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Topic: In other news ...

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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26894 on: October 01, 2023, 10:03:12 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on October 01, 2023, 10:00:39 AM
I respect you enough to not believe you're this naive. 

Warren Buffet exists. The Ricketts exist.

But you wouldn't really know it. There are plenty more examples.

Musk puts himself out there for sure - mostly as a weirdo.
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26895 on: October 01, 2023, 10:09:54 AM »
Quote from: 847badgerfan on October 01, 2023, 09:59:59 AM
Eisenhower warned "us", and "we" didn't listen.

The Military Industrial Complex is evil. Pure evil.
It's especially bad now because technological advances should allow us to pare down the bloated walrus of war while maintaining or improving its effectiveness.

Idk if it's because our presidential choices are old as shit, but we don't need any more tanks.  We don't need 750 bases in 80 countries.  We don't need to spend more than the next 10 countries.  It's embarrassing.
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26896 on: October 01, 2023, 10:11:17 AM »
Quote from: 847badgerfan on October 01, 2023, 10:03:12 AM
Warren Buffet exists. The Ricketts exist.

But you wouldn't really know it. There are plenty more examples.

Musk puts himself out there for sure - mostly as a weirdo.
There are those who want a spotlight and those who do not.  But their actions behind the scenes are the same.  Looking out for their best self-interests, taking measures to get the outcomes they want, and bending the law as much as possible to get it done.
That's how they got in the positions they are in.  
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26897 on: October 01, 2023, 10:12:30 AM »
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26898 on: October 01, 2023, 10:20:02 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on October 01, 2023, 10:09:54 AM
Idk if it's because our presidential choices are old as shit, but we don't need any more tanks.  We don't need 750 bases in 80 countries.  We don't need to spend more than the next 10 countries.  It's embarrassing.
The core of the problem, in my view, if the scope of our commitments overseas.  We need a lot of bases in order to project power and provide security for others.  If we reviewed those commitments, critically, and pared them down, we could cut military spending accordingly, but I think the one has to precede the other.  I'm not an advocate of isolationism, or even whatever Trumpism is (it seems to vary).  But I do think we could "pull in our horns" over time and let others do their own defending, maybe with some critical exceptions.  (I'm hesitant to pull out of NATO.)

At the extreme position, we'd pull back and defend just the US and its territories, and could do so a lot more cheaply.  
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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26899 on: October 01, 2023, 10:35:30 AM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on October 01, 2023, 10:20:02 AM
At the extreme position, we'd pull back and defend just the US and its territories, and could do so a lot more cheaply. 
That doesn't seem extreme at all.
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847badgerfan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26900 on: October 01, 2023, 10:39:13 AM »
Loss of income => less tax income.

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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26901 on: October 01, 2023, 10:40:14 AM »
It's extreme in the sense we couldn't do more.  I think today we're at the other extreme, or nearly so.  Overseas commitments require ability to project power which is VERY expensive.
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medinabuckeye1

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26902 on: October 01, 2023, 11:12:42 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on October 01, 2023, 09:43:27 AM
Think anything like that would have existed for 5 seconds if it largely targeted rich white people in a similar way?
If rich white people were killing each other at the same rate as the poor in Chicago this would be a relevant discussion but since they aren't, let's stick to reality. 
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medinabuckeye1

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26903 on: October 01, 2023, 11:23:13 AM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on October 01, 2023, 10:20:02 AM
At the extreme position, we'd pull back and defend just the US and its territories, and could do so a lot more cheaply.
It would be nice if we would defend our country but we aren't.

At the same time we are willing to defend Ukraine and a few dozen other countries.
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26904 on: October 01, 2023, 11:41:53 AM »
Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on October 01, 2023, 11:12:42 AM
If rich white people were killing each other at the same rate as the poor in Chicago this would be a relevant discussion but since they aren't, let's stick to reality.
It's not hard to relate it to rich white people.  Unannounced police raids of corporate financial books. Whenever they choose to.  Just kick the tires and look behind the curtains.  Make sure everything adds up.  Then they can go on about their way.  

Think they'd stand for that?
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26905 on: October 01, 2023, 11:47:11 AM »
750 bases in 80 countries.  
I bet there are countries that consider themselves allies or neutral to us that would like to see us pare that down.  If we had something like 10 big bases around the world, it would help us seem like we want to keep the peace as we suggest we do.

750 bases in 80 countries looks more like psychotic overkill and the need to be the world's daddy.  
We don't project power, we project complete dominance.  
Easy to be put off by that, if you're in Italy or India or Bolivia.  Even if you have no other problems with the U.S.

Both parties nitpick about spending, but idk why we all can't agree that the war machine needs downsizing.  I believe it would make everyone in the world happier and just let them breathe.
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“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26906 on: October 01, 2023, 01:28:39 PM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on October 01, 2023, 11:41:53 AM
It's not hard to relate it to rich white people.  Unannounced police raids of corporate financial books. Whenever they choose to.  Just kick the tires and look behind the curtains.  Make sure everything adds up.  Then they can go on about their way. 

Think they'd stand for that?
The "police" wouldn't have any clue about corporate books, which of course are audited routinely.  Large corporations really have no reason to cheat and the downside for them is draconian, and personal.  The CEO can go to jail.  He's not going to be interested in that risk to make another million or so for himself.  Do they have large internal financial folks looking for every legal option?  Of course.

Small companies?  I'd guess a lot of cooking going on there somewhat because they don't know better or think there is no way they'll get caught.  I'm convinced a couple restaurants near us are laundering money, they almost never have customers.
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GopherRock

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #26907 on: October 01, 2023, 02:57:03 PM »
Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on September 30, 2023, 09:12:47 PM
They don't call it "public assistance."

They call it "farm subsidies."
Welfare by any other name is still welfare.
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