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Topic: Probable Playoff Teams

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rolltidefan

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #84 on: November 25, 2019, 02:52:57 PM »
Errr, meant to write 4 in 5 but was rushing
those were dark times. gotta protect the few good things from those dark ages. we also started out #3 the next year. not sure what happened after that, i think they cancelled the season or something.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #85 on: November 25, 2019, 05:42:42 PM »
Clemson is NOT a helmet school.
No, it’s not, in the way we mean it.  But in terms of playoff committee what-have-you-done-lately? Clemson is most definitely getting the helmet treatment. 

That’s why Minny and Baylor can do whatever they want, but they’re not in the playoff.  Neither is an overall helmet or recent helmet status.  Both needed an undefeated season and neither had one.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

utee94

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #86 on: November 25, 2019, 06:00:01 PM »
Yeah I think for now, Clemson is definitely a semi-helmet.  They'll receive the BOTD over non-helmets.

But they'd also get cast aside in a hypothetical where it came down to a choice between them, or say, Notre Dame.  Which is obviously not the case THIS year.

Cincydawg

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #87 on: November 25, 2019, 06:44:18 PM »
A major part of helmitosity is "What have you done lately?", as opposed to how many wins you had before 1968.  A team like USC is not going to get as much of a break today in the eye test as will Clemson.  If say Washington State suddenly started reeling off 10 win seasons and made the playoffs 3 times in 5 years, they'd get that benefit as well.  Clemson is an easy pick to be ranked these days, Number One etc., easy.  That is the core of the benefit of helmetosity, how you get ranked preseason and whether it's boosted because you have been there year after year of late, not whatever you did in 1981.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #88 on: November 25, 2019, 06:56:10 PM »
But it's more than that - take that team you're describing and put them up against the team that's been good lately AND was good back in the day....THAT'S helmetocity.




An undefeated Clemson, as the defending NC would get the nod over an undefeated ND in 2019, IMO.  Helmet status matters, but it can't negate a great discrepancy in preseason ranking.




The Baylors and Minnesotas of the world aren't just in an uphill climb vs their own schedule, but against the other teams in their band in a given season - teams like Alabama, Georgia, and Oklahoma. 
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

FearlessF

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #89 on: November 25, 2019, 08:43:43 PM »
That’s why Minny and Baylor can do whatever they want, but they’re not in the playoff.  Neither is an overall helmet or recent helmet status.  Both needed an undefeated season and neither had one.
If the Gophers row the boat and win out over Wisconsin and Ohio State I would certainly hope they would be in the playoff over Bama
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #90 on: November 25, 2019, 08:51:31 PM »
But it's more than that - take that team you're describing and put them up against the team that's been good lately AND was good back in the day....THAT'S helmetocity.




An undefeated Clemson, as the defending NC would get the nod over an undefeated ND in 2019, IMO.  Helmet status matters, but it can't negate a great discrepancy in preseason ranking.




The Baylors and Minnesotas of the world aren't just in an uphill climb vs their own schedule, but against the other teams in their band in a given season - teams like Alabama, Georgia, and Oklahoma. 


It's a bad hypothetical because an undefeated Clemson and an undefeated Notre Dame are BOTH getting into the CFP.

Take it to 1 loss though, and I don't agree.  Notre Dame is a helmet that turns on TV sets across the entire nation.  A 1-loss Clemson in a highly questionable ACC has lots its luster immediately.  Notre Dame gets the nod on that one.

THAT is helmetosity.

FearlessF

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #91 on: November 25, 2019, 08:57:52 PM »
besides, Notre Dame's schedule would be more impressive
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #92 on: November 25, 2019, 09:54:28 PM »

It's a bad hypothetical because an undefeated Clemson and an undefeated Notre Dame are BOTH getting into the CFP.

Take it to 1 loss though, and I don't agree.  Notre Dame is a helmet that turns on TV sets across the entire nation.  A 1-loss Clemson in a highly questionable ACC has lots its luster immediately.  Notre Dame gets the nod on that one.

THAT is helmetosity.
So if Clemson started out top 5 and ND started out 12th, you still believe this?  I don't.  If there's one thing that motivates voters more than helmetocity, it's laziness and the incumbent good team will get the nod.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #93 on: November 25, 2019, 09:54:53 PM »
besides, Notre Dame's schedule would be more impressive
Right, but the hypothetical is if SOS is nearly even (unstated).
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #94 on: November 25, 2019, 09:55:06 PM »
If the Gophers row the boat and win out over Wisconsin and Ohio State I would certainly hope they would be in the playoff over Bama
Hope isn't a strategy.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #95 on: November 25, 2019, 11:07:34 PM »
Hope isn't a strategy.
I'll go one further, I think Minnesota at 12-1 would go ahead of Bama at 11-1.

utee94

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #96 on: November 25, 2019, 11:11:43 PM »
So if Clemson started out top 5 and ND started out 12th, you still believe this?  I don't.  If there's one thing that motivates voters more than helmetocity, it's laziness and the incumbent good team will get the nod.
I'm not talking about voters.  I'm talking about ESPN's Selection Committee. And yes, I definitely believe they'd move Notre Dame up above a 1-loss Clemson.  If there's one thing that motivates ESPN more than laziness, it's money.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Probable Playoff Teams
« Reply #97 on: November 25, 2019, 11:42:21 PM »
I'll go one further, I think Minnesota at 12-1 would go ahead of Bama at 11-1.
Have you been in a coma the past 10 years?  The committee members haven't (fair or not).
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

 

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