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Topic: In other news ...

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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29848 on: March 27, 2024, 09:55:15 AM »
So what are Dems doing to limit legal immigration?

MaximumSam

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29849 on: March 27, 2024, 09:58:43 AM »
So what are Dems doing to limit legal immigration?
I don't know that they are actively preventing it, but they seem to be campaigning more on closing the border compared to much else

847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29850 on: March 27, 2024, 10:00:46 AM »
Governor Abbott would get it done.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29851 on: March 27, 2024, 10:01:51 AM »
I don't know that they are actively preventing it, but they seem to be campaigning more on closing the border compared to much else
If they are its only because they know the border situation will bite them in the ass come November
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29852 on: March 27, 2024, 10:02:29 AM »
I don't know that they are actively preventing it, but they seem to be campaigning more on closing the border compared to much else
OK, closing the border to legal immigration, is that their focus?

I think Biden is "campaigning" on the economy more than anything else, but I admit to not paying much attention.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29853 on: March 27, 2024, 10:05:25 AM »
Article: The “Trump Effect” on Legal Immigrati.. | migrationpolicy.org

I don't know if the above is entirely accurate.  COVID obviously was a large factor in limiting legal immigration.

The number of people receiving green cards, either through adjustments of status of immigrants already in the United States or through visa processing abroad, has remained remarkably steady for the past ten years (see Figure 1). There have been two exceptions: an uptick in FY 2016, occurring in a relatively unchanged policy landscape from previous years, and a sharp decline in FY 2020, in the midst of the coronavirus outbreak. While FY 2020 numbers cannot yet be definitively compared with past years, as full-year data on green cards issued within the United States has not yet been released, significant drops are already apparent. The number of green cards issued within the country in the first three quarters of FY 2020 (October 2019 through June 2020) dropped 25 percent compared with the same period in FY 2019. And the 62,000 issued in the third quarter of FY 2020, at the height of COVID-19 lockdowns, was less than half the 153,000 issued during the third quarter of FY 2019. As mentioned above, the number of green cards issued abroad in the full year dropped 45 percent. 



I can't think of any positions by Democrats that would reduce legal immigration.

MrNubbz

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29854 on: March 27, 2024, 10:08:47 AM »
So what are Dems doing to limit legal immigration?
I don't know that they are actively preventing it, but they seem to be campaigning more on closing the border compared to much else
They effing rolled out the red carpet, now they want help pulling the rug out,SMDH. Both sides of the political Isle need a meteor strike - the quicker the better. Hell I'll even settle for Krakatoa eruption or New Madrid quake :banghead:
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29855 on: March 27, 2024, 10:10:04 AM »
Bad News For Employers, Immigrants And H-1B Visas In Second Trump Term (forbes.com)

A second Donald Trump term would bring new restrictions on legal immigration that would affect employers and likely drive more work and tech talent out of the United States. Trump’s actions during his first term, his rhetoric during campaign rallies and statements by allies signal unwelcome news for companies that rely on foreign-born scientists and engineers to grow and innovate. With Donald Trump winning the Iowa Caucus and leading Joe Biden in some polls, employers may wish to include the prospect of a Trump presidency in their contingency plans.

I concur that Trump talks about limiting LEGAL immigration.  I don't think that is a broader Repubican party position (to the extent that is different from Trump).  And I don't think it's the position of any Democrat I know of.

I personally am "pro" legal immigration and think our current system needs a complete overhaul.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29856 on: March 27, 2024, 10:10:55 AM »
Talk of "closing the border", to me, is completely separate from limiting legal immigration.

GopherRock

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29857 on: March 27, 2024, 10:20:34 AM »


What specific actions did Trump take hostile to LEGAL immigration?  He did limit the visitation rights of folks from a few countries, but that isn't immigration.
He gutted the system that processed immigration.

Earlier this year, he instructed his lackeys in the House to spike the border deal.

And you are more likely to win $7 playing the Powerball than to come to the US legally. From the Cato Institute:

https://www.cato.org/policy-analysis/why-legal-immigration-nearly-impossible

Closing the border accomplishes nothing. 

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29858 on: March 27, 2024, 10:27:09 AM »
That Cato article seemed misleading to me.  Of course, a lot of folks WANT to come to the US, no doubt, and relatively few immigrate here legally.  That isn't a shock, nor is it something caused by Trump. The issue would be how many of those trying to become legal immigrants are thwarted, not those not trying but wishing.

It is entirely possible to immigrate here legally, it's just not that easy, it wasn't preTrump either.  The border deal spiked by Trump was not about legal immigration unless there was something in it I missed.

But, if we stipulate that Trump limited LEGAL immigration, I'm still wondering what Democrats want to do to limit it as well.

MaximumSam

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29859 on: March 27, 2024, 10:29:49 AM »
Talk of "closing the border", to me, is completely separate from limiting legal immigration.
I find them very related. I rather admired Obama's approach, which was to have policies with other countries, as well as proactively affirming "illegal" immigrants who arrived as children while also being pretty harsh to illegal immigrants who committed crimes. Trump's policy was "we're full." Biden's policy is...not locking up illegal immigrants in cages? I'm unsure to be honest.

In any event, neither party is making any case for expanding illegal immigration even in the face of labor shortages and inflation. Kind of nuts if you ask me, but I get that closing the border is the flavor of the month for politicians.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29860 on: March 27, 2024, 10:35:09 AM »
I wish our government was. Both parties are intent on reducing legal immigration and making us all poorer as a result
I don't blame you because the money on BOTH sides of the aisle tell you this all the time. They even buy studies that purport to "prove" it, but this is wildly untrue.

The welfare state and benefits like Social Security and Medicare make nearly any additions to the pool of recipients a net negative for us all economically.

Social Security and Medicare are substantially underwater. Ignore immigrants for a moment and just consider the economics of those programs for people born here:
  • Social Security charges 6.2% of your wages.
  • Medicare charges 1.45% of your wages.
  • If you are self-employed you pay double that.
  • If you work for someone else they pay the other half.
Thus, the total collected by the systems is 12.4% of earnings for Social Security and 2.9% of earnings for Medicare.

The two programs are theoretically separate but in practice they function together so, in total the Federal Government collects 15.3% of earned income for Social Security and Medicare.

As already mentioned both programs are massively underwater so that 15.3% is nowhere close to sufficient. This is despite the fact that each American pays it from their very first day flipping burgers at McDonald's in their teens until their very last day passing out carts at Wal-Mart in their old age (McDonald's and Wal-Mart are merely examples, the point is that Americans pay $1.53 of every $10 they earn from cradle to grave into SS/Medicare).


Since both systems are drowning in red ink we know that the average American isn't paying enough into the systems to cover their own costs.

Now back to immigrants:
Since we already know that the average American is a net drain in SS/Medicare, we also know that adding additional average Americans can only make those problems worse. You can't lose money on each person and make it up on volume, math doesn't work that way.

In theory we could benefit from high earning immigrants so long as their earnings are sufficient but there are additional problems spawned by immigration. The first is age. Even if SS/Medicare had some combination of higher rates or lower benefits such that the average American did pay for themselves, the numbers would still only work for immigrants who came here right at the start of their working lives. Anybody older than that couldn't possibly catch up without earnings way above average.

A prospective immigrant in their early 20's who has a job lined up with a six figure salary *MIGHT* pay for themselves but all other immigrants both legal AND illegal are a net drain on the economy. Anybody who tells you otherwise is either ignorant, lying, or a shill working for the Koch brothers or some similar person or entity.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #29861 on: March 27, 2024, 10:35:17 AM »
To me, "closing the border" (while a bit vague) means limiting illegal immigration, unrelated to legal immigration.  It means things like "build a wall" etc. and enforce border restrictions on crossings by ILLEGALS.

And I don't see Democrats nor "mainstream" Republicans wanting to reduce LEGAL immigration.  I agree Trump appears to want to reduce both.  

 

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