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Topic: In other news ...

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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27034 on: October 06, 2023, 10:32:05 AM »
Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on October 06, 2023, 10:26:42 AM
Hey, I get you. It's gotta be hard. You come from a state that treats corporations like the mafia... "Nice business ya got here... Shame if something were to, uhh, regulate it. With extreme prejudice."

And now you moved to Florida and you're so used to it that you can't imagine a state government actually respecting freedom.

Typical transplant behavior... Try to make the new place just like the place you fled. :57:
Where did I ever say I supported the actions of the Governor?

Because I do not.

What I support is government and corporations staying in their lane and out social affairs.

If the parents in Florida don't want their very young kids reading about sexual orientation, that's fine. It's a damn shame that the State had to take action to protect them in the first place. It's insanity at best.
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Mdot21

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27035 on: October 06, 2023, 10:33:10 AM »
Quote from: WhiskeyM on October 06, 2023, 09:46:27 AM
There are 1,900 special districts in Florida.  Yet DeSantis shut down only 1 of them, and it happened to be the 1 that spoke out about his legislation.
this is not exactly true. yes there are 1,800+ special districts in Florida- and I'd wager that the vast majority of those are cdd's (community development districts- aka master planned communities) - and absolutely none of them operate like Disney's Reedy Creek Improvement District- which has essentially allowed for nearly 60 years for a single corporation to be it's own fu*king county government in perpetuity. Disney has the right to seize land via eminent domain even if the land falls outside the district’s boundaries, it has the right to build a nuclear power plant, airport, create conservation areas, build its own public utilities- rights other special districts in the state do not have. And to make matters even more preposterous, Disney controls who sits on the five-member board that governs the district. This is the actual definition of fascism. When corporations = the state. Yet you actually have people cheering Disney on, thinking it's A-OK. Newsflash. It's not OK. #DeathtoDisney. 

There is a major push right now from state legislators in Florida to put every single special district in the state to a referendum. I'm cool with that. 
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Mdot21

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27036 on: October 06, 2023, 10:40:14 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on October 06, 2023, 04:46:47 AM
I'm with you on a lot of this, but the bolded part....no.  That's the worst idea possible.  You can trim the fat and reorganize without taping a bunch of dynamite to it and blowing it up.  Starting back at zero would be self-inflicted harm to the country.
You may be right. All I'm saying is, those government agencies didn't always exist. They are modern creations of the 20th century. They don't have to exist. We can easily get rid of them, start new ones with more tightly controlled constraints on power. Many government agencies have come and gone through the years. The IRS/FBI/CIA/NSA/Homeland Security, etc., etc., does not have a right to exist. They can be scrapped to the dust bin of history whenever. The US survived without them before, and would survive without them again. I think when things are as bad as they are- probably a better idea to just fire everyone, close them down, and restart from scratch. 
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27037 on: October 06, 2023, 10:48:12 AM »
Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on October 06, 2023, 10:29:48 AM
There are, of course, consequences for unpopular speech. An NFL owner might, like Dan Snyder, have so much public outcry that they have to sell their team. A governor or a mayor will probably get drilled in the next election. Bud Light saw a major drop in sales. If people don't like what Disney said, they can respond appropriately by boycotting Disney.

The idea of the First Amendment is that there shouldn't be *government* consequences/punishment for unpopular speech. I don't see any nuance we have to explore there.
 Nice concept. It only woks if it applies to both major tribes.  
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27038 on: October 06, 2023, 11:45:26 AM »

Quote from: Honestbuckeye on October 06, 2023, 10:48:12 AM
Nice concept. It only woks if it applies to both major tribes. 
Got an example of someone in your tribe being prosecuted for protected speech? 

(And no, the big orange thing in the room doesn't count--whether he is convicted for that or not will rest on whether his speech was "incitement", which is one of the very few exceptions that is not afforded protection.)
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WhiskeyM

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27039 on: October 06, 2023, 11:46:11 AM »
Quote from: 847badgerfan on October 05, 2023, 10:28:09 AM
We're talking about K-3 here, for God's sake. Let the kids be kids. They can worry about LGBTQRSTUVWXYZ stuff later, when they are capable of understanding it. Maybe 7-8 grade.

How about we be reasonable here. If they can raise the age for me (and probably you??), they can raise it for the next group. Yes??

I agree with your first point.  However, it leads us back to what I said earlier...this was never an issue to begin with.

No teachers or school districts were creating curriculum based on teaching this stuff to elementary kids.  It simply wasn't happening.
DeSantis passed this type of legislation to score points for his presidential run.

Btw, how do all our Florida people feel about DeSantis making and exemption to Florida law so that he would not have to resign as governor in order to run for president?  This was a law that stood for many years and he obviously did it for himself.

How do Floridians feel about DeSantis using millions  of tax payer money to fund his trips to Japan, Iowa, etc, etc?  The guy is a total hypocrite clown.

To your second point, at what point do we stop raising the age?  There has to be a line drawn somewhere, otherwise retirement will take place in the grave.
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27040 on: October 06, 2023, 11:48:26 AM »
I'm shocked a politician would publically "solve" a nonexistent problem for political points.
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bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27041 on: October 06, 2023, 12:11:21 PM »
Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on October 06, 2023, 10:29:48 AM

There are, of course, consequences for unpopular speech. An NFL owner might, like Dan Snyder, have so much public outcry that they have to sell their team. A governor or a mayor will probably get drilled in the next election. Bud Light saw a major drop in sales. If people don't like what Disney said, they can respond appropriately by boycotting Disney.

The idea of the First Amendment is that there shouldn't be *government* consequences/punishment for unpopular speech. I don't see any nuance we have to explore there.
It’s also worth noting, the speech is not just “unpopular” (at least with the powers that be). It was also speech that focused on redressing the government, which is considered some of the most protected.

I hope that in our heart of hearts, we can all say that it is a bad, bad thing when the consequences for speech against policy is punishment from the government. Even if the find that policy morally upstanding and right.
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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27042 on: October 06, 2023, 12:13:13 PM »
Quote from: WhiskeyM on October 06, 2023, 11:46:11 AM
I agree with your first point.  However, it leads us back to what I said earlier...this was never an issue to begin with.

No teachers or school districts were creating curriculum based on teaching this stuff to elementary kids.  It simply wasn't happening.
DeSantis passed this type of legislation to score points for his presidential run.

Btw, how do all our Florida people feel about DeSantis making and exemption to Florida law so that he would not have to resign as governor in order to run for president?  This was a law that stood for many years and he obviously did it for himself.

How do Floridians feel about DeSantis using millions  of tax payer money to fund his trips to Japan, Iowa, etc, etc?  The guy is a total hypocrite clown.

To your second point, at what point do we stop raising the age?  There has to be a line drawn somewhere, otherwise retirement will take place in the grave.
1. My brother back up North would beg to differ.

2. Pretty sure that's a crime. His campaign fund should be paying for anything not related to official Florida business.

3. It was raised 40 years ago, to 67, for people born after 1960. It's 2023. Raise it to 69, for people born after 2000.

When Social "Security" was enacted in 1935, life expectancy was 61 for men and 65 for women. Retirement in the grave, as you put it, since the age was 65 then.
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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27043 on: October 06, 2023, 12:14:30 PM »
Quote from: bayareabadger on October 06, 2023, 12:11:21 PM
I hope that in our heart of hearts, we can all say that it is a bad, bad thing when the consequences for speech against policy is punishment from the government. Even if the find that policy morally upstanding and right.

I'm sure we can do that here.

I'd hope "equality for all" comes into play too.
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bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27044 on: October 06, 2023, 12:49:43 PM »
Quote from: 847badgerfan on October 06, 2023, 12:14:30 PM
I'm sure we can do that here.

I'd hope "equality for all" comes into play too.
Oh yeah.

If someone says, “I will try to stop this liberal policy from going into effect” and is punished for doing so, that is some trash. 
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longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27045 on: October 06, 2023, 12:59:03 PM »
Quote from: bayareabadger on October 06, 2023, 12:49:43 PM
Oh yeah.

If someone says, “I will try to stop this liberal policy from going into effect” and is punished for doing so, that is some trash.
How about the woman in London arrested because she appeared to be preying outside an abortion clinic
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27046 on: October 06, 2023, 01:01:19 PM »
who was she preying on?
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GopherRock

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #27047 on: October 06, 2023, 01:04:19 PM »
Quote from: longhorn320 on October 06, 2023, 12:59:03 PM
How about the woman in London arrested because she appeared to be preying outside an abortion clinic
Depending on what that woman was doing, attempting to prey on someone in a vulnerable position is a bad idea at best and serious criminal charges at worst. 
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