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Topic: Is Urby In Trouble Here?

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MaximumSam

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1120 on: August 30, 2018, 01:19:45 PM »
I thought the bigger conversation this week wasn't this story but all the outlets and "open records request" lawyers acknowledging that deleting those text messages is definitely illegal and begs for police investigation but that won't realistically happen to Meyer in Ohio.
Haven't seen that.  It could arguably violate Ohio's open records law but not sure it could arise to a criminal matter.

SuperMario

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1121 on: August 30, 2018, 01:28:38 PM »
You didn’t.  You said that in this aspect it does have bearing.  But to this point you have ignored the fact that the police never had enough reason to make an arrest for DV.
Again, show me where I said that? For someone that claims everyone else is selectively paying attention to things that fit the narrative, you certainly like to put words in someone's mouth to meet your narrative. 
Secondly, the police never stated they didn't have enough reason to make the arrest. They did say they had enough evidence to turn it over to the county prosecutor. 

You honestly think there's no abuse here? Police issue in 2009? Again in 2015. Incident report from 2015 outlines abuse in 2014. Dude is having sex in the office, take d*ck pics in the white house. Ordering sex toys to his place of employment. This is a person you think is above abuse of his wife while there's so many things that point to major character flaws? I'll happily agree there's not concrete evidence saying he did, but there's a lot of smoke around him.

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1122 on: August 30, 2018, 01:52:08 PM »
Again, show me where I said that? For someone that claims everyone else is selectively paying attention to things that fit the narrative, you certainly like to put words in someone's mouth to meet your narrative.
Secondly, the police never stated they didn't have enough reason to make the arrest. They did say they had enough evidence to turn it over to the county prosecutor.

You honestly think there's no abuse here? Police issue in 2009? Again in 2015. Incident report from 2015 outlines abuse in 2014. Dude is having sex in the office, take d*ck pics in the white house. Ordering sex toys to his place of employment. This is a person you think is above abuse of his wife while there's so many things that point to major character flaws? I'll happily agree there's not concrete evidence saying he did, but there's a lot of smoke around him.
The smoke around him being a flaming idiot is overwhelming, factually not debatable and continues to billow, since he continues to act like an idiot.  
There is plenty of evidence-TO ME- that the DV claims are very much in question. 
Virtually everyone who has chimed in that might have inside info ( and there is NO Person that does not have some bias) does not point to clearcut DV.  Rather- a lot of he said- she said, lack of clarity and general realization that this couple was toxic.  
Gene Smiths attorney, the two moms, the notes the compliance officer scribbled, Meyers comments on that clip you posted- it all points to the fact that OSU did not feel strongly enough about the DV allegations to take further action in 15 or anytime after.   
The narrative that started , and lives, is just the opposite. And the facts do not support that narrative as much as they disprove it. 
The facts do support that OSU and Meyer gave ZS way too much lenioand too many second chances around his overall behavior, and he had a conversation with his head of operations about eliminating texts on his phone that were over a year old.  
Worthy of termination or suspension?  Eye of the beholder.   But DV was not tolerated or covered up and in fact not even certain to have happened.  
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

Anonymous Coward

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1123 on: August 30, 2018, 02:23:49 PM »
Haven't seen that.  It could arguably violate Ohio's open records law but not sure it could arise to a criminal matter.
I'm on the wrong devise to copy/paste. Just google "Meyer phone delete illegal." They all came out in a 24-hour period 3-4 days ago. USAtoday had one. Ohio outlets had the others.

Anonymous Coward

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1124 on: August 30, 2018, 02:25:20 PM »
Sounds like one of the OSU Trustees is retiring specifically because he thought that the proceedings against Meyer were a sham:

NY timeshttps://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/30/sports/ohio-state-trustee-resigns-urban-meyer.html?smtyp=cur&smid=tw-nytsports
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/30/sports/ohio-state-trustee-resigns-urban-meyer.html?smtyp=cur&smid=tw-nytsports


“I didn’t feel that I’d seen high-integrity behavior,” Mr. Wadsworth said of Mr. Meyer.
"You read the report,” Mr. Wadsworth said, “and there’s seven or eight things about emails, memory loss, hearing things five times, and to me, that raised an issue of standards, values — not how many games someone should be suspended for.”

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1125 on: August 30, 2018, 04:24:52 PM »
he sounds confused. Often the case on larger Boards- there is always a few. I see it in real life.
Good attempt on your part to further your spin.

Here is some anti spin by a person actually involved in the investigation:

“The biggest problem in this OSU matter is the rush to judgment and the erroneous reporting of details by some irresponsible media and the amateur reporting of false information on social media," he wrote. "So, as a lawyer deeply involved in the investigation on behalf of Gene Smith, I am compelled to simply state the facts. The investigation was commenced to determine two issues: Did OSU cover-up domestic violence, and did Urban (Meyer) lie to the media in furtherance of a cover-up.
“After an exhaustive investigation that involved 40 witness interviews and thousands of documents, the investigators who were searching for information to enable them to answer, ‘Yes,’ answered them both ‘NO.’ But to justify a $500K investigation you have to find something. The fact established that Gene Smith learned of the 2015 allegations (regarding Zach Smith) and immediately pulled Urban off the practice field to inform him, and ordered the assistant (Smith) back to Columbus, not to Ohio State, but to go directly to the Powell police to answer their questions. He then discussed the matter with the Title IX Compliance Official and Public Safety Liaison and Human Resources, and he ordered OSU police OSU officials to monitor the Powell investigation. No OSU official can interfere in a criminal investigation or take steps to make it appear they are influencing an investigation. Powell (police) concluded there was no evidence to support the allegations (made by Zach Smith’s ex-wife, Courtney), and we now know this person (Courtney) made false reports on other occasions.
“But the investigation had to find something, so they said Gene and Urban should have reported it to Compliance. Really? Compliance handles NCAA matters, not domestic violence. And try as the might, investigators could not find any evidence that Urban lied to anyone. They concede that Urban was confused by the question he thought he was being asked (at Big Ten media days) and thought he was being asked the same thing as the day before when someone suggested that Zach Smith had been ‘arrested’ for domestic violence, which to this day has never occurred. Despite digging deep, the investigators concluded Urban misspoke and did not lie to anyone.


So, why the sanction? Well, isn’t it obvious? The country was lathered into a frenzy based on erroneous information and a long delay, and OSU needed to appease the lynch mob that had formed as soon as the unproven allegations were made. As a result, two great men fell on the sword."




Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

SuperMario

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1126 on: August 30, 2018, 04:34:28 PM »
Good call. The lawyer for Gene Smith would never spin this one way over another.

For the record, I don't think anyone on this board has stated OSU covered up for abuse. More accurately, some believe that there was domestic abuse happening in the Smith home. 

Anonymous Coward

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1127 on: August 30, 2018, 04:38:56 PM »
Spin?
It's widely agreed (nationwide as well as within your fan base) that Urban did sketchy things here. The question has always been which punishment is fitting. I'm ok with the suspension, but I think the argument should have been "suspension or fired?" not "suspension or walk?"

  • The investigation revealed direct evidence of a conspiracy to destroy evidence
  • It also revealed that he did not report up. Instead his boss reported down and they weighed it together for months without involving Compliance
And yeah the forgetfulness looks bad but I'll agree that's just empty drama that can't be proven either way. Still: The top two alone are enough to be disappointed if the board primarily wished to reinstate with a punishment of time served.
Meanwhile, didn't you also agree the next day that time served would have been a mistake?
« Last Edit: August 30, 2018, 04:40:29 PM by Anonymous Coward »

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1128 on: August 30, 2018, 04:39:54 PM »
Good call. The lawyer for Gene Smith would never spin this one way over another.

For the record, I don't think anyone on this board has stated OSU covered up for abuse. More accurately, some believe that there was domestic abuse happening in the Smith home.
Courtney would never spin it would she?   Paul Finebaum wouldn't spin it would he?   you see where I am going here.....
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

SuperMario

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1129 on: August 30, 2018, 05:21:29 PM »
Courtney would never spin it would she?   Paul Finebaum wouldn't spin it would he?   you see where I am going here.....
On multiple occasions in this conversation I've had an open mind to other possibilities. If it's in negative light towards OSU or any of their staff, the same cannot be said about your opinion.
Sure Courtney could spin and the same could be said for so many people.. BUT, you're basically saying, your opinions and statements are BS and not based on fact and here's how I know.. someone with complete knowledge is backing my opinion.... except that person has a singular vested interest in defending the party your opinion aligns with.  It's been hypocritical at best.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2018, 05:24:28 PM by SuperMario »

Hawkinole

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1130 on: August 30, 2018, 05:36:23 PM »
I can't keep up with all the nuanced arguments that have been made.

These domestic cases are difficult to ferret out.  Even cases with injuries sometimes involve issues of who was the primary physical aggressor, was there the use of reasonable force in self-defense. How does a coach who is not a witness to the acts, and not an investigator for law enforcement, sort that out when law enforcement concluded there was no probable cause to believe a crime was committed?

Then the sex toys are ordered to the office. There are allegations of infidelity. The assistant coach does indeed have issues. He was let go, as he should have been. Then as later information surfaces, photos of genitalia in the White House of all places, the assistant loses much credibility. But going back historically, I would guess both marital partners were doing a  good job trying to keep this out of the media to protect a high paying job. I didn't read the reports.  I wasn't clear what happened between the assistant and his wife through that extremely weird, and not very revealing, press conference. 

I am not saying much, except I am in the dark about the whole thing, and these types of cases tend to have ample ambiguity. I have been in enough of these cases as an attorney to know that women abuse men, too, and can start fights, as well. And these can be very hard cases for prosecutors to win.

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1131 on: August 30, 2018, 05:38:37 PM »
On multiple occasions in this conversation I've had an open mind to other possibilities. If it's in negative light towards OSU or any of their staff, the same cannot be said about your opinion.
Sure Courtney could spin and the same could be said for so many people.. BUT, you're basically saying, your opinions and statements are BS and not based on fact and here's how I know.. someone with complete knowledge is backing my opinion.... except that person has a singular vested interest in defending the party your opinion aligns with.  It's been hypocritical at best.
That’s simply not true.  I have repeatedly that Meyer scored up, and could have been fired.  
All I am adding to that is the DV allegations have little to do with it- because it is extremely difficult for us/ and it was extremely difficult for OSU to really know for sure what was real there. 
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

847badgerfan

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1132 on: August 30, 2018, 05:49:50 PM »
I can't keep up with all the nuanced arguments that have been made.
Yeah, me too.
This is a slow drip.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

SuperMario

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Re: Is Urby In Trouble Here?
« Reply #1133 on: August 30, 2018, 05:55:44 PM »
Yeah, me too.
This is a slow drip.
We'll talk about football after tonight. Thank god for football. 

 

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