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Topic: In other news ...

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longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24388 on: June 11, 2023, 11:00:52 PM »
Yeah, you're supposing parental participation. 

here in Texas if a parent refuses a parent teacher conference request it can be considered child abuse and authorities can be called by the school
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24389 on: June 12, 2023, 12:08:27 AM »
here in Texas if a parent refuses a parent teacher conference request it can be considered child abuse and authorities can be called by the school
That doesn't sound like respecting the parent all that much. 

bayareabadger

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24390 on: June 12, 2023, 12:15:00 AM »
again its not the job of the school to inform a child of things that the parent does not

the purpose of school is to teach properly approved lesson plans not to inform the student that there are more then two genders or if your white you are guilty of systemic racism


now I think Ive made this as clear as possible and if you feel differently so be it
I mean, schools often inform kids about lots of things parents don't: The Peloponnesian War, Calculus, Huck Finn. Not every parent is teaching kids such things. 

And schools will no doubt inform kids about some social issues. Now we're really arguing about which social issues. Schools all the time teach kids about what it means to be a boy or girl. This we've known for a long time. And shoot, schools for a long time taught kids that some white folks at some point were pretty dang racist. 

But we do agree, delving into the more advanced parts of gender theory and most things about systemic racism are not appropriate for K-12 in most cases. I think they're just too advanced. You think they're poppycock (and I'm skeptical of some of them, to be sure). So we feel similar in some ways, different in others. 

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24391 on: June 12, 2023, 12:24:16 AM »
here in Texas if a parent refuses a parent teacher conference request it can be considered child abuse and authorities can be called by the school
They'll react well to that, especially if'n they're wearing a holster.  Just more gubmit over-reach.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24392 on: June 12, 2023, 12:30:26 AM »
I mean, schools often inform kids about lots of things parents don't: The Peloponnesian War, Calculus, Huck Finn. Not every parent is teaching kids such things.

And schools will no doubt inform kids about some social issues. Now we're really arguing about which social issues. Schools all the time teach kids about what it means to be a boy or girl. This we've known for a long time. And shoot, schools for a long time taught kids that some white folks at some point were pretty dang racist.

But we do agree, delving into the more advanced parts of gender theory and most things about systemic racism are not appropriate for K-12 in most cases. I think they're just too advanced. You think they're poppycock (and I'm skeptical of some of them, to be sure). So we feel similar in some ways, different in others.
You're giving them too much credit. 
What this all comes down to is that the bible thumpers can't be having that sinful nature being explained by random people they can't vet.  Can't explain any of it without 'enough' fire n' brimstone to scare the childrens, in their eyes.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24393 on: June 12, 2023, 12:43:30 AM »
They'll react well to that, especially if'n they're wearing a holster.  Just more gubmit over-reach.
some times the Gov through its child welfair folks have to step in if the parent is abusing their children

They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24394 on: June 12, 2023, 12:49:46 AM »
You're giving them too much credit. 
What this all comes down to is that the bible thumpers can't be having that sinful nature being explained by random people they can't vet.  Can't explain any of it without 'enough' fire n' brimstone to scare the childrens, in their eyes.

so you are calling the parents bible thumpers

sorry but the tail does not wag the dog

the parents should have the final say in anything you do with their children
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24395 on: June 12, 2023, 12:56:26 AM »
You're sort of proving my point for me.

Religion wants (and gets) all these exceptions.
Parents want some sacred exception.
Why?
All you did is have sex.  You produced an offspring, like rats and bears and frogs.
s-l-o-w   c-l-a-p
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24396 on: June 12, 2023, 01:58:06 AM »
You're sort of proving my point for me.

Religion wants (and gets) all these exceptions.
Parents want some sacred exception.
Why?
All you did is have sex.  You produced an offspring, like rats and bears and frogs.
s-l-o-w  c-l-a-p
then you are exactly what the problem is

your job is to teach approved curriculum nothing else

the parents job is to raise the children and you dont take precedent over that

if you wanted to raise kids then you should adopt some of your own
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24397 on: June 12, 2023, 02:17:22 AM »
I don't want to.
I teach what I'm supposed to teach.
But you're living in a fairy tale if you think opinions aren't going to go back and forth in a classroom.
.
I challenge you with spending 6-7 hours speaking & listening with someone for 180 days and have none of the talk you seem fearful of occur.
You're delusional.
And I'm obviously not the problem.  I turn all questions and off-tangent topics (time provided) into mini-lessons discussing both sides and steel-manning them with no "right" conclusion.
.
Here's an example:  we were discussing different jobs/careers and utility/pay/happiness.  I had the gall to tell them that if they focused and did well in school, they'd get to choose the job they want.  If they didn't do well in school, they'd probably grow up to have a job they don't like.  How radical of me!  Such a left-winger!
HOW DARE I!  I'M THE PROBLEM! 

Good teachers don't solely stick to a script.  That's what you tell teachers you don't trust to do.  Good teachers take all of the UNAVOIDABLE tangents and turn them into beneficial lessons that get their students to THINK.  Not indoctrinating anyone, not going off the rails because they want to, but navigating real-life issues with information and trusting the students to make up their own minds.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24398 on: June 12, 2023, 07:05:11 AM »
I don't know what is commonly taught these days in primary schools about any of this.  I see some examples of stuff I'd consider not good, but they are possibly isolated examples, and possibly exaggerated for impact.

I guess fortunately my kids grew up before any of this was remotely a consideration or concern.

I recall getting a note from school when mine were seniors that they were studying Genesis, but for it's literary qualities, not as a religious text.  I was fine with that.  One kid had a professor at OSU who announced first day he was a Communist, my kid said he was a pretty good professor overall.

I don't recall having any inkling of whether my professors were lib or con, none, and I got to know a few of them pretty well to the point of playing ball with them or having dinner with them at their house etc.

Honestbuckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24399 on: June 12, 2023, 07:39:15 AM »
I don't want to.
I teach what I'm supposed to teach.
But you're living in a fairy tale if you think opinions aren't going to go back and forth in a classroom.
.
I challenge you with spending 6-7 hours speaking & listening with someone for 180 days and have none of the talk you seem fearful of occur.
You're delusional.
And I'm obviously not the problem.  I turn all questions and off-tangent topics (time provided) into mini-lessons discussing both sides and steel-manning them with no "right" conclusion.
.
Here's an example:  we were discussing different jobs/careers and utility/pay/happiness.  I had the gall to tell them that if they focused and did well in school, they'd get to choose the job they want.  If they didn't do well in school, they'd probably grow up to have a job they don't like.  How radical of me!  Such a left-winger!
HOW DARE I!  I'M THE PROBLEM! 

Good teachers don't solely stick to a script.  That's what you tell teachers you don't trust to do.  Good teachers take all of the UNAVOIDABLE tangents and turn them into beneficial lessons that get their students to THINK.  Not indoctrinating anyone, not going off the rails because they want to, but navigating real-life issues with information and trusting the students to make up their own minds.

Your self righteous, self inflated diatribe above is 100%missing the point.  ( as always)
Nobody said teachers don’t have influence outside of assigned curriculum
Nobody said parents ALL do a great job of talking to their kids about societal issues
Nobody here said teachers have to stick to a script
Your egotistical blather is just that.

Here is the question being posed- and it is being posed in hundreds of school districts and individual elementary schools across the country:

Should elementary school children be PROACTIVELY taught about transgender in the curriculum, with books and drag shows, when the parents of those children vehemently object to it?

That is the battle being waged. That’s it


your first position is that it’s not prevalent. But then you moved to your second position which is that this is “inevitable progress” and anyone who opposes it is standing in the way of society moving forward.

Again- to be clear- this is not about what might come up in school , or about teaching children to be inclusive- it’s about what children are being proactively taught. Should a school district or a teacher, provide a book and a lesson to a third grader which tells them they have a choice as to which gender they are, even though that child’s parents absolutely object to that?

you have made your position clear on that.  Polling shows the majority of parents in this country are in strong opposition to your opinion. Who gets to ultimately answer the question? The parents or the teachers unions and school districts?

Gender Dysphoria is a psychological disorder, which inflicts a small percentage of the population. Why should we teach people to have it just to make those who already have it feel better?


There are much better ways to go about teaching people to not discriminate. 

ultimately deep down, you know the correct answer and you illustrated it when you took the position that men should not be allowed to dominate women’s sports. It’s really the same question.

Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24400 on: June 12, 2023, 07:54:21 AM »
I know our school board was elected, so voters had some say in such matters.  I got to know a couple board members, they seemed pretty decent to me.  The HS principal seemed pretty decent, this is 20 years ago of course.  None of this was remotely a topic back then that I knew about.


Honestbuckeye

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #24401 on: June 12, 2023, 08:04:44 AM »
I know our school board was elected, so voters had some say in such matters.  I got to know a couple board members, they seemed pretty decent to me.  The HS principal seemed pretty decent, this is 20 years ago of course.  None of this was remotely a topic back then that I knew about.


Go back to page 1740 and see the examples I posted.  

AntiFro objects to my sources- but all I did was an internet search on this topic and that was the first 6 or 7 examples that came up.  It took me five minutes- I could have posted 100. None of them are opinion pieces- they are just factually reporting places where the school district or teachers union or local government is fighting parents who do not want their ELEMENTARY aged children being proactively taught about Transgender and or Drag.  
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

 

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