header pic

Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

The 'Old' CFN/Scout Crowd- Enjoy Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching 'takes' and discussing topics surrounding the game. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE site and to take part in our community- a community with you- the user, the fan, -and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean place to interact.


Author

Topic: In other news ...

 (Read 1013790 times)

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 25281
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30100 on: April 01, 2024, 10:38:53 AM »
what taxes are you avoiding when you borrow instead of living off your own money?
Any monies you withdraw from various accounts are taxed as income.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 25281
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30101 on: April 01, 2024, 10:40:14 AM »
I don't know that I'd say that... I think the chart is much more accurate putting them as "social insurance taxes" rather than corporate taxes. They're VERY different from a "corporate income tax". They're paid on behalf of the employee by the corporation, of course, but that's mostly an accounting trick to hide the actual cost of those programs from taxpayers. Since they only see the portion that shows up on their pay stub / W-2, they think those programs are half as costly as they truly are.

Now, the one area I would quibble with is that social insurance taxes, whether paid by the employee or employer, are basically just "income taxes", and there's limited value in separating them out from that. Because they are by definition 15.3% of an employee's income (up to a limit for SS, which is 12.4% of that, of course).

But for the purposes of the chart, I can understand why they're separating the two.
As the owner of a corporation, I find the table misleading.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

betarhoalphadelta

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 12224
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30102 on: April 01, 2024, 10:41:19 AM »
what taxes are you avoiding when you borrow instead of living off your own money?
Income taxes and/or capital gains taxes. This isn't "money" in a bank account. It's shares of stock. There are two ways for a billionaire business owner get "paid":

  • Take a multi-million dollar annual salary from the company you own. 
  • Sell some of your billions in stock holdings.

They avoid #1 because it incurs income taxes. They avoid #2 because it incurs capital gains. They do this by borrowing against their stock holdings, which funds their life without either. 


betarhoalphadelta

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 12224
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30103 on: April 01, 2024, 10:49:43 AM »
As the owner of a corporation, I find the table misleading.
As the owner of a corporation, you're smarter than this. I think you're just triggered because, as the owner of a corporation, you think the purpose of the chart is to show that corporate taxes are too low. 

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 71634
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30104 on: April 01, 2024, 10:59:07 AM »
Say I own $100 million in some stock.  I need say $2 million a year for my lifestyle.  I could sell stock and pay LT capital gains taxes on it which could be 30% if I reside in California.  OR, I could borrow, and pay 5% interest on it, per year.

Many owners of larger businesses who are "wealthy" prefer to retain their level of ownership of the business rather than selling it.  They can do this by borrowing, which avoids any income taxes.

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 25281
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30105 on: April 01, 2024, 11:01:20 AM »
As the owner of a corporation, you're smarter than this. I think you're just triggered because, as the owner of a corporation, you think the purpose of the chart is to show that corporate taxes are too low.
I do think that. 

If anything, show the corporate and individual contributions to social stuff separately. I'd be satisfied with that. 

It would be an eye-opener for those who don't understand that their employers are paying their fair share. So many people don't get this.


U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

betarhoalphadelta

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 12224
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30106 on: April 01, 2024, 11:21:15 AM »
I do think that.

If anything, show the corporate and individual contributions to social stuff separately. I'd be satisfied with that.

It would be an eye-opener for those who don't understand that their employers are paying their fair share. So many people don't get this.
Got it. We're aligned on that. 

FearlessF

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 37607
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30107 on: April 01, 2024, 11:22:51 AM »
many people don't want to get it

us against them mentality
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

betarhoalphadelta

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 12224
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30108 on: April 01, 2024, 11:27:53 AM »
many people don't want to get it

us against them mentality
Well, it's just the subtle subterfuge of government. 

They've set it up so that most people end up thinking each spring about how much they "got back" from the government that year. Never about how much they actually paid. They've turned tax filing into a HAPPY time of year.

This is the same. They think "they" pay 7.3% of their income for SS/Medicare and the employer portion (if they realizes it exists) is paid by "someone else"--when in reality if the government made the tax 15.6% entirely on the employee, it would just cause employees to demand higher wages to cover it. The total cost of an employee to their employer probably wouldn't change much after the market settled and adjusted to the change. 

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 25281
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30109 on: April 01, 2024, 11:37:27 AM »
Lots of people (many more than not) think corporations are evil.

Where would people work if there were no corporations?

Not everyone can suck off the government. There would no way to fund it.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

FearlessF

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 37607
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30110 on: April 01, 2024, 11:39:25 AM »
most don't think of corporations the size of Badger's as the EVIL corps

small corporations and small businesses aren't the evils
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 71634
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30111 on: April 01, 2024, 11:43:27 AM »
Hollywood is replete with stories about evil corporations and corporate types.  It creates the impression of course.

I was just reading a John Grisham book "The Appeal", the corporation in it is very evil, I actually got bored with it, it's just too predictable.  I think now he's mostly writing tripe with some social message, I have not liked his books of late.

FearlessF

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 37607
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30112 on: April 01, 2024, 11:45:27 AM »
well, there is some history of truth based on actual evil corporations
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

MrNubbz

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 17168
  • Liked:
Re: In other news ...
« Reply #30113 on: April 01, 2024, 11:47:19 AM »
Any monies you withdraw from various accounts are taxed as income.
ya I just got bent over for moving my own money around,didn't withdraw a cent.
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

 

Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.