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Topic: OT - Weird History

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medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1036 on: September 01, 2022, 11:50:07 AM »
The 5" 38 caliber DP gun was also effectively against lesser armored ships, and was used with some effect at the "Battle of the Tin Can Sailors".  At one point they got under the ability of the Japanese main guns to depress and fired at the battleship/cruiser bridge areas.
If you haven't already read it, Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors is a great read about Taffy 3's suicidal charge against a massive flotilla of Japanese heavy units including the 18" gunned world's largest Battleship.

The bravery of those guys to go charging TOWARD an obviously vastly superior enemy is amazing. Their sacrifice, however, was not in vain. It helped to convince the Japanese that the ships they were facing HAD to be the Cruisers and Carriers of the main American fleet. Consequently, Admiral Kurita withdrew thinking that the complicated Japanese plan had failed.

In fact their plan had worked to perfection for once. The sacrifice of the remaining Japanese carriers as bait had drawn off Halsey and his fleet leaving Kurita facing nothing but Destroyers and Escort Carriers. Strategically he could and should have brushed them aside and proceeded to inflict grevious casualties on the Americans by sinking the unarmored transports and support ships that were just beyond Taffy 3.

Interestingly, two of the American Destroyers lost in that action have recently been discovered and they are the two deepest shipwrecks ever located.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1037 on: September 01, 2022, 11:50:20 AM »
Interesting.  I recall the USS Arkansas was outfitted only with 5" guns as a training platform.  Something like an Alaska without the 12" ers and more 5"ers ...


Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1038 on: September 01, 2022, 11:51:29 AM »
I have the book about 5 feet from me in my office (along with a few others).


medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1039 on: September 01, 2022, 11:57:01 AM »
I have the book about 5 feet from me in my office (along with a few others).
Different battle, but I also highly recommend Shattered Sword. 

FearlessF

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1040 on: September 01, 2022, 01:01:07 PM »
Our First Look At An AC-130J Ghostrider Gunship's New 105mm Gun


Photos from a recent event at Cannon Air Force Base, New Mexico, provide our first look at a U.S. Air Force AC-130J Ghostrider gunship equipped with an upgraded 105mm howitzer. This follows an announcement from the U.S. Navy earlier this year that it had delivered at least one prototype of a gun that is intended to replace the existing, aging M102 howitzers that have been used on various AC-130 gunship variants for decades now.

The new howitzer was seen installed on an Air Force AC-130J belonging to the 17th Special Operations Squadron during an "honorary commander flight event" for prominent members of the community from the nearby city of Clovis, New Mexico, held on August 24, 2022. Pictures from the ground tour and flight demonstration show these 'honorary commanders' standing next to the rear rear-left side of the aircraft’s fuselage, as well as inside, with the new gun clearly visible.

City of Clovis honorary commanders receive a tour and safety brief on a U.S. Air Force 17th Special Operations Squadron AC-130J Ghostrider gunship during an honorary commander flight event on Aug. 24, 2022, at Cannon Air Force base, New Mexico. The flight enabled community civic leaders and business owners a first-hand understanding about how 17 SOS Airmen specialize in their jobs and why regular combat proficiency training benefits Air Force special operations around the globe. (U.S. Air Force photo by Staff Sgt. Peter Reft) (This photo has been manipulated for operational security)

City of Clovis 'honorary commanders' receive a tour and safety brief on a U.S. Air Force 17th Special Operations Squadron AC-130J Ghostrider gunship during an honorary commander flight event on Aug. 24, 2022, at Cannon Air Force Base, New Mexico. The new 105mm howitzer is seen sticking out of the rear left side of the fuselage. USAF

It remains unclear how much, if anything, the Navy's 105mm howitzer shares with the original M102. The Naval Surface Warfare Center Dahlgren Division previously described the weapon as being "upgraded," rather than entirely new. The replacement design has also been referred to generically as a Gun Aircraft Unit (GAU), but its full designation is unknown.

An AC-130J Ghostrider gunship assigned to the 17th Special Operation Squadron fitted with a new 105mm howitzer, with insets showing a close-up of the howitzer and prototype of the design. title=An AC-130J Ghostrider gunship assigned to the 17th Special Operation Squadron fitted with a new 105mm howitzer, with insets showing a close-up of the howitzer and prototype of the design.
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1041 on: September 01, 2022, 02:01:19 PM »
Good God, the engineering that went into figuring out how to absorb the recoil from that large of a cannon without weakening the airframe had to be incredible. 

On top of that, the gun appears to be mounted transversely and in a turret capable of rotation which means they have to absorb recoil in different directions relative to the airframe. That is a lot tougher than something like the cannon on the A10 because the A10's cannon is both straight on (right through the nose) and fixed. 

FearlessF

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1042 on: September 01, 2022, 02:04:45 PM »
the motivation to kill people is strong
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

NorthernOhioBuckeye

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1043 on: September 01, 2022, 02:18:50 PM »
the motivation to kill people is strong
I would suggest that the motivation to support special operations troops is strong. 

utee94

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1044 on: September 01, 2022, 03:13:01 PM »
Battleship Texas now lifted up for dry docking.



medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1045 on: September 01, 2022, 03:53:33 PM »
Battleship Texas now lifted up for dry docking.
[img width=273.429 height=450]https://i.imgur.com/qkkA9no.png[/img]
I've been following this saga for a while via the USS New Jersey's YouTube page. I hope they can keep the Texas available as a museum.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1046 on: September 01, 2022, 04:01:34 PM »
I've been on the NC and Alabama.
Have you visited any of the Iowa's?

I randomly ran into @Roaddawg on the New Jersey before Ohio State's first game at Rutgers. Unbeknownst to each other we both had the same plan to see the Battleship on our way to the game. It is in New Jersey, across the river from Philly.

Iowa is in LA so maybe  Roaddawg and I can see it when Ohio State plays a B1G game at the RoseBowl or Coliseum in a few years.

Missouri is in Hawaii, overlooking the Arizona which is some pretty strong symbolism. 

Wisconsin is in Norfolk, VA.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1047 on: September 01, 2022, 04:16:46 PM »
I've seen the Missouri, but we didn't board it.  From afar it looks like a North Carolina or South Dakota class of course, nose on it looks thinner (but isn't).  The Iowa class were excellent ships of course, fast, reasonably well armored, and with the newer 16" 50 caliber main guns that outranged those of the two earlier classes.

I've done the Arizona twice.

The Alaska's were fine ships also, good seakeeping qualities, just no obvious mission.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1048 on: September 01, 2022, 04:43:54 PM »
The Alaska's were fine ships also, good seakeeping qualities, just no obvious mission.
Well they had a mission when they were designed and I think they'd have been great at it but by the time they were built there weren't any enemy cruisers left to kill so they ended up being  ludicrously expensive carrier escorts. The saying was that they had the capabilities of a Cruiser for the size and cost of a Battleship. 

Cincydawg

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Re: OT - Weird History
« Reply #1049 on: September 01, 2022, 04:44:21 PM »
On the afternoon of August 31, 1983, Korea Airlines flight 007 departed Anchorage, Alaska, where it had stopped to refuel, bound for Seoul. There were 269 passengers and crew aboard the Boeing 747, from 16 countries. One of the 62 American citizens on the flight was Georgia Congressman Larry McDonald. Twenty-two of the passengers were children under the age of 12.
Shortly after takeoff the flight crew turned on the aircraft’s autopilot system. Either because of a mechanical malfunction or because of pilot error, the autopilot system was engaged in the incorrect mode, allowing the plane to drift north of its scheduled flight path. The navigational deviation went undetected by the flight crew and about three hours later, rather than flying 60 miles east of the Soviet Kamchatka Peninsula, the aircraft flew directly across it.
Cold War tensions were elevated at the time and when Soviet air defense radar detected an aircraft flying from the east and about to violate their airspace, they believed it to likely be a U.S. spy plane. The Soviets scrambled MIG fighters to intercept the plane, but by the time the fighters reached the scene it was back over international waters. The MIGs carried insufficient fuel to enable them to pursue the plane, a precaution Soviet authorities took to prevent pilots from being able to defect.
Seeing that the aircraft was on a course that would take it over Soviet Sakhalin Island, the general commanding the Soviet air defense in the area was determined not to permit it to escape again. Three SU-15 fighters were scrambled with orders to shoot down the intruding plane.
In the black of night visual identification of the target aircraft was difficult. But the lead SU-15 pilot Major Gennadiy Osipovich would later say that he saw the airplane’s blinking lights, and its two rows of windows lit from inside. Osipovich said he fired warning shots, but because he had no tracer shells, in the dark of the night his shots would not have been visible to the KAL flight crew (there is no evidence that they saw or heard them). Osipovich recognized his target as a Boeing civilian aircraft, but said he assumed it was being used for military purposes. His orders were to shoot the plane down. So, he fired two missiles, both of which exploded near the rear of the KAL aircraft, severely damaging it.
The explosions caused the aircraft cabin to decompress, but all passengers and crew are believed to have survived the blasts and to have been able to put on their oxygen masks, as the KAL pilots took control of the aircraft and fought to keep it in the air. Twelve minutes later, the plane crashed into the Sea of Japan. All 269 passengers and crew, who are believed to have been conscious the entire time, were killed instantly.
As soon as the horrible reality of the tragedy became evident, the Soviets began spinning a web of lies. They claimed the KAL aircraft was flying with its lights out (it wasn’t), that their fighters had fired tracer warning shots (they hadn’t), that their fighters had made radio contact with the KAL flight (no radio contact was attempted), and that their instructions had been disobeyed (no such instructions were given). Soviet divers recovered the airplane’s “black box” recorders, but for eight years the Soviets denied having them.
Meanwhile, of course, the incident enflamed already tense U.S-Soviet relations. U.S. President Ronald Reagan called the shootdown a “massacre,” and “inhuman brutality.” The Soviets responded that the KAL flight was in fact a CIA spy mission, and they refused to accept any blame or responsibility for the tragedy. Only after the fall of the Soviet Union did Russian authorities acknowledge their mistakes and the subsequent coverup.
The tragedy is now known to have been caused by a KAL navigational error and by the Soviet failure to identify the aircraft before shooting it down.
On September 1, 1983, thirty-nine years ago today, Korea Airlines Flight 007 was shot down by a Soviet fighter plane, killing all 269 passengers and crew.


 

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