advertisers pay absolute top dollar for. ask them why that is. not me.
They are more influenceable and spend more time on line is why, not that they have the most money to spend.  Folks like me are much less so even though we can bring the bucks when we want.

There is little point in directing some ad at me.


Why Advertisers Pay More to Reach Viewers Who Watch Less | Stanford Graduate School of Business


More active audiences command a lower advertising price per impression, while groups that don’t tune in as often cost a premium to advertise to because they’re simply harder to reach. So advertisers pay more to reach the young men who watch TV infrequently and the older viewers who stream fewer videos or shows.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #207 on: Today at 10:44:21 AM »
What additional specific penalities do you thing SHOULD be attached?
In all seriousness (not that this will actually be done but):
  • Non-recognition of games and titles won in years during which cheating provably occurred (21-23).  This matters a little to those of us who truly follow the sport without significantly impacting the Cheater's ability to continue to bring in revenue for the league so it is easy and the justice of it is manifestly obvious.  
  • Stallions' show-cause should be made a permanent ban from participation or attendance at any league event.  The guy is the personification of a Michigan "man", as @ELA said above, you can tell when he is lying by when his lips are moving.  He lied about everything to the NCAA, did everything he could to obstruct their investigation, and claimed that despite his apparently rain-man like memory of signals he couldn't recall whether or not he was on the CMU sideline.  Dirtbags like him have no place in our league whatsoever.  
  • Same as #2 but for Harbaugh.  I realize that fans will claim that Harbaugh was essentially Sargent Schultz.  Fans of a program in trouble ALWAYS make that claim but the rules don't care.  The standard for a HC isn't "knew" it is "knew or should have known" and Harbaugh was either complicit in the cheating scheme or so willfully blind that his intentionally turning a blind eye to some random dude being on the sideline with his coordinators constitutes malfeasance.  
  • Sherrone Moore banned from participating in league games for the duration of his NCAA show-cause.  Several neutral fans above pointed out that the AD's failure to burn it down and fire everyone involved sends the message that cheating is worth it and this would at least put that in question.  
  • At least a one-year postseason ban.  The NCAA stated that there was sufficient evidence for a two year ban.  It should be three to correspond to the (at least) three years that the institution operated a cheating system and a one or two year ban would still be a slap on the wrist relative to the magnitude of what the institution did but at least this would have some deterrent value.  Ie, if you get caught cheating you'll have to miss a postseason.  
  • Expand the fine to include the revenue from merchandise.  Whenever a school wins a league title or an NC they get a bounce in merch sales.  This is ESPECIALLY true when the school hasn't won one in a while.  Ie, Bama fans have had LOTS of opportunities to buy NC shirts so they aren't necessarily going to run out and buy a new one when they already have 10 in their closet.  Michigan fans, on the contrary had only tattered, worn out old 1997 NC gear so when their team won* in 2023 their merchandising would have gone through the roof.  Ill gotten gains such as that shouldn't accrue to a program that achieved those gains by cheating as Michigan did.  This money to be distributed to the schools that were in the league when the cheating scheme was operational since they were most directly damaged by the cheating scheme.  
  • A 10-year probationary period during which any violations trigger a stiffer than normal response.  The Michigan football program under Harbaugh operated flagrantly outside of the rules and the institution has demonstrated that they support that and will not independently take action to rein in such malfeasance to protect their institutional reputation so this is to step in and handle that for them.  


As an example of #6:
Ohio State has won three NC's in my lifetime:
  • 2002
  • 2014
  • 2024
When they won the NC in 2002 it was the school's first in 34 years since 1968.  I have a TON of 2002 NC gear:  Shirts, ties, flags, a belt, you name it, I've got it.  When they won it in 2014 I still had plenty of 2002 gear that wasn't yet worn out so I have a couple shirts.  I haven't yet bought any 2024 NC gear.  For Michigan their 2023 championship* was their first in 26 years, that isn't quite as long as 1968-2002 but it is long enough that most fans don't have much 97 NC gear left over and a lot of the 97 NC gear that is left either doesn't fit anymore or is tattered and worn out.  Even league title shirts for M fans were pretty old prior to the cheating scheme.  Their last legitimate league title was in 2003.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #208 on: Today at 10:50:33 AM »
Minimum vacate every win for the 2 1/2 years it was going on. Perhaps even vacate the rest of that year and the NC as "fruit of the poisoned tree".

If you can't retroactively apply the 2 year show cause for Moore, suspend him for the next two years. No football activities allowed.

Maybe post-House, bar them from using any of the revenue sharing on football for 3 years (equal to the length off time this was going on).
I typed my post before reading yours but we are roughly on the same page.  

I made it three rather than 2-1/2 for two reasons:
  • Your "fruit of the poison tree" and
  • The cheating was going on far enough into 2023 that had they lost those early game(s) they wouldn't have won the league and they wouldn't have sniffed the NC.  M fans will claim that they would have won anyway and they probably would have but we don't KNOW that.  We don't KNOW and the cheater doesn't get the benefit of the doubt because they are the one would made it a question.  

You were harsher with Moore than I was.  I was just going to suspend him from league games not all "football activities".  

Interesting fine concept.  

Cincydawg

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Re: Ridiculously lenient slap on wrist for cheaters
« Reply #209 on: Today at 10:51:32 AM »
I had not thought about sales of swag.  I'm sure you are correct.

 

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